Okinawa to suffer for US servicemembers actions

[joshuaism]

[AssKissinger]

Fuck the US military. That is funny though. Their arrogance is just so off the fucking chain. But on the other hand, they're totally right. Those fucking shop owners care a million times more about those extra sales than they do about some girl getting raped. Like all people they are ruled by money.

[Uthark_Runa]

Yeah since he is already guilty of rape right!? He has not even been to trial let alone any real evidence or testimony been made public, but yeah since he is in the US military he is automatically a rapist, and murderer of course.
Everyone knows Okinawan people never cause any trouble or contribute to crime on that island at all, so wow this is a totally unfair restriction but they can handle the hit to economy as long as all the barbarians are gone. That would fix everything.

[AssKissinger]

since he is in the US military he is automatically a rapist

Good point

[American Oyaji]

Actually, this is a good thing. It not only applies to Marines, but ALL U.S. personnel.

It is a brilliant move in two ways.

1.It SERIOUSLY yanks the chain of ALL U.S. personnel and sends the message that ones actions affect us ALL, no matter branch of service.
It also puts the Marines in the collective doghouse and U.S. personnel will be more likely to report Marines being rowdy.

2. It also allows the population to see what life would be like WITHOUT the money that BASES bring. Not just one,but ALL of them.
You want us gone? Fine. We'll give you a taste of what it would be like.

I would have gone a step further and not allowed civilians on base.\

Here's the truth. There are more rapes in Okinawa committed by locals than by servicemen. It's just the fact it gets blown out of proportion when it's an American that does it. We all know the majority of crime gets committed by J-folk in Japan.

This action should also have the affect of reigning in those that are bound and determined to cause trouble for the bases and making their voices harder to be heard.

Is it fair that Okinawa bears the brunt of military support in Japan? No.
But it is a truth that the bases are now an important part of the economy.

Offbase landlords would not get the crazy rent money from the bases.
Those are folks that would SERIOUSLY get hurt during a pullout.

[DrP]

Why not carry the 'solidarity' a bit farther. How about EVERY gaijin in Japan observing a couple weeks of reflection... Don't shop in the stores, drink in the bars, purchase goods made in Japan, etc. I, for one, totally agree with the USMC on this one, and will do my part to patronize ONLY the North Korean yaku niku, pubs and groceries in my hood. A little kimuchi never hurt anyone.

[Captain Japan]

Protesters shout slogans during a rally titled 'We don't need dangerous neighbors' Tuesday, Feb. 19, 2008 in Chatan, an Okinawan town where a U.S. Marine was allegedly raped a 14-year-old Japanese girl last week. The U.S. military imposed tight restrictions on all personnel in Okinawa on Wednesday, limiting troops to bases, places of work or off-base housing amid a furor over the arrest on suspicion of raping.

[joshuaism]

I think as a commander I'd be worried about this comming weekend. While all week the GIs will be getting briefed ad nauseam about how not to be a jackass, will they be willing to sit home and reflect on this situation through the weekend? Or are they going to cut loose on base? With the clubs and the shoppettes still open, people might just decide to live it up and party harder, let out some of the frustration of being pent up like a caged animal.

Even if the military members are cautious about screwing up this weekend, what about the dependants and other personnel that didn't sit through the breifings? How will they feel about being punished for something they didn't do? And how will it affect their actions?

This weekend might be more exciting than people are hoping for.

[ttjereth]

Yeah since he is already guilty of rape right!? He has not even been to trial let alone any real evidence or testimony been made public, but yeah since he is in the US military he is automatically a rapist, and murderer of course.
Everyone knows Okinawan people never cause any trouble or contribute to crime on that island at all, so wow this is a totally unfair restriction but they can handle the hit to economy as long as all the barbarians are gone. That would fix everything.

He admits to trying to force an underage girl to kiss him. Guilty of rape or not, he wasn't exactly behaving like a conscientious member of society.

[Mulboyne]

Here's the truth. There are more rapes in Okinawa committed by locals than by servicemen. It's just the fact it gets blown out of proportion when it's an American that does it. We all know the majority of crime gets committed by J-folk in Japan.

The US military often takes an unfair beating in Japan but you can't defend crimes by military personnel by talking about general crime rates. I'm sure an actuary could tell me what the incidence of rape, drunk driving, theft etc might be in a given population but what does that mean in practical terms? Should the military therefore be allowed a quota of criminal activity and the Okinawans only be allowed to take offence of when that quota is exceeded? Good luck holding a press conference to explain to local people that the rape of a child was "inevitable".

[bolt_krank]

But overall - I think what's happening is a good idea.
It's showing accountability from the military.

It'll affect Okinawan economically - but they're asking for it anyway...

[amdg]

I can’t work out if this “time out” period is (a) a disciplinary thing for the US personnel or (b) a reminder to the local Okinawans about how much they depend on the bases economically.

If (b) it strikes me as an incredibaly bad idea and just weakens their position. It’s like the girlfriend who says “fine, I’m leaving, see how you like it when I’m not here!” (ans: I like it just fine babe, don’t forget to take your shit with you).

I mean, US renters are still renting, and the base itself still has to be supplied – utilities, food, etc right? (or maybe I’m wrong on this – are the bases supplied with imported goods?) so the economic impact might not be that significant (I may be wrong on this too, I don’t know how many business depend on US patronage). And they might just find that the locals prefer it that the personnel stay on base, and start lobbying for a 6pm curfew or similar restrictions.

Unless they really really would go through with a complete pull-out, I just think it’s a bad idea to "threaten" people that way – pride often outweights economic concerns.

[Greji]

[quote="amdg"] –]

It is amazing how fast pride disappears when you look into an empty cash register....

[bolt_krank]

Still - I think it'll make for an interesting experiment. I want to see how things end up.

[canman]

Of people especially on Japan Today and a little bit on FG stating how the the number of rapes and other serious crimes that are committed by native Okinawans is much higher than that of the US military. It just is not relevant information. This is there country, the population is much greater, of course the number of such crimes by natives will be higher. But the US military members number only a small percentage of the population, but the number of crimes does seem to be fairly high. So I really don't think you can blame Okinawans for being angry and upset about what they see going on in their cities and towns.
I'd like to see if a foreigner did the same type of crime, rape, or murder in either the US or Canada, how we would demonize them and how they should be punished etc. Look at the Korean student who shot of the University of Virginia, how the Korean community was attacked over that.
But at the same time, I really wish NHK would have interviewed somebody under the age of 60 yesterday when asking them if they thought it was a good idea to ban all US citizens from going off base. Which leads me to another question, what if you are a civilian working for the DOD, are you too not allowed to shop or go to any bar? Or if you aren't military at all, but an English teacher or bar owner, what happens to them?

[Greji]

Look at the Korean student who shot of the University of Virginia, how the Korean community was attacked over that.

There were derogatory comments on Koreans following Virginia Tech, but they were made by a select small group of bigots and it didn't go far.

I don't recall many voices to get rid of all Koreans living in the states. But, then again, that's kind of apples and oranges!

Which leads me to another question, what if you are a civilian working for the DOD, are you too not allowed to shop or go to any bar? Or if you aren't military at all, but an English teacher or bar owner, what happens to them?

Any one who is employed by the US Forces and especially those with SOFA status and their families are subject to the orders of the Commander US Forces Japan, be they military, civilian, or otherwise. If they are not subject to courts martial, they maybe removed from their job, or relocated out of the theater as a result of failure to comply.

[D-San]

They lock down the bases everytime there is a serious incident involving a servicemember, this is not new. It's a good for both sides, but more so for the Military to say "Hey, we are doing SOMETHING".

Military members do alot to help Japan. I remember volunteering at orphanages and doing street cleanups all the time in japan. The Japanese citizens in our community loved us, not to mention what we do to help the local economies. Military guys get a bad rep, only because of a few dumbfucks.

For as many Japanese and smug Gaijin that oppose U.S. Military prescence in Japan, there are countless others who welcome us with open arms (and other appendages... ).

[Greji]

[quote="D-San"]They lock down the bases everytime there is a serious incident involving a servicemember, this is not new. It's a good for both sides, but more so for the Military to say "Hey, we are doing SOMETHING".

Military members do alot to help Japan. I remember volunteering at orphanages and doing street cleanups all the time in japan. The Japanese citizens in our community loved us, not to mention what we do to help the local economies. Military guys get a bad rep, only because of a few dumbfucks.

For as many Japanese and smug Gaijin that oppose U.S. Military prescence in Japan, there are countless others who welcome us with open arms (and other appendages...]

That's definitely worth an "attaboy"!

[ttjereth]

Of people especially on Japan Today and a little bit on FG stating how the the number of rapes and other serious crimes that are committed by native Okinawans is much higher than that of the US military. It just is not relevant information.
This is there country, the population is much greater, of course the number of such crimes by natives will be higher. But the US military members number only a small percentage of the population, but the number of crimes does seem to be fairly high. So I really don't think you can blame Okinawans for being angry and upset about what they see going on in their cities and towns.

It is relevant when you are talking about and comparing the public response to the incidents, on top of which I believe most sources aren't comparing overall number of incidents but per capita (or percentage of incidents by population) which makes the whole "the population is much greater" arugement moot.

No one is saying that "the crimes are okay because Okinawans and Japanese do it too" (I should hope not anyway, but I don't read everything), what we (me anyway) are saying is that the response to the crimes is blown all out of proportion because of who is committing them. In Okinawa traffic accidents involving a foreigner and a Japanese national, where the foreigner is considered to be at fault, receive national news coverage.

I'd like to see if a foreigner did the same type of crime, rape, or murder in either the US or Canada, how we would demonize them and how they should be punished etc. Look at the Korean student who shot of the University of Virginia, how the Korean community was attacked over that.
But at the same time, I really wish NHK would have interviewed somebody under the age of 60 yesterday when asking them if they thought it was a good idea to ban all US citizens from going off base. Which leads me to another question, what if you are a civilian working for the DOD, are you too not allowed to shop or go to any bar? Or if you aren't military at all, but an English teacher or bar owner, what happens to them?

It happens fairly often in the U.S. BTW how was the Korean community attacked over the Virginia Tech (not UoV) massacre? I didn't see a single report of any retalliation of any kind, you have a link?

From Wikipedia:

Tech students of South Korean descent initially feared they would be targeted for retribution.[70][71] No cases of discrimination against Asian Virginia Tech students were reported in the weeks following the shootings.[72]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Tech_massacre#Student_response


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Tech_massacre#_note-36

[ttjereth]

[halfnip]

Don't shop in the stores, drink in the bars, purchase goods made in Japan, etc...

Blasphemy! What the hell are we going to do then?

[Mulboyne]

Stars & Stripes: Japanese officials pleased with 'period of reflection'

CAMP FOSTER, Okinawa ― Japanese officials said Wednesday they are pleased the U.S. military on Okinawa is restricting personnel to their bases for a “period of reflection.” “The government welcomes the decision by the U.S. military to take strict measures,” a statement from the Foreign Ministry in Tokyo declared after reports that the U.S. military in Japan was taking steps to further curb off-base incidents by its members...The last servicewide liberty restriction on Okinawa was in the summer of 2000 when, just before the leaders of the world’s largest industrialized democracies met for the Group of Eight summit on Okinawa, three Marines and an airman were arrested in alcohol-related incidents. At that time a midnight curfew was imposed on all servicemembers and a ban was placed on the consumption and sale of alcohol on the bases after midnight.

[hundefar]

Apparently raping the locals isn't always enough.

Elizalde says he was an 18-year-old Marine playing spades on an Okinawa, Japan, base in November 1977 when he followed a staff sergeant to look for another party. As they walked through an empty Quonset hut, he says, the sergeant overpowered and raped him.

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