G4 crash

[FG Lurker]

I bought a Coolermaster Stacker case .

That thing LOOKS noizy!

It's actually not too bad. 3 drives, one of which is 10,000rpm, do make some noise though. The fans are very quiet.

36GB 10,000rpm Boot/Application drive
Two 200GB 7200rpm Data Drives (400GB)

I did not realize that you could have your boot/app drive so small!
Does that include your MyDocs folder?
How do you designate that to a different drive?

36GB is oodles of space for boot and apps.

You can designate your MyDocs folder to a different drive at install time, but only through the automated install process and a .SIF file. It's easier than it sounds and it totally automates the installation of Windows. Boot, watch for 30 seconds to make sure it starts the install, then walk away and do something else for 15 minutes (fast machine!) while it finishes.

[tatsujin]

Unfortunately, THIS has been my Mac experience.

Excellent post DJEB, I've never used Macs much, but I was always under the impression that they were fairly stable. Guess I was wrong

Unfortunately, THIS has been my Mac experience.

On the ball Lurker, 95 and ME have caused me more pain than I care to share, 2000 was a dream to support, XP, the jury is still out... Have you played with Longhorn yet?

[FG Lurker]

Unfortunately, THIS has been my Mac experience.

Excellent post DJEB, I've never used Macs much, but I was always under the impression that they were fairly stable. Guess I was wrong

OS X 10.2 and 10.3 are incredibly stable. OS X runs on top of Darwin, which is based on BSD, one of the most stable OSes available.

Unfortunately, THIS has been my Mac experience.

Hehe, I didn't say that.. ]On the ball Lurker, 95 and ME have caused me more pain than I care to share, 2000 was a dream to support, XP, the jury is still out... Have you played with Longhorn yet?[/quote]
95OSR2 and 98SE were the best 9x OSes. ME was the worst by a fair margin!!

XP runs as well as 2K, as long as it is running on newish hardware. 2K is much better on older machines, say Celeron 500s or something like that. I run XP on this machine and it is rock stable. Administration wise XP is nicer -- built in remote desktop support, that kind of thing.

I haven't played with Longhorn... I used to love playing around with beta stuff or the newest stuff... Now I just can't be bothered most of the time! Gettin' old I guess...

[DJEB]

I am comparatively tech ignorant and the only Apples I've had were an Apple IIe+ and some 1991 job. However, anytime a good friend of mine needs to do anything, his goddam Mac fubars it. The useless thing is actually incapable of viewing Apple Quicktime videos. The chances of me getting one of Apple's grossly overpriced machines to see if the new operating systems are anygood is remotely slim. But it's good to hear that others here have had a better experience.

[FG Lurker]

I am comparatively tech ignorant and the only Apples I've had were an Apple IIe+ and some 1991 job. However, anytime a good friend of mine needs to do anything, his goddam Mac fubars it. The useless thing is actually incapable of viewing Apple Quicktime videos. The chances of me getting one of Apple's grossly overpriced machines to see if the new operating systems are anygood is remotely slim. But it's good to hear that others here have had a better experience.

Poor guy! There are many Windows machines full of spyware and/or trojans though, and they don't work too well either.

OS X 10.2/10.3 and Win2K/XP are all good systems. For most users any of them will be perfect.

You're right though, a decent PC is a lot less expensive than a decent Mac.

[Skankster]

OS X 10.2/10.3 and Win2K/XP are all good systems. For most users any of them will be perfect.

You're right though, a decent PC is a lot less expensive than a decent Mac.

Not really. PC's have little or no resale value. MACs do.
I bought an ibook and sold it 1.5 years later for more than I bought it for (same I had invested in it).

MAC has always been more stable than Windows.
What that guy talks about in the video is that... the way the MAC crashes is different. He obviously knows PC's better than he does a MAC.
Most guys that are so PC profficient dont have much UNIX knowledge either. So a large part of his rant is exactly that. It is his POV (perspective is everything).
If you dont understand the innards of the OS your complaing about isnt that oxymoronic?

I like XP and I use it all the time.
But XP is at most a workstation.
It can do functions like a server but who wants server crap dragging down thier workstation???
I like *NIX as a server. But I would not have one in my house because I cannot use it as a workstation.
I would have a OSX in my house working as a server and as a workstation because it does both roles way better than any Windows OS (anything).

[FG Lurker]

OS X 10.2/10.3 and Win2K/XP are all good systems. For most users any of them will be perfect.

You're right though, a decent PC is a lot less expensive than a decent Mac.

Not really. PC's have little or no resale value. MACs do.
I bought an ibook and sold it 1.5 years later for more than I bought it for (same I had invested in it).

A decent PC notebook has good resale value too. PC Desktops can generally be upgraded if needed and therefore do not need to be replaced to stay semi-current on the technology curve.

MAC has always been more stable than Windows.

Excuse me while I bust a gut laughing for a minute...................................................................... .................................. Okay, back. I've used many different Mac OSes. I remember the big improvements when System 6 came out, and again with 7, 8, and 9. I am well acquainted with the stability (or lack thereof) of earlier Mac systems. Windows NT 3.51 and 4.0 were both far more stable than the Mac OS of the day. NT 4 and Win2K were both leaps and bounds beyond OS 9, and NT 4 came out years before OS 9 did.

I would have a OSX in my house working as a server and as a workstation because it does both roles way better than any Windows OS (anything).

OS X is a fine system that runs on very expensive Apple hardware. If not for the overpriced hardware I would probably run OS X too.

As to whether it is *better* than 2K or XP, I would say that it depends on what you need to accomplish. Both have strong points. Both have weak points.

[mr. sparkle]

Guys...guys!

This is a post about a guy with a Mac that needed his power manager reset. It was fixed easily and that was that.

OS9 is a pile of steaming dogshit that is only surpassed in stability problems by Windows ME or perhaps the very first version of Windows 95.

To go on and on about how OS9 suxx and which platform rules is so...so....1998. Get over it bro! Them days are waaaaay over!

Granted, I've been drinkin' the kool aid for a long time. I am from the place where they make macs and steve even signs my paycheck, so take my advice with a grain of salt....

People buy macs for a reason and those that spend a bit more for macs, like a Mickey D's burger, know exactly what they are getting. Modern macs are easy to operate and simple to maintain. OS X simply does not crash. Any horror stories you hear are mostly idiots that don't know anything about taking care of their Macs. Yes, you have to maintain computers...regardless if they are Mac or PC. DJEB, your friend sounds like he's running on less than a full tank, 'cause screwing up your mac is difficult. Hook him up with a Mac for Dummies book at the very least.

Certain professions prefer Mac vs. PC for very good reasons. Name one pro video app (besides Avid Media Composer/Symphony) that is favored by pro film or video editors running on PC or NT? Sorry, they don't exist. Most music pros also prefer macs. Conversely, you wouldn't even bother getting into 3D production without a phat PC. Maya's on a mac, sure...but most 3D and visFX heads have PCs or NT Workstations.

If you are doing office work, number crunching, NT database admin work, using Flame-Inferno compositors, playing DOOM (or one of its shoot 'em up clones--boooooring!), or are into bootlegging music/software (heresy!)--sure, go ahead and get your PC. Enjoy it. It's cheap and you can even swap out your motherboard or whatever. Nice. Have fun. I can add new drives, RAM and upgrade my processor in my Mac as well. When I need a new motherboard, it's probably time for a new mac. I can resell my older mac or keep it around as a gnarley little surf machine/jukebox or what have you. My BW G3 will run Panther--no problem!

I would never, ever have one to do my real work--video editing, motion graphics, music production and web design on a PC. Well, maybe I could do After Effects and Photoshop on PC, but I already have the keyboard shortcuts down in Mac. BTW, goldenboy--Photoshop CS runs on the mac, as does the rest of the Adobe creative suite. Besides...Adobe? Shmadoby! Apple will create and make better anything Adobe has to offer. Photoshop killer? Probably. Motion was a huge shot over the bough for After Effects.

I would wager that anyone that puts down macs has never even tried one. Haven't you ever heard of gear envy? "Since I am such a smart person, whatever I buy simply IS the best!" The whole cost issue is moot as well. If you want a mac, you spend the money. Sure, I wish they were cheaper, but if I need a mac, I need a mac and will spend what it takes so I can get my work done.

36GB is oodles of space for boot and apps.

Not for me. I have a 40GB drive in my TiBook and I'm constantly topping out in my Apps folder. I really need at least 60-80 GB. In fact, guess what? I'm going to upgrade my hardware, and yes, I can do that...just like a PC. Hmmm...how about that?

OS X is awesome and extremely stable and so are the apps that run on it. Apple's pro apps rule. The iLife suite has changed the landscape of consumer friendly software, as well. Can you burn a DVD of your home video as simply as using iMovie and iDVD? Can you knock out a simple musical arrangement as fast and easy as with GarageBand? I seriously doubt it.

Stop the gear envy BS. Face it, you would LOVE to have a mac at home--anyone would. Conversely, I would welcome a PC in my house (for rendering After Effects--smokin'!), sure--why not? See? I'm not a hater...

You're right though, a decent PC is a lot less expensive than a decent Mac.

OS X is a fine system that runs on very expensive Apple hardware. If not for the overpriced hardware I would probably run OS X too.

The rumored announcement of a sub $600 mac on Tuesday morning may change your mind regarding picking up an affordable mac system. If this is true, do yourself a favor and take the plunge. I guarantee that you will not be sorry.

Get an iLife!
Have a glass of Cupertino Kool-Aid!
Join Us!

[FG Lurker]

Guys...guys!

This is a post about a guy with a Mac that needed his power manager reset. It was fixed easily and that was that.

OS9 is a pile of steaming dogshit that is only surpassed in stability problems by Windows ME or perhaps the very first version of Windows 95.

To go on and on about how OS9 suxx and which platform rules is so...so....1998. Get over it bro! Them days are waaaaay over!

I think you missed the rest of my messages in this thread...

[DJEB]

DJEB, your friend sounds like he's running on less than a full tank, 'cause screwing up your mac is difficult. Hook him up with a Mac for Dummies book at the very least.

Thank you very much for insulting my friend. Not everyone's life is dull enough to become a tech geek.

[Charles]

Stop the gear envy BS. Face it, you would LOVE to have a mac at home--anyone would. Conversely, I would welcome a PC in my house (for rendering After Effects--smokin'!), sure--why not? See? I'm not a hater... :)

I hope you realize that AfterEffects was Adobe's attempt to stab Apple in the back, Adobe spent extra effort optimizing AE for PC platforms, and no effort optimizing it for PPC at all. That is why PeeCee lusers like to test PC vs. Mac with AE, because the playing field is slanted heavily towards the PeeCee with that app.
However, if you look at crossplatform apps written by people who really know how to optimize for both platforms, like Discreet Combustion, a top-end Mac will outperform any top-end PC.
Forget AE. Shake rules. Combustion isn't too bad either, but I just don't like its interface.

[DJEB]

Self test to see if you are lame:

Do you get all worked up over one corporation's product when it is compared to another corporation's product?

If the answer is yes, then click here.

[goldenboy_ge]

Wow, I just came back to see what's going on in this thread, and it's obviesly growing.

[cstaylor]

Since we're on the topic, as someone who has done kernel development work in OS X, I have to say that Apple has taken the time to make things work right.

For example, in Windows XP, plug a USB device from one port to another and watch it thrash about for a driver.

In Mac OS X, the driver is found immediately and loaded. Do users really need a separate driver loaded for each port?

I'm running Tiger beta on a 867Mhz G4 w/1GB RAM (I'm not pro like Mr. Sparkle, but I do get some use out of FCP HD), and it smokes.

[Captain Japan]

Though my problem seems a little different, I'm going to use this thread since it seems the machine is the same...

My iBook G4 started locking up randomly about two months ago. Then after a day or so it worked fine. That is, until a month ago - when it started doing it again. I didn't use it for 3 weeks because I was on a trip. But now that I am back it is back to locking up.

It's a year and a half old. I added a 512 RAM chip to give me about 1 gig of RAM total.

It doesn't matter which applications I have open. Generally it'll lock up at random. When I hit the power off button and restart usually it will try to start up again but will lock again as it boots (before showing the desktop). So I restart again and it will lock up again (maybe a little further along in the boot process but before showing the desktop). After maybe the fourth time I'll get the desktop and I'll be able to use it for maybe 10, 20, or 25 minutes before it freezes again.

I'd say in one lock up out of ten, the screen turns a shade of gray and a black box in the center of the screen appears and tells me (in 5 languages) to shut the machine off and turn it back on again.

A week ago I pulled out the RAM chip I installed (512 meg) and it worked like a charm for a week. Then when it returned to freezing I put the chip back in and it worked for a day or so. Now it is back to locking at random.

Oh, and sometimes when I restart and it can't reboot the whole screen lists rows of programming text with the final line reading something ominous like: "We are hanging on here. Panic" That has happened quite a few times. I've never panicked though.

Would reinstalling the OS help? I'm running OS X 10.3. Any tips on what I should do? Thanks for anything. I really don't want to take this sucker into a shop but it is looking like that is the only choice.

[FG Lurker]

I'm not a Mac guy, but what you describe sounds like hardware issues to me. If I had to guess, it sounds heat-related.

I'd take it into an Apple Store and ask the in-store support guys what they think. Chances are that they will have seen the same problem before.

[GuyJean]

Hhhmm.. Not sure.. I would try updating your software first.. In System Preferences, there's 'Software Update', or something like that. It'll search for any updates you might be missing; free updates.. Usually, the system OS..

If that doesn't help, take your laptop to Shibuya, grab a couple conbini beers. Drink them, then go to the Apple store. They should, at least, look at it for free..

If the Apple store can't help you, I'd initialize the hard drive and start over.. Saving everything important first, of course.. Then I'd have a few more beers as the system installs..

GJ

[Charles]

I recommend you find your OS X Installer CD and run the hardware diagnostics. On some older machines it came on a separate CD, but on more recent ones it is a separate partition on the same CD. Consult Apple.com and in the support section search for "AHT" or "Apple Hardware Test" for more information regarding AHT versions that came with your CPU.
HOWEVER, the AHT diagnostics are totally useless for the most common fault, bad RAM. I suggest you download and run the command-line app memtestosx. Alas he's now charging $1.39 to download it but previous versions were free and are probably still floating around. You might also like the GUI wrapper rember which will allow you to avoid fiddling with the Terminal to run memtestosx.
I highly recommend memtestosx as it finally managed to detect the bad RAM in my Quad G5 that had passed all other diagnostic programs.

Oh.. on another note, try to isolate and see if this is a system problem or a user-level problem. Try creating a fresh new user account and run your crashy apps when logged in to that account. A new account has fresh, clean prefs and if your apps run OK there, the problem is in your user space. If not, the problem is in your System space. Let me know about that.

[Captain Japan]

I looked up that line "Panic: we are hanging on here." on Google and found it to be a somewhat common problem. One message board poster referred to it as a "kernel panic." Though in most cases it seems people's computers completely die when they get that message. Mine hasn't died just yet.

FGL and GJ, I'll probably take it in to the geniuses in Shibuya. And I'll probably crack a beer in the process.

[Kuang_Grade]

Apple's page on kernel panics
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=106227

Not super helpful but somethings you might want to do
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=25392

[Captain Japan]

KG,

Yeah, I saw that when I was poking around Google. I'm pretty sure I've been updating the OS reference release each time. But that's the first thing I'll do when I get home. It seems the easiest. And the computer should hold out long enough for the download of the update before crapping out.