Do Japanese males feel less of a man next to a Foreigner?

[Alcazar]

From your message it almost sounded like you were attempting to measure people's testosterone levels just by looking at them!
So I'm sure after seeing those thorough articles you're not attempting to deduce testosterone levels via visual inspection of somebody's face and body, right? If that worked, why are all these researchers bothering with science?

Well, that is exactly what you can do in fact. People look different for a reason. Higher or lower dosages of testosterone and estrogen flooding the human body during puberty in both male and females leave their mark. These are extremely powerful hormones that change the body.

Females with lower levels of testosterone and correspondingly higher levels of estrogen end up with more feminine features such as a smaller lower half of their face. 'Thus, an attractive female face should look unmistakably female, which means it has been shaped by sufficient stores of estrogen, the principal hormone of female fertility. Estrogen is thought to help make the bottom half of the face narrower than the top half, for example, and to make the cheeks high and round'.

People with higher levels of testosterone get bigger jaws among other features. Same with hormonal indicators on the body. These are the reasons why males and females really start to diverge physically at puberty. This one is also interesting because it talks about behaviour and the hormonal link. 'Professor Allan Booth and Dr James Dabbs of Penn State University have even shown that, in a group of US air force servicemen, males with testosterone levels significantly above the average were 50% less likely to marry, which may suggest they have difficulty co-operating in a partnership with another individual'. I wouldn't be surprised if 'Jack' of FG fame had a blood testosterone level that is off the charts. If this is true then Jack can't be blamed for his behaviour too harshly. (all I'll say about that is 'playa, play-on').

Ok, you wanted a link to the Japanese testosterone levels, I found this:
'Plasma levels of testosterone and estradiol were significantly lower in the Japanese men, when compared with those in Dutch men', and 'These differences were also found when results from Japanese subgroups (controls and patients with prostate pathology) were compared with those from the Dutch subgroups'.

'The finding of a lower plasma testosterone in the Japanese men, however, remains suggestive, warranting a more extensive prospective study'.

2

[Alcazar]

This issue is also interesting. Ever wondered why blacks are really good at track events, but not swimming? People of West African ancestory have certain characteristics which produce sporting outcomes. The swimming thing is because Africans have greater bone density which doesn't aid fast swimming (although a sociologist would also argue the lack of black swimmers worldwide has a socio-economic background-eg access to pools).

Blacks with a West African ancestry generally have:
* relatively less subcutaneous fat on arms and legs and proportionately more lean body and muscle mass, broader shoulders, larger quadriceps, and bigger, more developed musculature in general;
* denser, shallower chests;
* higher center of gravity, generally shorter sitting height, narrower hips, and lighter calves;
* longer arm span and "distal elongation of segments" - the hand is relatively longer than the forearm, which in turn is relatively longer than the upper arm; the foot is relatively longer than the tibia (leg), which is relatively longer than the thigh;
* faster patellar tendon reflex;
* greater body density, which is likely due to higher bone mineral density and heavier bone mass at all stages in life, including infancy (despite evidence of lower calcium intake and a higher prevalence of lactose intolerance, which prevents consumption of dairy products);
* modestly, but significantly, higher levels of plasma testosterone (3-19 percent), which is anabolic, theoretically contributing to greater muscle mass, lower fat, and the ability to perform at a higher level of intensity with quicker recovery;
* a higher percentage of fast-twitch muscles and more anaerobic enzymes, which can translate into more explosive energy.

Black Americans are a mixture from all over Africa-there are definite West Africans you can pick, and East Africans too. But many would be blended these days. I don't know if black Americans realise this though, some seem to think that there is one big 'Pan-African' culture or common background-wrong.
West African ancestory: Think Mike Tyson, Jordan, any black sprinter.
East African ancestory: Think Ethiopian long distance runners, Snoop Dog, Puff Daddy.

[jim katta]

oh my fucking god...




dude, no one would ever confuse me of not looking black, and I assure you that I don't fit that profile genetically or otherwise. blacks in america are by and large a mutt race (not to be confused with the nazi "mud race"), in much the same way as the gypsies of western asia and europe.

thank god hitler is dead.

This kind of stupid shit is exactly the reason why when I walk down the street non-black people think I'm "inherently" more aggressive or some stupid shit and they feel they have to tip toe around saying things to me lest I go into violence convulsions. Think about it, on this board, I've had a few verbal run-ins with a couple of non-blacks, ask yourself, who was the one who was ready to meet offline in-person and get bloody and fight to the death over a few posts? Answer: it wasn't Me. But I'm GENETICALLY PREDISPOSED to such behavior. Right?

dude, I bet you think all asians are good at math. come on admit it.

[cstaylor]

So, is that a counterpoint to your argument?

There was no 'argument', I was stating some interesting facts about the effects of hormonal levels on human physiology.....

My point is that Japanese history is littered with extreme brutality and violence, so I'm not sure how your testosterone theory holds water.

[jim katta]

My point is that Japanese history is littered with extreme brutality and violence, so I'm not sure how your testosterone theory holds water

EXACTLY! Thank you.

[Alcazar]

Dude, no one would ever confuse me of not looking black, and I assure you that I don't fit that profile genetically or otherwise. blacks in america are by and large a mutt race (not to be confused with the nazi "mud race"), in much the same way as the gypsies of western asia and europe.

This kind of stupid shit is exactly the reason why when I walk down the street non-black people think I'm "inherently" more aggressive or some stupid shit and they feel they have to tip toe around saying things to me lest I go into violence convulsions. Think about it, on this board, I've had a few verbal run-ins with a couple of non-blacks, ask yourself, who was the one who was ready to meet offline in-person and get bloody and fight to the death over a few posts? Answer: it wasn't Me. But I'm GENETICALLY PREDISPOSED to such behavior. Right?

Well someone has very easy 'buttons' to press! Did you even read the reference? I think you have this reaction to race because you are a racist and obsessed with race, as you constantly demonstrate on FG. Race is basically what you like to write about. You are paranoid and are actively looking for racial slights. Someone writes about physiological difference and you lose it.

And the difference I was highlighting was a positive one! Read the fucking hotlink: West Africans can excell at many sports because of physiological advantages. Well isn't that nice to know? If I was black and didn't previously know all the scientific reasons behind black athleticism, I would find that really interesting, and I would feel good about that knowledge.

I bet you think I feel I have to be apologetic because all of a sudden a black person is 'displeased'. Might work when you attempt to intimidate people in real life with wild political correctness and constantly playing the 'victim'. Fuck you.

Think about it, on this board, I've had a few verbal run-ins with a couple of non-blacks.

Yes I have thought about it. Why do you feel the need to have confrontations with people soley based on race? You are looking for offence with a magnifying glass because you are obsessed with race and a closet racist yourself.

[Alcazar]

Oh, so why didn't you originally say that CS?

I thought you could read behind the lines. You could if you knew anything about Japanese history.

Sociological explanation: Japanese society has culturally evolved to be competitive and at time violent due to its formation on a archipelago of islands with relatively scarce arable land to support a population. When people are crowded in, social systems and customs develop in response to this. One is potentially intense competition and violence as different groups struggle for limited resources, instead of just spreading out in an another geographic area as people could do in some other parts of the world.

Wrong. Until the Meiji Restoration, Japan had plenty of the resources it needed: rice, wood for construction, water, fish, etc. While Europe struggled out from the bonds of the Catholic church, the Onin wars in Japan left countless Japanese peasants and soldiers dead. Various clans (like those of Scotland) fought for supremecy in Japan. All this violence with your claimed "lower levels of testosterone".

OK metaphor time

It's a simile, not a metaphor. If you're going to insult someone, at least have the courtesy to do it correctly.

CS, sometimes I imagine you as a little rat or other furry rodent scurrying around the 'FG house' at nightime, picking up crumbs and scraps left around on the floor under the table, and then maybe biting someone's toe as they sleep, only to quickly scurry away to your hidden burrow should they awake.........

Well, if we're arguing ad hominems, I do tire of educating brainless windbags like yourself and a few other posters on this site. Perhaps if you enjoyed learning from others more and the sound of your own voice less, you'd take away something useful from these discussions.

[Video-Link Japan]

Dude, no one would ever confuse me of not looking black, and I assure you that I don't fit that profile genetically or otherwise. blacks in america are by and large a mutt race (not to be confused with the nazi "mud race"), in much the same way as the gypsies of western asia and europe.

This kind of stupid shit is exactly the reason why when I walk down the street non-black people think I'm "inherently" more aggressive or some stupid shit and they feel they have to tip toe around saying things to me lest I go into violence convulsions. Think about it, on this board, I've had a few verbal run-ins with a couple of non-blacks, ask yourself, who was the one who was ready to meet offline in-person and get bloody and fight to the death over a few posts? Answer: it wasn't Me. But I'm GENETICALLY PREDISPOSED to such behavior. Right?

Well someone has very easy 'buttons' to press! Did you even read the reference? I think you have this reaction to race because you are a racist and obsessed with race, as you constantly demonstrate on FG. Race is basically what you like to write about. You are paranoid and are actively looking for racial slights. Someone writes about physiological difference and you lose it.

And the difference I was highlighting was a positive one! Read the fucking hotlink: West Africans can excell at many sports because of physiological advantages. Well isn't that nice to know? If I was black and didn't previously know all the scientific reasons behind black athleticism, I would find that really interesting, and I would feel good about that knowledge.

I bet you think I feel I have to be apologetic because all of a sudden a black person is 'displeased'. Might work when you attempt to intimidate people in real life with wild political correctness and constantly playing the 'victim'. Fuck you.

Think about it, on this board, I've had a few verbal run-ins with a couple of non-blacks.

Yes I have thought about it. Why do you feel the need to have confrontations with people soley based on race? You are looking for offence with a magnifying glass because you are obsessed with race and a closet racist yourself.

Laughing quietly to myself..
Shibuya Me must be 'Just Freakin' Welp, Welp, Welp now that this thread has wandered So Far off the original TROLL intended course...!!!
Do Japanese males feel less of a man next to a Foreigner?
Do ALL caucasian women feel less feminine next to ANY asian woman?!?
Just trying to be equally vague..

[Ptyx]

Back to the original subject, taking a scientific theory (japanese male have less blood testoterone than westerners) to explain why "Japanese males could feel less of a man next to a Foreigner" is as you stated "not fashionable".
And if you ask why, a philosopher named Eric Juengst could give an answer :

"No matter how great the potential genomies to show our interconnections, if it beguins by describing our differences it will inevitably produce scientific wedges to hammer into the social cracks that already divide us"

So these theories maybe right, but at the same time pretty dangerous to play with. Even if it's true it's still called genism and i don't see in what way it proves anything.
As cs said, japanese history and culture is full of brutal behaviors and ballsy stories.
But at the same time i don't know how you're suppose answer such question as "Do Japanese males feel less of a man next to a Foreigner?"
I shouldn't have to even point out why but let's just say that "manhood" is a really vague term and imho not related to the amount of testosterone that runs through blood or gene pools.
It's just plain trolling and you should'nt have tried to back it up by playing with genism theories in the first place.

It's a shame that being a non-native english speaker i can't be more precise in what i wanna say anyway, i hope you'll understand my point.

[Alcazar]

Back to the original subject, taking a scientific theory (japanese male have less blood testoterone than westerners) to explain why "Japanese males could feel less of a man next to a Foreigner" is as you stated "not fashionable".
And if you ask why, a philosopher named Eric Juengst could give an answer :

"No matter how great the potential genomies to show our interconnections, if it beguins by describing our differences it will inevitably produce scientific wedges to hammer into the social cracks that already divide us"

So these theories maybe right, but at the same time pretty dangerous to play with.

That is a very good point and I am very much aware of those concerns.

But at the same time i don't know how you're suppose answer such question as "Do Japanese males feel less of a man next to a Foreigner?" I shouldn't have to even point out why but let's just say that "manhood" is a really vague term and imho not related to the amount of testosterone that runs through blood or gene pools. It's just plain trolling and you should'nt have tried to back it up by playing with genism theories in the first place.

I agree, manhood in any given society should really only be measured by that societies own standards. Japanese men certainly feel like men relative to Japanese women. They do activities associated with masculinity in Japan today such as working very, very long hours and having big drinking sessions for example.

It's just plain trolling and you should'nt have tried to back it up by playing with genism theories in the first place.

Yep, it was fishing for outrage, because I knew certain people here would hit the roof, but I knew I could back up my statements. Nothing like a little bear-trap setting......

However other people here who know about gene and hormonal associated science told me my info was interesting.

It's a shame that being a non-native english speaker i can't be more precise in what i wanna say anyway, i hope you'll understand my point.

I do understand, I was being naughty!

[jim katta]

Just to get it out of the way immediately...No, Fuck You, you pseudo intellectual asshole. Your hackneyed wanna-be sociologist theories may get over with your small cirlcle of adoring friends, but don't post non-sensical "theories" on this board without expecting to be criticized.

And I love your technique for attempting to discredit my critique. "Oh, you're a racist, you always talk about race." Bullshit. Most of my friends are non-blacks, so needless to say I couldn't talk race all the time or I wouldn't have them as friends. Thing is, they are intelligent, and thougthful, so I don't usually find myself confronted by ignorance on their part regarding the topic of race. Most of my time reading FG (which has been MUCH longer than my posting time), I can say that I never really saw stuff that was racially offensive. When I did, I was surprised, and I spoke up. I won't allow you or anyone else to try and pigeonhole me by saying that because I've commented about race, I'm obsessed. Bullshit. I guess because I started the Kill Bill thread and went on a rant about Japanese child porn, presto!, I'm obsessed with Japan's perv society, right? Or maybe the several times I've written LONG ass paragraphs to japan newbies on this board looking for advice means that I've got a Father Know it All Complex, right? Like I said, your "logic" is very flawed.

When it comes to the fine japanese people, you say, "Oh, well maybe they were violent due to limited resources and close competition..." But when it comes to black people, their behavior is based on exotic genetic circumstances. DUDE, do you hear how you sound?? Can you see the double standard in your so called logic? Face it, you "scientific view" is rooted in sociological chauvinism, you just don't want to admit it. I'm betting you have similar views of women, i.e. the weaker, can't do certain jobs, etc. etc. I've found that with certain seemingly intelligent/cool people, whether it's a japanese person hating a korean, or a white person dissing a black person, it's usually hard to change that person's mind regarding who they think is an inherently inferior ethnic group. I'm sure there are very well regarded japanese scientists who can talk your ear off about the genetic differences of koreans and chinese that make them less perfect than japanese. If you think not, then you don't know japan.

I even hear ignorant blacks spouting the same crap about whites and how they "came from the caves" and this makes them savages obsessed with violence and rape. That's bullshit too. Whoever (black, white, or asian) promotes this non-thinking crap has a lot of learning to do. Or, you could just goose-step your way through life believing that there's a "genetic" reason why germans convinced themselves that they were so much better than their jewish brethren. Good luck trying to justify such genetic parlor games. History is not on your side. Genius.

[Alcazar]

Just to get it out of the way immediately...No, Fuck You, you pseudo intellectual asshole. Your hackneyed wanna-be sociologist theories may get over with your small cirlcle of adoring friends, but don't post non-sensical "theories" on this board without expecting to be criticized.

Fuck you, you completely non-intellectual racist tool . It's not my problem if you have never heard of science or sociology before and find it confronting to your world view. (You can't really understand contemporary politics then can you, a great deal is based upon sociological theories). Make up your mind about what you are against, first it is gene theory, now sociology-have I got you confused?

Like I said, your "logic" is very flawed.

Hey, it's not my logic, I didn't do the research into genetics, hormonal science and sociology, but I am educated to the extent that I understand and appreciate their value in explaining the world we live in. Maybe you don't understand that genetics or sociology are not 'destiny', but explanations. You do want explanations don't you, or do you want people to put their head in the sand in the name of politeness (and neglect)?.

When it comes to the fine japanese people, you say, "Oh, well maybe they were violent due to limited resources and close competition..." But when it comes to black people, their behavior is based on exotic genetic circumstances.

Are you implying that black people are violent? No one here actually stated that, either explicitly or implicitly, except you. Like I said, you are looking for offence with a magnifying glass and now even imagining it because you are a racist obsessed with race.

(Listen, if you think black people are violent, I can hypothesise a sociological explaination to explain your theory of 'black violence' if you want? Violence in America, Africa, England, which do you want? It can't be exactly the same sociological explanation for each society, because sociology doesn't work that way)

your whole attitude reminds me of a very funny scene from the film 'Chasing Amy', staring Samuel L Jackson pretending to be a racist black man as the character in this text 'Hooper':
-During the speech, Holden and Banky enter and sit up
front.

HOLDEN
(calling out)
Bullshit! Lando Calrissian was a
black man, and he got to fly the
Millennium Falcon!

Hooper whips his head around, looking for the source of
the comment

HOOPER
Who said that?!?

HOLDEN
(standing)
I did! Lando Calrissian is a positive
black role model in the realm of
Science Fiction/Fantasy.

HOOPER
Fuck Lando Calrissian! Uncle Tom
nigger! Always some white boy gotta
invoke `the holy trilogy'! Bust this -
those movies are about how the white
man keeps the brother man down - even
in a galaxy far, far away. Check
this shit. You got cracker farm-boy
Luke Skywalker, Nazi poster boy -
blond hair, blue eyes.
And then you've got Darth
Vader: the blackest brother in the
galaxy. Nubian God.

BANKY
What's a Nubian?

HOOPER
Shut the fuck up! Now Vader, he's a
spiritual brother, with the force and
all that shit. Then this cracker
Skywalker gets his hands on a light-
saber, and the boy decides he's
gonna run the fucking universe - gets
a whole Klan of whites together, and
they're gonna bust up Vader's `hood
the Death Star. Now what the fuck do
you call that!

BANKY
Intergalactic Civil War!

HOOPER
Gentrification. They're gonna drive
our the black element, to make the
galaxy quote, unquote `safe' for white
folks.

HOLDEN
But Vader turns, out to be Luke's
father. And in Jedi, they become
friends.

HOOPER
Don't make me bust a cap in your ass,
yo! Jedi's the most insulting
installment, because Vader's
beautiful, black visage is
sullied when he pulls off his mask to
reveal a feeble, crusty white man!
They're trying to tell us that deep
inside, we all want to be white!

[omae mona]

Hey, it's not my logic, I didn't do the research into genetics, hormonal science and sociology, but I am educated to the extent that I understand and appreciate their value in explaining the world we live in.

That's cute. Alcazar quotes some scientific articles, then constructs a series of completely invalid arguments, very loosely related to the source material. Much of what Alcazar writes seems to stem from the basic logical error that if a implies b, then b implies a. Then he tops it off with "hey, it's not my logic" I had a good chuckle.

Being able to search the web and being able to think are two separate things.


I am getting ticked off about seeing this troll thread at the top of the list every time I sign on (no, I don't have any self control, so I can't help but clicking on it). Could we just go back to talking about something useful, like gaijin who like natto, subway nose-pickers, or using camera phones inside an onsen? I think the mysterious, unannounced, hot pink color scheme is a sign from God that we are meant to get back to discussing those critical topics. With an average IQ here of about 82 (and I apologize]http://www.kidsdomain.com/brain/animals/clip/horse.gif[/img]

[jim katta]

I don't know, there's just know satisfaction cursing out some anonymous dude on the internet who isn't even making good points. I started to read your movie script, but after the first couple of lines I realized it had nothing to do with a salient point, so I stopped reading. I bear you no real ill will, and I'm sure if you knew me in real life you wouldn't call me what have on this thread. Suffice to say, completely leaving blacks out of the debate, I think your theories are wrong and that you are incorrectly applying your readings regarding sociology and genetics. That's all, no more, no less. I guess it took that other well known dude to actually inspire me to all out flame mode. Peace dude.

[jim katta]

I agree with omae mona. I hate natto, and this thread has become essentially worthless.

[Alcazar]

I am getting ticked off about seeing this troll thread at the top of the list every time I sign on (no, I don't have any self control, so I can't help but clicking on it).

Ok that's fine, you better not read other people's opinions or your brain might max out its info-capacity and your head might explode? Bet you didn't actually think and open the hotlinks.....

Of course you won't address me directly out of fear (smart move), but have to refer to my input in the third person because you can't disprove anything I discussed, all you can say is 'I disagree' in an aggrieved manner. I can't believe how un-educated you are if the very mention of this area of science and opinion is news to you (and I didn't want to have to get into class issues here). Guess what, in tertiary education, people also learn the skill of debating issues respectfully and with an open mind.....

Others have disagreed with me respectfully which I in turn respect, but you want to be a little bitch about it....

I agree, I am bored of playing educator to the ignorant in this thread, but I did learn some things myself......

[Caustic Saint]

:D your whole attitude reminds me of a very funny scene from the film 'Chasing Amy', staring Samuel L Jackson pretending to be a racist black man as the character in this text 'Hooper':
-During the speech, Holden and Banky enter and sit up front.

I just want to know where you got the idea that Sam Jackson was in "Chasing Amy." He's never been in any of Kevin Smith's movies.

Hooper LaMont was played by Dwight Ewell.

[Alcazar]

I just want to know where you got the idea that Sam Jackson was in "Chasing Amy." He's never been in any of Kevin Smith's movies.

Hooper LaMont was played by Dwight Ewell.

Sorry, I have a mp3 of that scene on my computer, and I had thought it was Samuel L Jackson-really sounded like him. My bad....

[cstaylor]

A question I sometimes ponder: why is Alcazar interested in Japan? Shouldn't he be trolling http://www.nazieugenics.org or something?

[Alcazar]

A question I sometimes ponder: why is Alcazar interested in Japan?

I sometimes ponder why you feel antagonistic towards me CS, maybe because I am younger than you (22) and you don't like being shown up by a younger person who knows as much as you do about certain things in an environment that you regard as your playpen where you want to regain your 'spot' as the only knowledgable geek (the avatar says it all).

Common now, thats just immature-I thought you were married and everything, past that phase.

I have been to Japan twice, and I am coming to Japan next year, so maybe I'll meet you and tower over you (in more ways than one) .

[Alcazar]

CS, I am actually a nerd of sorts too. I am especially interested in politics (international relations) and history. You are a nerd who as far as I can tell likes Japan, history and IT. And real nerds/geeks know that these names are not insults when used between nerds and geeks. So nerds shouldn't try to outdo each other, as they are each 'experts' of sorts in their respective areas of interest.

See, I don't get jealous that you know and Gomi Girl have IT skills, and I don't (I just know how to use a computer and the internet). I don't try and snakily undermine those threads, so how about doing the same?

[AssKissinger]

A question I sometimes ponder: why is Alcazar interested in Japan? Shouldn't he be trolling http://www.nazieugenics.org or something?

I'm glad that link didn't work. Eugenics is the science of trying to improve a population through controlled breeding. Al has suggested nothing of the sort so the Nazi comparisons are ridiculous and make you look stupid.

If you disagree with his position post evidence to the contrary. People are just too damn hysterical about race. People of certain races might be likely to have a proclivity to certain behaviors. At the very least we know that some races have on average darker skin than others. How do we know that is the end of our difference, that after that everything is learned and cultural? Maybe it is our only difference but until it can be studied and discussed without people going apeshit we'll never know.

[cstaylor]

Great, the mass bleating herd of fellow travelers comes forth. Have the two of you Einsteins ever thought to think that testosterone, like other hormones, is and can be controlled through diet? Did your brilliant articles take that into account?

[cstaylor]

(the avatar says it all)

You would be wrong there too (an interesting trend). Long before you graced this board with your presence, Ultra gave me the title "Statistics Master". Since Frick always uses unrelated numbers to prove a point, I chose the avatar accordingly. I lost the title when I made an elementary math mistake in a different thread, but I haven't changed the avatar.

Common now, thats just immature-I thought you were married and everything, past that phase.

Hey, I don't go around comparing people to rodents, so you aren't taking the highroad in this argument. I could have wasted my time pointing out that Japan has over 1,000 years of well documented violence, far before it ran into serious problems with resources and space, but it would have been wasted on you.

As Churchill wrote: "A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject." Your ravings on race are at the least poor science, *espcially* since you are focusing on sex hormones like testosterone.

[Alcazar]

Since Frick always uses unrelated numbers to prove a point, I chose the avatar accordingly.

OMG, you actually know and use the name of that obsure character!
I've seen your image so I'm looking forward to 'meeting' you on one of those notoriously apathetic Tokyo streets in '04 CS .....

I'm glad that link didn't work. Eugenics is the science of trying to improve a population through controlled breeding. Al has suggested nothing of the sort so the Nazi comparisons are ridiculous and make you look stupid.
If you disagree with his position post evidence to the contrary. People are just too damn hysterical about race. People of certain races might be likely to have a proclivity to certain behaviors. At the very least we know that some races have on average darker skin than others. How do we know that is the end of our difference, that after that everything is learned and cultural? Maybe it is our only difference but until it can be studied and discussed without people going apeshit we'll never know.

Thank you for bringing this back down to earth. I knew this thing would perhaps cause some controversy and get some discussion going, but I wasn't expecting the reaction I got.....

[kotatsuneko]

troll v.,n. 1. [From the Usenet group alt.folklore.urban] To utter a posting on Usenet designed to attract predictable responses or flames; or, the post itself. Derives from the phrase "trolling for newbies" which in turn comes from mainstream "trolling", a style of fishing in which one trails bait through a likely spot hoping for a bite. The well-constructed troll is a post that induces lots of newbies and flamers to make themselves look even more clueless than they already do, while subtly conveying to the more savvy and experienced that it is in fact a deliberate troll. If you don't fall for the joke, you get to be in on it. See also YHBT. 2. An individual who chronically trolls in sense 1; regularly posts specious arguments, flames or personal attacks to a newsgroup, discussion list, or in email for no other purpose than to annoy someone or disrupt a discussion. Trolls are recognizable by the fact that the have no real interest in learning about the topic at hand - they simply want to utter flame bait. Like the ugly creatures they are named after, they exhibit no redeeming characteristics, and as such, they are recognized as a lower form of life on the net, as in, "Oh, ignore him, he's just a troll." 3. [Berkeley] Computer lab monitor. A popular campus job for CS students. Duties include helping newbies and ensuring that lab policies are followed. Probably so-called because it involves lurking in dark cavelike corners. Some people claim that the troll (sense 1) is properly a narrower category than flame bait, that a troll is categorized by containing some assertion that is wrong but not overtly controversial. See also Troll-O-Meter.
The use of `troll' in either sense is a live metaphor that readily produces elaborations and combining forms. For example, one not infrequently sees the warning "Do not feed the troll" as part of a followup to troll postings.

[NeoNecroNomiCron]

[ramchop]

That group has less testosterone than my group. Therefore I must more of a man than they are.

That other group are genetically more athletic, that's the only reason why I fail at outdoor pursuits.


The problem with population studies is that they shed very little light on the individual. Maybe that's why losers place so much faith in them.