Contract dispute

[Pinkerton]

So, I'm having a minor contract dispute with one of the companies I am working with.

They are requiring that I show up 15 minutes before a job starts and do prep-work. It's written in the contract that I must be there 15 minutes before hand and that I get paid an hourly rate, however they refuse to pay for my time (the 15 minutes). All things considered, this is a small thing, but I do a good deal of work and these unpaid 15 minutes are adding up to 2 hours of work a week. They have also started micro managing the hell out of me and I have decided that I won't be working with them much longer. I am fairly certain that they are pissing all over me and calling it rain. I am looking to take what they owe me, but not sure what my next move should be. I need to take things to the next level.

Any advice of which gov't office to visit to make a formal complaint regarding unpaid wages? One that can speak a little English is also helpful.

Thanks in advance,
Pink

[kurogane]

I am fairly certain that they are pissing all over me and calling it rain.

To a man in the Sahara a camel's backsplash is as fresh spring water ????

To channel my Inner PaulH for a second, I would suggest they could and probably will argue that the 15 minutes Prep Time is included in the calculation of the hourly rate agreed to in your contract. Your local Hello Work office would be a good place to start as far as consultations over labour standards go, I would hope, and how much longer do you think you'll be with these jerks? Anything around 6 months and I would say grin and bear it. Good luck.

[Pinkerton]

Thanks. To be honest, I'm just hoping they will fire me at this point. I have a high level disdain for them at this point.

[kurogane]

I can dig that. It really depends on how much you need them and their filthy underpaid monies. As PaulH might have said: "You can't crack a nut by knuckling under".....................or some such incoherent shiite. I will remind you that getting fired is rarely all that advisable, so the middle of the road option might be to work strenuously towards motivating them to simply not renenew the contract, assuming that is soon enough that it's bearable.

Anyways, chin up, hope all the other stuff is good.

[Pinkerton]

Yeah, I'm pretty much done with them. I doubt there will be a re-contract and I couldn't care less.

I want the money, well cause it's mine, but also cause they are swine. The company in question is actually already involved with several lawsuits and I would like to twist the knife just a little more.

[Pinkerton]

How can I find the closest hello work office?

[kurogane]

How can I find the closest hello work office?

Have you tried this new Internet thing?

http://www.mhlw.go.jp/kyujin/hwmap.html

I didn't see an English Info page. If you need language help just give us a prefecture and we'll help.

At any rate, do screw them all you can, and good luck screwing them. I hate meaniepants employers.

[Yokohammer]

Except that ... if they're already involved in multiple lawsuits they're probably the kind of people who simply don't give a shit. SOP for that type is to carry on as long as possible, then simply fold the business and start up again under a new name. Distancing oneself as quickly as possible, before it becomes a long drawn-out and losing battle with utterly unprincipled swine, is probably the smartest approach. Minimize losses and move on ASAP.

[wagyl]

I add a voice to say that there are principles, and there are principles. Much as it may leave a nasty taste in your mouth, it is often better from a value gained for time spent view, and from a preserving your own sanity view, to walk away. Of course the employer is also relying on you realising this. I very much recognise that outrage at "I don't want them to benefit from their evil" but that feeling also once lead me to stick around longer than was good for my health and sanity at one place.

Also, remember, if we are talking about a contract that will come up for renewal, it is also one of your options to not renew. You don't have to try to force them not to renew. There is no shame in turning down work because of a toxic work environment.

Kuro keeps directing people to Hello Work with these issues. I am certain that Hello Work will say that this is not their area and they will then direct you to the Labour Standards Bureau. Finding this via Hello Work might be your best bet because for the life of me I can't find a list of Labour Standards Bureau and their jurisdictions on the internet.

[kurogane]

Hello Work does seem to be the first stop shop for a lot of labour related issues for The Natives, which is why I say that. Whether they actually are of any help would require OPs on labour issue threads to log back in and report on their experience.

[wagyl]

Wot we duz, in English. http://www.mhlw.go.jp/english/policy/em ... ndards.pdf
(Is that kerning all over the place for everybody, or is my pdf-in-browser viewer going spastic?)

I will also say that when I had a non-payment by employer issue, I first went to Hello Work and there were two or three visits with a particular guy there before he told me that pursuing backpayment was nothing to do with Hello Work. Mate, you can save yourself time, and save me time, by telling me that first contact!

[Pinkerton]

Hey everyone, thanks for the advice. The company in question is actually a very long running NGO which I'm guessing is going to fold in the next 3 years. That is neither here nor there, however.

I seems like the Labour Standards Bureau is the place I actually need to contact. I live on the east side of Tokyo. can anyone point in the right direction for an office?

[wagyl]

It is more tied to the location of the employer rather than your residence. If central, The office at Kudan also caters for hairy guys who smell of butter which is a two bird stone.

Note that that pdf is not a full list of offices and their jurisdictions. It is the list of those with advisors for foreign workers. Not all of those consult in English, and all other offices can help you in Japanese, so I am not really sure what an advisor for foreign workers who does not speak English does that is any different from what other advisors do, and why this shorter list exists. Maybe they don't want to admit that they have Portuguese or Mandarin speakers, judging by locations.

Page 8 (p 190) of https://www.hataraku.metro.tokyo.jp/sod ... oguchi.pdf has a list of Labour Standards inspection Offices in Tokyo, showing how many there are and their jurisdictions. That pdf also points to a consultation service provided by Tokyo Metropolitan Government, which overlaps to a degree.

[Pinkerton]

Thanks wagyl. I'll take a look and see if I can make sense of it all.

[Pinkerton]

Looks like I should go into this branch. They have English assistance from 2 to 4pm everyday.

Labor Consultation Center (Iidabashi）

Tokyo Shigoto Center
9F,3-10-3 Iidabashi，
Chiyoda-ku,Tokyo

千代田区飯田橋
3-10-3
東京しごとセンター9F

I've already tried google mapping it in English and Japanese, which has been sadly unhelpful. why must every address in Japan being treasure hunt?

[wagyl]

No problem if you leave out extraneous details like floor number https://www.google.co.jp/maps/place/3+C ... fd821dc895 Part of the Tomin Tower building, with other metropolitan government functions.

Note that this is a metropolitan government service, not a national government one. I frankly do not know what difference that makes, either globally or specifically to your situation. If you get no joy there, the Labour Standards Bureau option still exists, not that I advocate forum shopping, but if they are going to duplicate services between the levels of government, well, they are just asking for it.

[kurogane]

Ta da!!!!!!!!!!!!!
https://www.google.ca/maps/place/%E6%9D ... a903?hl=en

HINT: you have to get rid of little details like the 9F thingy at the end. Anyhoo, good luck, and if you get a chance let us know how it goes.

[Pinkerton]

Ta da!!!!!!!!!!!!!
https://www.google.ca/maps/place/%E6%9D ... a903?hl=en

HINT: you have to get rid of little details like the 9F thingy at the end. Anyhoo, good luck, and if you get a chance let us know how it goes.

Thanks for the heads up. I tried doing that, but I was unsuccessful. I've always had a hard google mapping anything in Japan. Most other countries, no problem.

[Pinkerton]

No problem if you leave out extraneous details like floor number https://www.google.co.jp/maps/place/3+C ... fd821dc895 Part of the Tomin Tower building, with other metropolitan government functions.

Note that this is a metropolitan government service, not a national government one. I frankly do not know what difference that makes, either globally or specifically to your situation. If you get no joy there, the Labour Standards Bureau option still exists, not that I advocate forum shopping, but if they are going to duplicate services between the levels of government, well, they are just asking for it.

Thanks for pointing that out. Maybe I should hit up the labor standards bureau first. Gonna head in there today and see what they say.

[Pinkerton]

wow, talk about tits on a bull! All these gov't agencies are entirely useless. They basically said that they could talk to my company but they have no power to enforce anything.

[Salty]

wow, talk about tits on a bull! All these gov't agencies are entirely useless. They basically said that they could talk to my company but they have no power to enforce anything.

Sorry Pink...

Even with a lawyer and a court case, if it were to come to that, I suspect that you would lose. A company is within their rights to ask employees to arrive early and be prepared to start work at the appointed time. Whether 15 minutes is legally unreasonable would be the point of contention. I suspect that a court would rule that it is reasonable.

I`d chaulk this one up to a `learning experience` and move on....

[Russell]

When I was young I worked for a software company, and they also required me to come in early, so that I would be able to attend their "morning speech". In their case that amounted to standing for 10 minutes, during which that day's part of a 4-hour tape was played in which a guy explained how to lead a good life, "good" meaning here "good for the company" mixed with all kinds of semi-religious philosophical BS.

This was followed by a 5 minutes talk about the sales figures of the previous day.

I always went for my morning shit during those minutes, since it was not yet working time...

[Coligny]

You resigned after their successful gas attack in the Tokyo subway ?

[Russell]

You resigned after their successful gas attack in the Tokyo subway ?

Nope, I resigned well before that.

[Coligny]

You resigned after their successful gas attack in the Tokyo subway ?

Nope, I resigned well before that.

When Hiroshima was bombed ?

[Russell]

You resigned after their successful gas attack in the Tokyo subway ?

Nope, I resigned well before that.

When Hiroshima was bombed ?

Well after that.

Fortunately.

Because I was in the Hiroshima office of that company...

[Mike Oxlong]

You resigned after their successful gas attack in the Tokyo subway ?

Nope, I resigned well before that.

When Hiroshima was bombed ?

Well after that.

Fortunately.

Because I was in the Hiroshima office of that company...

There was a decade or so of student unrest and protest you could have been involved in, rather than being a hibakusha...

[Russell]

You resigned after their successful gas attack in the Tokyo subway ?

Nope, I resigned well before that.

When Hiroshima was bombed ?

Well after that.

Fortunately.

Because I was in the Hiroshima office of that company...

There was a decade or so of student unrest and protest you could have been involved in, rather than being a hibakusha...

I am not that old (assuming you speak of the student protests in the 60's and 70's).

[Salty]

I had a similar experience in a firm here long ago. At the end of the day we had a rotating speech time, and if the person was long-winded, I would miss my train. So I always stood at the back, near a hallway which allowed me to back-step, and make my escape.

Same company - … Their OT calculation chart had built-in 15 minute breaks every hour, so you were only paid for 45 minutes of work.

[kurogane]

A company is within their rights to ask employees to arrive early and be prepared to start work at the appointed time. Whether 15 minutes is legally unreasonable would be the point of contention. I suspect that a court would rule that it is reasonable.

INITIAL RESPONSE TO THIS THREAD...........To channel my Inner PaulH for a second, I would suggest they could and probably will argue that the 15 minutes Prep Time is included in the calculation of the hourly rate agreed to in your contract. .

TOTAL DIBS!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sadly, it is likely as you say. I actually don't see expecting a worker to show up ready to work as unreasonable, but it sounds like Pinky has found some Aholes. Sorry Pinky I find it alarming that an NGO would be such an infamously shiite employer, but I admit to being unworldly in these things.

Thanks for checking back in, and Good luck, fair Pinkerton.