Living With My J-Girlfriend...The Rollercoaster

[ramchop]

About a year ago I moved in with my japanese girlfriend.

I've never done this before, but I have had several roommate experiences that went okay.

....

I have had girlfriends of all races and ages, but this is really trying.

Is it the Japanese aspect or the living with aspect that's the difference between this and past relationships?

Keep riding that rollercoaster until you're kicked off.

(no experience with banshees of a Japanese nature)

[Taro Toporific]

I'll try to be brief...

Think hinkaku and niramai.

Then, repeat after me:
Yes, daring. Of course, daring. Of course, I must be wrong, daring. . .

AND then do whatever you want just like any normal Japanese man. Women have no defense against the Rope-a-Dope* ploy of outwaiting/ignoring her screaming jags.

Keep your aloof hinkaku/dignity and a raving Japanese will always back off realizing they're crazy by Japanese norms and you're behaving like the sumo ideal of the niramai, the pre-bout stare-down.

----------------------------

The warden of a prison is in a worse condition than the prisoner himself. While the body of the prisoner is in captivity, the mind of the warden is in prison!"
---Muhammad Ali.

[Big Booger]

Well bud,
I have advice. It only gets worse. I have lived with my J-wife for about 4 years now, 2 in the states and almost 2 here in Japan. We argue, that is typcial. Everyone argues. It only gets worse when you are married. Just deal with it.
One thing to note, and this works, absence makes the heart grow fonder, so take a vacation, from each other. Go on a trip by yourself, return home, join a cult for a week or two. When you return, she'll treat you like Allah. Another thing, bring home some flowers every now and then. Buy her a small, from-the-heart gift, sing her a song or something to show that you care.
When the arguing starts, just leave. Go out for an hour or so and return. Time will solve most difficulties.
If you find that you cannot stand her, dump her. Give her the boot if she is not the eye of your tiger. If you find yourself hating her more than loving her, that is a good sign that she is not Mrs. Right.

On the note of other couples, they can be trouble. I find everytime my wife visits her friends she returns and is a real troublemaker. She always bemoans everything. So the thing that works for me is to not be home when she returns from a visit with friends.

If you compare yourselves to other couples you most likely are going to end up like those couples. Next time, just blow it off.
I have a few key phrases I use to end the conversation about topics like that.
Phrase 1
"Oh that is wonderful, what's for dinner?"

Phrase 2
"Wow, sounds interesting. Do you know where the mustard is?"

Phrase 3
"You know I was talking to Father Abraham about male circumcisions..." (this one really confounds her)

Phrase 4
"You talking to me?"

Phrase 5
"Did you just fart?" (gets a chuckle or a worried expression out of her everytime)

You can of course create your own expressions and adjust them according to the particular situation.

Good luck,
BB

[Andocrates]

I do understand the problem. Or as I see it, there is an old bible proverb

"Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend."

of course there is also

"A constant dripping on a day of steady rain and a contentious woman are alike"

Let's skip that one.

Newlyweds (which is what you really are even if it's not legal) have a lot of sharp corners and mismatched places that jab each other on a daily basis. They will get worn down over time. Find an old couple and they think alike, act alike, etc. That comes with time.

You are going to go through this painful process with someone at some point in your life if you ever want a happy and fulfilling marriage - you need to decide if this is the girl you want to grow old with. If it's something else, benri na (i cant spell the english word) sex, shared expense, etc then why argue at all - recognize the relationship for what it is and there will be no point in arguing.

If you love the girl marry her, go through the same wearing down process us married guys go through and you will be rewarded in the end.

However, I have a shortcut that, alas, won't work for you. I have always had a study, a place all my own where I am alone-like the Weezer song "In my room" my pc, my desk, my books, my dvd player, my guitar - all mine, you can come down for about one hour then you have to leave - hee.

Being in the same room with my wife for hours on end just would drive me insane.

[Big Booger]

strange that she would tear ass on you after you return from a trip. When I came back from a three week trip, my wife was adoring me.

I guess every situation/person is different. Try out different things to see what happens. Try repeating the following during an argument:
"I don't want to argue" or something like it. Don't respond to her. Just repeat that over and over when she is arguing.

I remember one time, I got sick and tired of my wife griping about everything, so I pulled out a tape recorder, and recorded the argument. Then I played it back to her after she calmed down.. that really pissed her off, but for a while she wouldn't argue because she was afraid I would be recording it. HEHEHE

Perhaps you two should seek out a counselor, either a professional or someone used to marriage consultations, a pastor, family friend etc... I know Japan is just loaded with these people, so it might take a while for you to find someone who is appropriate...

I am guessing that you two have similar personality characteristics. ie, you are both head strong, or something of that nature.
You are most likely going through a phase. Give it some more time, 5 or 6 years will do.. if after that time, find you another..

BB

[Kyoto Gaijin]

There is a different way to argue in Japan when compared to the West.

You don't speak your way out of an argument in Japan, it isn't "manly" (otoko-rashikunai).

Whatever she's picking at you about, listen calmly, do *not* argue your point more than *once* (the once that caused the argument to be started) even if you are correct, no matter what the case. She will realise after the argument who was correct anyway, its just a little hot air and stress that she needs to let out. Do not walk out during the argument, it will only get worse at some point and doing that is particularly otoko-rashikunai. Listen to what she's saying, don't brush it off - once she's finished saying it and she feels you understand *her* (not necessarily her argument) it will have all blown over.

It takes years to learn this technique but it actually makes you better at arguing with Western people in the end so give it a go.

[GomiGirl]

It takes years to learn this technique but it actually makes you better at arguing with Western people in the end so give it a go.

Peoples is peoples!! So when it comes to "arguments" it should be on the merits of an argument rather than on a cultural/gender/age or some other externality. In theory we all have a slightly different culture as we all had different parents, schools etc ad nauseum....

*gets on soapbox again*

Sure there are cultural differences at first, but after 1 year of living together you should be into your own groove as individual people and as a couple - rather than as a Japanese person and an american person. You are more than a nationality.

You didn't mention what you are arguing about or what triggers them off and who starts them and what is the outcome. Some people start to niggle because they are either trying to get attention or as some sort of power play. Neither of these situations are very conducive to a good relationship.

There is nothing worse than people pouting or sulking to get attention or to press buttons to deliberately try to get a rise out of somebody for the sole purpose of scoring points - or worse power games.

Other times daily arguments just happen out of habit with no particular cause - but they become familar, comforting and almost routine - eg wake up, go to bathroom, have shower, have quarrel over who left the toothpaste cap off, eat breakfast in a pouty mood, make up, go to work, come home, cook dinner, eat, quarrel over the washing up, make up, sex, sleep. Again this is not very constructive when real issues come up that need to be discussed. If you have a daily "dance" going on then you need to change the music.

Have you sat down with her and tried to find out why these arguments occur? Are they just out of habit? Or something deeper like differences in values?

Have you said to her that this daily arguing is not making you happy and you would like to fix it together? This needs to be handled when you are not arguing as you both are likely to be very defensive.

It sounds like you have time and emotion invested so isn't it worthwhile to try and sort it out? Two things will happen - you will sort it out and make a new "dance" or you will decide during this that you are really not suited and takes steps to end the relationship.

But to come to a new routine, you both need to leave the old shit behind and not assign blame or try to use it as a way to score points off each other.... keep the power games for the office. Home should be the place for peace and acceptance warts and all.

And don 't you think it is best to be talking to her rather than people who are f*cked?

Dr Ruth

[Smokimassho-o]

Consider this: You two may actually *like* arguing with each other. I had one girlfriend, we used to argue and holler, etc... It never mattered what about--we could argue over the color of grass. And get really angry about it. No kidding. Ran into her much later, turns out we both missed it--the fights *especially*. We get along great now, and every once in a while we get together to sharpen up on each other. Draw blood over drinks, lick the wounds for breakfast.

[Taro Toporific]

... I had one girlfriend, we used to argue and holler, etc... It never mattered what about--we could argue over the color of grass.

Strange you should mention the "color of grass" as an example. I live in the Yokohama's AOBA-ku, meaning 'Blue Bud' Ward. Springtime tree buds are blue, right?

[Kyoto Gaijin]

It takes years to learn this technique but it actually makes you better at arguing with Western people in the end so give it a go.

Peoples is peoples!! So when it comes to "arguments" it should be on the merits of an argument rather than on a cultural/gender/age or some other externality. In theory we all have a slightly different culture as we all had different parents, schools etc ad nauseum....

Of course everyone's an individual, but there are always the masses of the nation and with the masses there are common trends or "habits" that remain consistent throughout the entire nationality. That's why we're FG and we complain about the Japanese all the time

In the same way, arguments and more importantly the automatic ingrained responses to things people say in the heat of the moment are different per culture.

[GuyJean]

Consider this: You two may actually *like* arguing with each other.

OhioJin,

Sounds like you have some great advice here in this thread..

I've actually talked to quite a few Japanese female friends, and some say they REALLY WANT to argue with their significant other]tatemai[/i] to hold down these FGGs (F*cked Gaijin Girlriends)!

You've come a long way, baby

My 2 yen.

GJ

[American Oyaji]

My wife and I used to argue all the time.
Ive been in the U.S. for almost 3 years. When I first left, the conversations were civil. Then we started arguing on the phone, so I stopped talking to her. Eventually she realized I'm always right and she has stopped arguing.

It takes time. Go ahead and marry the girl if you truly love her. If not, trade her in for a newer model.

Japanese women who get with gaijin or marry them are f*cked anyway. I mean, they are REALLY not your average Japanese women. So they're gonna be a little whacked in the head anyway.

[GomiGirl]

Oyaji-sama,

Good god man!! Is that the way you really think? Your post was disturbing on so many levels.

[American Oyaji]

While it is true that my wife HAS indeed realized I'm usually correct and doesnt argue, she discusses things calmly. When she grew up, her mother ALWAYS overruled her father so she thought she should always overrule me. But when I was growing up, Dad's word was law. That is what caused most of the problems.

The rest is just being silly.

As for Japanese women who get with gaijin being f*cked, thats the truth. The majority of them are NOT your average run of the mill Japanese woman.

[bluepxl]

As for Japanese women who get with gaijin being f*cked, thats the truth. The majority of them are NOT your average run of the mill Japanese woman.

umm.. so if falling in love with someone regardless of race/background/color/culture or whatever is f*cked, then what would you consider "average run of the mill"? that must be REALLY f*cked.

[Kurofune]

Japanese women who get with gaijin or marry them are f*cked anyway. I mean, they are REALLY not your average Japanese women. So they're gonna be a little whacked in the head anyway.

I wouldn't go so far as to call them "whacked in the head," but I think a lot of people in intercultural relationships don't realize the enormity of what they're getting into in terms of intercultural conflict. It's easy to blow off those little points of conflict when you're dating, but things take on a whole different tone when you start living together, sharing the financial burden, raising kids, etc. It's especially hard when one person is a Westerner who prefers to communicate directly and openly, and the other person is a Japanese who prefers to create an atmosphere and let the other person figure out what's going on. Intercultural relationships are no light matter. I'd like to see statistics of how many Japanese/Western marriages end in divorce.

[Taro Toporific]

Intercultural relationships are no light matter. I'd like to see statistics of how many Japanese/Western marriages end in divorce.

I've seen reports of a 60% divorce rate, but the numbers are impossible to nail down since the marriages cross borders. That is, there's a Japanese marriage and divorce overseas and visa versa---the divorce may not counted.

In a 1995 paper on migrant women in Japan, sociologist Rosario Ballescas quoted a study on migrant workers in Japan which found that ''divorce rates for marriages between Filipino women and Japanese men run roughly at 70 percent''. ... In divorce forms they fill out at the embassy, the women often cite as reasons ''he beats me up'' or ''he hurts me''.

[kamome]

[edit]

[kamome]

Anyone know what the success rate is for American/Thai relationships?

[Taro Toporific]

Anyone know what the success rate is for American/Thai relationships?

Tough to find that info...

Thailand
Divorces per 1000 population per year: 0.58
-88.28% the Rate Compared to USA

--from 'Asian Countries Divorce Statistics'

However, I did find the following on the Divorce Reform[/ur] site....

[url=http://www.divorcereform.org/sha.html] Divorce in International/Interracial Marriages in Shanghai

People frequently write to Americans for Divorce Reform asking for information on whether international or interracial marriages are at greater risk for divorce. I believe that statistics on this are out there, but we do not have them, except for the article below. If anyone has such statistics, or links or references to them, please send them...

"Divorce rates in Chinese/foreign marriages"
[Lateline News (lateline.muzi.net): 8/23/97]

Shanghai - Mixed marriages between Shanghainese and foreigners rose 67 percent last year from 1991, but unions are also breaking up at a faster rate, a survey reveals. AFP reported
that more than 2,100 Shanghainese married foreigners last year, up 67 per cent
from 1991, accounting for 3.5 per cent of the total number of marriages in
1996, a survey by the city's Civil Affairs Bureau says.

Far more Chinese women than men marry foreigners, and more mixed couples were
setting up homes in Shanghai rather than moving overseas, the survey says. It
also found that divorces between Shanghainese and foreigners have more than
doubled since 1991.

[Gaisaradatsuraku!]

Well, as much as I hate to admit it too, Oyaji makes a hell of a lot of sense and speaks from experience. That's what separates him from you Gomi Girl. You are in a fantasy world. I would suggest that you do not get married (or wait 20 more years).

[Taro Toporific]

What about us ugly guys! I'll take a girl on the fringe of Japanese society any time. This is probably TMI but I found that it is easy to pick up J-girls with a defect, like this cross eyed girl I dated in Sasebo....

That's not a "defect"---that can be cute in the Japanese point-o-view.

You know...cross-eyed girls in Japan can play cute while wearing a kimono to look like doll and walk pigeon toed shuffle. This is the Land-o-Crooked-Teeth-Cute, giggling yaeba : I'm such a far-gone FG that I like it!

YAEBA, YAEBA do!

[cstaylor]

It doesn't take a bright person to find out the fact, that a GOOD Japanese Girl will not marry a Gaijin. Pick up any social book on Japan written by an educated gaijin and you can read it for yourself.

That's a good thing... there'd be full-scale war if larger percentages of Japanese women married foreign men.