Accident in Amagasaki

[dimwit]

Watching the news and looks like a train, car and apartment building had a messy encounter in Takarazuka. TV say at least one dead 30 to 50 injuried. Sorry no links yet.

[Mulboyne]

Pictures from Asahi.com (Japanese).

[dimwit]

Found a link but only in Japanese

http://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/2005/04/25/k20050425000052.html

Somewhat grambled translation reads

25th morning, at the railroad crossing between the JR Fukuchiyama line Amagasaki station and the mound oral station of Hyogo prefecture Amagasaki city, the streetcar colliding with the car, after derailing, 1 struck to the apartment of railroad track side. According to the Hyogo prefectural police observing/thinking headquarters, it means that 2 people died in at this accident. Details such as name is not found. In addition the person who does the wound is from 50 to climb in about 60 people,, but the wound and the like detailed information, is not to have entered yet.

What amazes me is the fact that they allow apartment buildings to be build so close to railway lines. One would think that the possibility of a train taking out the support beams of a building and causing it to collaspe would discourage such practices.

[Mulboyne]

Kyodo in English:
Train overturns, scores feared injured in Hyogo Pref.
Dozens of people are feared injured after train cars derailed and overturned before hitting a car Monday morning in Amagasaki, Hyogo Prefecture, police and firefighters said. About 50-60 people are feared injured in the accident on JR West's Fukuchiyama Line, according to the police. Three cars of the train derailed and slammed into a car at around 9:20 a.m. The first car of the train had crashed into a condominium building along the track and the second and third cars had also derailed, the police said.

[FG Lurker]

Holy shit... I drove right by there yesterday. Tsugaguchi station accourding to that Japanese Asahi article.

That front car looks a real mess. Hope everyone got out alive.

[Mulboyne]

TBS News video clip

Windows
Real Player

[Midwinter]

CNN: http://edition.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/asiapcf/04/24/japan.trainsmash.ap/index.html

[Mulboyne]

NHK is reporting the latest (1:00pm JST) casualties as 28 dead and 239 injured.

[Kanchou]

The number is at 45 or so now.

[Naniwan Kid]

The U.S. News is reporting 37. Real tragic. It said the reletively new conductor has "overrun" the platform in Itami, and had to back up. He was running 90 seconds late...

[FG Lurker]

The U.S. News is reporting 37. Real tragic. It said the reletively new conductor has "overrun" the platform in Itami, and had to back up. He was running 90 seconds late...

Welcome back Naniwan Kid! Haven't seen you around for awhile.

The Japanese sites are also saying he was running behind, and there are comments from people on the train that it seemed to be traveling faster than usual. I feel bad for the driver -- 23 and under huge pressure to keep his schedule, he'll probably take the blame for the accident. Maybe keeping such perfect schedules isn't such a good thing.....

[Mulboyne]

The driver is reported to be still alive which seems incredible given the damage and casualties. Early reports had the front carriage plowing into the condo first but that may well be wrong.

[Big Booger]

Any gaijin injured or dead? What an accident. I think the driver made a mistake. That's just the way it is.

I feel for those killed. What a way to die.

[L S]

Still 5-6 people trapped in wreckage underbuilding according to NHK TV. Not sure if they are alive or not.

[amdg]

The U.S. News is reporting 37. Real tragic. It said the reletively new conductor has "overrun" the platform in Itami, and had to back up. He was running 90 seconds late...

Yeah that's right. So he was trying to make up for lost time between his position and the next station. The thing is, that the maximum safe speed for these trains is said to be 70km per hour. He was allegedly doing 130 km/h - around a curve in the tracks – while at the same time reporting to the station staff via radio.

[FG Lurker]

[quote="amdg"]The thing is, that the maximum safe speed for these trains is said to be 70km per hour. He was allegedly doing 130 km/h - around a curve in the tracks &#8211]
Holy shit... If 130km/hr is accurate then he really fucked up.

The JR trains always run quite a bit faster when they are behind though -- usually noticeably so.

[dimwit]

The funny thing is that no one seems to be talking about the fact that city allowed a high rise apartment to be built 6 meters from the bend in a train track. To me the question of an accident is not whether but when. Talk about non-planning.

[kotatsuneko]

like all commercial accidents, this is terrible.

i remember the day after the Paddington crash, our local sainsburys was closed for around 2 weeks as they used the huge carpark as a temporary morgue, there were so many bodies.

going past there on the bus at night was something i`d rather not remember.

[dimwit]

The death toll continues to climb and has now reached 69. Meanwhile the search for survivors and scapegoat continues. Right now, they are blaming stones on the track.

http://www.japantoday.com/e/?content=news&cat=&id=335311

In a large scale accident such as this, it is unlikely the a single cause is blame, but rather complex chain of events.

My guess as to the causes are these:

1. Zoning. Allowing apartments to be built 6 meters from a rail line is insanity. When (not if) there is an accident, either the apartment will give or the train. Either way, there will be a lot of causalities. Many cities opt to put railways underground in built-up urban areas to reduce the risk of accidents.

2. Design. Either the train was travelling faster than it was designed to do or the maximum speed rating of the curve was too high. My guess is that engineers never properly tested the maximum safe speed at which a train could travel around the bend.

3. Equipment. The area of the track lacked an automatic breaking system and given the layout of the tracks in the area weaving between buildings, one would think that such an area would have been a priority.

4. Training. If reports are correct and driver was sped to make up for lost time and keep on schedule it is a pretty good indication that JR suffers from Getthereitis, a condition common in commercial airlines, in which pilots commonly ignore safety concerns to keep on schedule. This is an indication the training lacks a safety-first mentality.

My guess is that investigators will ignore 1 and probably 4. 2 may also be ignored unless the press starts asking questions. Therefore cause 3 plus driver uneperience starts asking questions. Therefore, cause 3 plus driver unexperience will be blamed.

[guriguri247365]

Found a link but only in Japanese

http://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/2005/04/25/k20050425000052.html

Somewhat grambled translation reads

25th morning, at the railroad crossing between the JR Fukuchiyama line Amagasaki station and the mound oral station of Hyogo prefecture Amagasaki city, the streetcar colliding with the car, after derailing, 1 struck to the apartment of railroad track side. According to the Hyogo prefectural police observing/thinking headquarters, it means that 2 people died in at this accident. Details such as name is not found. In addition the person who does the wound is from 50 to climb in about 60 people,, but the wound and the like detailed information, is not to have entered yet.

What amazes me is the fact that they allow apartment buildings to be build so close to railway lines. One would think that the possibility of a train taking out the support beams of a building and causing it to collaspe would discourage such practices.

You give the Japanese too much credit to think that logically

[Watcher]

As I understand it... with the JGF giving the details... the 23 year old driver had done this before. Last year he had been busted for missing stops (by 100 meters!) and sleeping when he was the manning the rear. JR took him off duty and retrained him. Satisfied they put him back in service. He missed a stop yesterday by an initially reported 8 meters which was then updated to 40 meters. I'm sorry... but missing stops by 100m and 40 meters is pretty freakin' bad. Where was the rear engineer? This driver clearly should not have been operating a train and the rear engineer who is able to just as well monitor the operation should have taken a more proactive stance (I can't imagine anyone being a subordinate to a 23 year old at JR). Nevertheless, I do not blame the driver. I blame the company who clearly were aware of issues and did not take enough measures to protect the passengers.
I used to ride the JR from Osaka out to Nara and those drivers always seemed pretty much on top of things.... not late and always pointing at the signals... had to put on a good show for the otaku in the peanut gallery (glass behind driver). I never felt we were in an unsafe position.
The schedule is not unattainable as it has been followed without error time and again year after year. Why as this time so different?

[Kuang_Grade]

In looking at some of the photos, it occured to me that: 1) I bet that apt. building was build to Post Great Hanshin Earthquake specs (it looks fairly recent) and 2) It looks like you could open up J rail cars with a can opener.

http://www.asahi.com/english/Herald-asahi/TKY200504260136.html

Railway experts suggested the damage was exacerbated by the switchover to stainless steel from regular steel to build train cars. This was done to reduce maintenance costs and weight.

The vulnerability of light-weight train cars came under the spotlight after a Hibiya Line train in Tokyo derailed in March 2000, killing five people and injuring 64. The train cars had aluminum bodies.

[bunchoffuckinggoofs]

That accident in 2000 scared the hell out of me and my family. My wife was mentioning the move to stainless steel again after this accident. This is just terrible. I have not been able to find much information on the 1963 accident in Tsurumi. I used to live there so I have been trying to find out how three trains managed to collide.

[Mulboyne]

Photo: Asahi

[Ketou]

In looking at some of the photos, it occured to me that: 1) I bet that apt. building was build to Post Great Hanshin Earthquake specs (it looks fairly recent) and 2) It looks like you could open up J rail cars with a can opener.

The building is a recent one. They were showing a four year old video of a train running on that line on T.V. and there was an older building there then.
As for opening them up with a can opener, think of the force of that accident.
E=MC2!! There was a hell of a lot of force squashing those cars, especially if the driver really was doing 130kmh.

[FG Lurker]

Seems the toll has climbed to 89.

JT also says that there are 52 people "unaccounted for". I wonder what they mean by that? It could mean that 52 of the 89 found have not been identified yet, or that relatives are asking about 52 more people then they have found.

[Kuang_Grade]

As for opening them up with a can opener, think of the force of that accident.
E=MC2!! There was a hell of a lot of force squashing those cars, especially if the driver really was doing 130kmh.

No doubt....but it looks like those cars have strength on the horizontal axis (the front of the third car looks like it took the impact well from a structural standpoint) but much less strength on the vertical or side axis....it really looks like the first car wrapped itself around the building and broke open.

[Mulboyne]

Any gaijin injured or dead?

Korea Times: Two S. Koreans Killed in Japan's Train Crash

Two South Koreans were confirmed killed in Monday's train crash in Japan, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade said Tuesday. The crash left at least 73 people dead and over 440 injured when the seven-car train derailed near Osaka and slammed into the first floor of an apartment complex. Among the dead was a South Korean woman, identified only as Jeon, 35, and the injured also included a 50-year-old Korean man, with the surname Yang. Both were residents of Japan, the ministry said. Yang's injuries were serious and he remains unconscious, the ministry said.

The Philippine authorities say they have confirmed none of their citizens were involved in the crash

[dimwit]

Ok here is a question
.

There were supposedly 580 passengers and crew on the train and now according to the latest estimate 95 are dead and 458 injuried with 20 still inside the train. Yet we know the conductor at the back of the train was uninjuried, and we can assume that some of the passengers in the rear cars were probably in the same state. So how many yak insurance frauds turned up claiming injuries?

[FG Lurker]

Ok here is a question
.

There were supposedly 580 passengers and crew on the train and now according to the latest estimate 95 are dead and 458 injuried with 20 still inside the train. Yet we know the conductor at the back of the train was uninjuried, and we can assume that some of the passengers in the rear cars were probably in the same state. So how many yak insurance frauds turned up claiming injuries?

Why didn't you mention this before? I coulda hussled my ass over there and got in on the action!