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  • fuckedgaijin ‹ General ‹ Media Fix

It's official: Sony f'ed up

Movies, TV, music, anime other random J-pop culture phenomenons. Also film/video production, technical discussion, cast and crew calls, etc.
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Postby FG Lurker » Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:12 pm

2triky wrote:Definitely a huge gaff but can't they still threaten to brick your console as a countermeasure? Don't know, just asking.

There is nothing they can do as the public and private encryption keys used by the PS3 are now known.

Let's say Sony decides to "do a Microsoft" and send a challenge of some sort to the console to see if it has been rooted. As the encryption keys are known the challenge can be intercepted, decrypted, and the appropriate answer can be generated, encrypted, and returned. There is no way Sony can tell if the original firmware generated the response or if some other software did.

This all came about because Sony decided to remove the feature that allowed Linux to run on the PS3. No one really bothered trying to attack the PS3's security as Sony allowed homebrew software onto the unit (via Linux) from the time it was new. About a year ago Sony changed their minds and forced an update onto existing consoles to remove this feature and block people from using Linux. Understandably this pissed off a lot of people (it was a big reason they had bought the console!) and the result is what we see now.

Sony really, really shot themselves in the foot with this. It also means that the PS4 won't be able to be backwards compatible with the PS3 unless they are willing to leave this massive hole wide open. (Which I can't imagine they are!)
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Postby 2triky » Thu Jan 06, 2011 1:39 am

Thanks for the explanation. I get it now.
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Postby 2triky » Thu Jan 06, 2011 1:43 am

Taka-Okami wrote:They wont be able to brick shit as basically we now have the master keys. I read somewhere that the hid the psp master keys in there as well, so now the psp is fully open ha ha.


As with the old game Mortal Kombat, I guess that's what they would call a "fatality."

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Postby FG Lurker » Thu Jan 06, 2011 3:22 am

It's too bad in a way too, because Sony had a good thing going with allowing Linux onto the PS3. The homebrewers were happy as they had access to most of the PS3 hardware. Pirates were kept out as there was no direct access to the PS3 gaming system.

Now though the PS3 is completely open. Good for the homebrew world but game copies will now be everywhere as well. Sucks for software houses.

Microsoft on the other hand must be laughing their asses off. They now have the only secure console and no doubt this will help them attract more games to their platform.
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Postby Coligny » Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:52 am

2triky wrote:Definitely a huge gaff but can't they still threaten to brick your console as a countermeasure? Don't know, just asking.


The removal of linux functionality was a big self inflicted shot in the feet.

Remote bricking would be like a bullet in the head. Legally speaking it would be the worst idea in the history of bad ideas...
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Postby Coligny » Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:55 am

FG Lurker wrote:
Microsoft on the other hand must be laughing their asses off. They now have the only secure console and no doubt this will help them attract more games to their platform.


I don't have any of those fancy schmancy TV games... but I'm quite sure the XB360 has been cracked to run anything...
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Postby 2triky » Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:55 am

Coligny wrote:The removal of linux functionality was a big self inflicted shot in the feet.

Remote bricking would be like a bullet in the head. Legally speaking it would be the worst idea in the history of bad ideas...


I don't disagree with your point, but it seems Sony hasn't approached the issue(s) with a certain degree of foresight. In other words, I don't know what to expect going forward.
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Postby Kuang_Grade » Sun Jan 09, 2011 5:24 am

Just as point of comparison, MS doesn't brick the system where they detect piracy/hacking, they just ban it from xbox live, which prevents system updates and all online interactions. Given the popularity of Xbox live, this is a bit of deterrent to some but not necessarily all folks.
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/consoleban

While Sony could possibly do something similar, given the much less vibrant online community and near universal hatred Sony's seemingly monthly required system updates (nothing like sitting down to play a game to be told to come back in 20 minutes because it PS3 needs to update NOW!!!...At least MS gives you the choice to install now or later when they push down an update once or twice a year (although it doesn't allow you to connect to xbox live again until you accept the update), this likely wouldn't be seen as much as a stick as it is on the 360.
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Postby wuchan » Sun Jan 09, 2011 11:09 am

Sony has been good about taking care of cheaters using their own software. If a few people report a player sony looks into it. If they are found breaking Playstation Network (PSN) rules, sony bans the user account. If the person continues to break the rules on other accounts, Sony bans the users IP and the MAC address of the console. Gamers have tried to sue Sony after their machines were banned but the courts throw the cases out.
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Postby FG Lurker » Sun Jan 09, 2011 12:58 pm

wuchan wrote:If the person continues to break the rules on other accounts, Sony bans the users IP and the MAC address of the console.

With an open system it may become possible to spoof the console's MAC address and most people's IPs aren't constant these days, so...
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Postby 2triky » Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:15 am

http://www.joystiq.com/2011/01/11/report-sony-could-remotely-disable-jailbroken-ps3s/
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Postby IparryU » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:49 am

2triky wrote:http://www.joystiq.com/2011/01/11/report-sony-could-remotely-disable-jailbroken-ps3s/

gotta love Sony, such fucked up customer service, so many hacks... gotta love it.
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Postby 2triky » Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:38 am

Sony asks for restraining order against Geohot, fail0verflow over PS3 exploits
By Ross Miller posted Jan 11th 2011 9:35PM

We knew Sony would be non-plussed about the PlayStation 3 jailbreak, and now we have a better idea as to the full extent of its anger. The company has filed suit (not yet, see below) asked for a restraining order against George "Geohot" Hotz, the "hacking group" fail0verflow (Hector Cantero, Sven Peter, "Bushing," and "Segher"), and numerous John / Jane Does over the exploit and its release. To be more specific, the company cites violations of Digital Millennium Copyright Act, the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, various copyright infringements, and other acts of binary malfeasance. A temporary restraining order has also been sought, asking that all "circumvention tools" be taken offline and his computers and related media (i.e. anything storing said tools) be impounded. It looks like Geohot's servers are being slammed at the moment, so we've gone ahead and hosted the relevant PDFs ourselves below. We're still sifting through ourselves and will let you know what we unearth.

Update: Nilay here -- let's take a look at what's going on. This isn't a "lawsuit" in the traditional sense, since Sony hasn't filed a complaint for copyright infringement or whatever against Geohot and friends. Instead, the company appears to be trying to shove the genie back in the bottle and have the jailbreak and any information about the jailbreak removed from the web by filing a temporary restraining order. That might work in the short term -- Geohot's already pulled his pages down -- but history suggests that the forces of paperwork rarely triumph over the righteous anger of nerds, and that this code is out there for good. That said, we'll see what the court says tomorrow; although we very much doubt Sony's melodramatic proposed motion and order will be granted as written, we wouldn't be surprised if some sort of order is eventually granted -- and then from there a formal lawsuit is likely just a few days away.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/11/sony-sues-geohot-fail0verflow-over-ps3-exploits/
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Postby FG Lurker » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:19 am

Sony fails completely at engineering and quality so they turn to lawsuits. Color me surprised. I wonder if they will be around in 10 years? It wouldn't surprise me if they weren't if they don't pull their heads out of their asses soon.
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Postby 2triky » Sat Jan 15, 2011 3:44 pm

Carnegie Mellon Professor Backs PlayStation 3 Hackers
By Mike Sharkey | Jan 13, 2011

Hackers gain support from prominent free speech activist, claim they only want OtherOS back.

Citing free speech, a Carnegie Mellon University professor is hosting the files embattled hacker George "GeoHot" Hotz used to crack the PlayStation 3. Oh, and the prof also said Sony is "breathtakingly stupid" for sicking its legal team on Hotz and the hacking group known as FailOverflow.

Shortly after Hotz revealed he was being sued by Sony, David Touretzky, a research professor in the Computer Science department at Carnegie Mellon, created a mirror site for Hotz's PS3 exploits on the Pittsburgh university's servers.


"Our friends at Sony are having another bad day: i.e., doing something breathtakingly stupid, presumably because they don't know any better," Touretzky wrote.

"Free speech (and free computing) rights exist only for those determined to exercise them. Trying to suppress those rights in the Internet age is like spitting in the wind. We will help our friends at Sony understand this by mirroring the geohot jailbreak files at Carnegie Mellon."

Meanwhile, members of the FailOverflow group posted a response to Sony's lawsuit on their web site, stating they do not condone piracy. "Our motivation was Sony's removal of OtherOS. Our exclusive goal was, is, and always has been to get OtherOS back."

Hotz, the 21 year old who made a name for himself by cracking the iPhone, told BBC News he's disappointed by Sony's action. "I have spoken with legal counsel and I feel comfortable that Sony's action against me doesn't have any basis."


Sharkey says: I admire Touretzky's efforts to protect free speech, but in this case, I think he'd be better off advising Hotz et al to quickly settle and do as Sony asks, getting rid of any and all PS3 exploits. Right or wrong, Sony has the resources to string this thing out for years, likely costing these guys hundreds of thousands of dollars in legal fees. And for what? Because they want to be able to run Linux on a video game console? Wikileaks this ain't.


http://ps3.gamespy.com/articles/114/1143927p1.html
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Postby Coligny » Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:03 am

2triky wrote:Sony asks for restraining order against Geohot, fail0verflow over PS3 exploits
By Ross Miller posted Jan 11th 2011 9:35PM

We knew Sony would be non-plussed about the PlayStation 3 jailbreak, and now we have a better idea as to the full extent of its anger. The company has filed suit (not yet, see below) asked for a restraining order against George "Geohot" Hotz, the "hacking group" fail0verflow (Hector Cantero, Sven Peter, "Bushing," and "Segher"), and numerous John / Jane Does over the exploit and its release. To be more specific, the company cites violations of Digital Millennium Copyright Act, the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, various copyright infringements, and other acts of binary malfeasance. A temporary restraining order has also been sought, asking that all "circumvention tools" be taken offline and his computers and related media (i.e. anything storing said tools) be impounded. It looks like Geohot's servers are being slammed at the moment, so we've gone ahead and hosted the relevant PDFs ourselves below. We're still sifting through ourselves and will let you know what we unearth.

Update: Nilay here -- let's take a look at what's going on. This isn't a "lawsuit" in the traditional sense, since Sony hasn't filed a complaint for copyright infringement or whatever against Geohot and friends. Instead, the company appears to be trying to shove the genie back in the bottle and have the jailbreak and any information about the jailbreak removed from the web by filing a temporary restraining order. That might work in the short term -- Geohot's already pulled his pages down -- but history suggests that the forces of paperwork rarely triumph over the righteous anger of nerds, and that this code is out there for good. That said, we'll see what the court says tomorrow]http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/11/sony-sues-geohot-fail0verflow-over-ps3-exploits/[/URL]


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Postby FG Lurker » Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:08 pm

Coligny wrote:T-shirt selling with the code printed in the back in 3-2-1...

Sony's lawyers already published nearly the entire key set in one of the lawsuit filings. :doh:

(I think ~56bits are missing from the public key but that's more than brute-forceable these days.)
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Postby 2triky » Sun Jan 30, 2011 5:50 am

PS3 firmware 3.56 hacked in less than a day, Sony's lawyers look confused
By Nilay Patel posted Jan 29th 2011 2:35PM

Sony's taken some strong steps against PS3 cracking in the past week -- not only has it taken to the courts and won a temporary restraining order against Geohot and fail0verflow for cracking the console, but it also released firmware 3.56, which locked things down again. Unfortunately, that restraining order doesn't mean anyone else has to stop a-crackin', and wouldn't you know it: 3.56 was cracked open in less than a day by KaKaRoToKS, who was behind one of the first 3.55 custom firmwares. Now that the 3.56 signing keys are out, we'd guess updated custom firmware is soon to come -- and we'd bet Sony's lawsuit will just inspire an entirely new wave of people to jailbreak once those hit the scene. Way to put that genie back in the bottle, Sony.

Source: Engadget
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Postby Yokohammer » Sun Jan 30, 2011 7:21 am

2triky wrote:PS3 firmware 3.56 hacked in less than a day, Sony's lawyers look confused
... Way to put that genie back in the bottle, Sony.

Had a good laugh about this. It is turning out exactly as predicted in this very thread!

Seriously, Sony turns out some pretty good product from time to time, but who the hell is in charge of software? Or is it software-related strategy/policy? Whoever it is hasn't got a farkin' clue. I'm guessing it's probably some insecure geezer(s) who can't even operate a TV remote properly who's abusing his (their) authority over a team of capable programmers. In short, the heads-up-arse management won't let the savvy staff do their jobs properly. Pretty much SOP in the big, old corporations that can't keep up.

At least the results are amusing.
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Postby FG Lurker » Sun Jan 30, 2011 8:47 am

"Way to put that genie back in the bottle, Sony."

Sony should wise up and realize the genie isn't going back into the bottle... At least they could save on lawyer fees and not need to spend so much fixing stupid PR gaffs.
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Postby 2triky » Mon Jan 31, 2011 4:20 am

Yokohammer wrote:Had a good laugh about this. It is turning out exactly as predicted in this very thread!

Seriously, Sony turns out some pretty good product from time to time, but who the hell is in charge of software? Or is it software-related strategy/policy? Whoever it is hasn't got a farkin' clue. I'm guessing it's probably some insecure geezer(s) who can't even operate a TV remote properly who's abusing his (their) authority over a team of capable programmers. In short, the heads-up-arse management won't let the savvy staff do their jobs properly. Pretty much SOP in the big, old corporations that can't keep up.

At least the results are amusing.


Hehe. Funny stuff, man. This saga is turning into quite the farce.
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Postby 2triky » Mon Jan 31, 2011 4:23 am

FG Lurker wrote:Sony should wise up and realize the genie isn't going back into the bottle...


Indeed. At this point the genie is a runaway dog who ain't ever going back home.
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Postby Coligny » Mon Jan 31, 2011 10:54 am

2triky wrote:Indeed. At this point the genie is a runaway dog who ain't ever going back home.


And peeps not even interested in the PS3 will start h4x0r1ng the firmware just for shit and giggles...
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Postby 2triky » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:12 am

Coligny wrote:And peeps not even interested in the PS3 will start h4x0r1ng the firmware just for shit and giggles...


Yes, I think it's gotten to that point, really. Bragging rights and noteriety, I guess.
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Postby IparryU » Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:38 pm

Coligny wrote:And peeps not even interested in the PS3 willy start h4x0r1ng the firmware just for shit and giggles...

that is pretty much what i do with my PSP. dont need most the hacks, i just do it to say i did...

my next project is the PS3, but i dont wanna fug anything up cause i want to play Super Street Fighter still, the time will come though :)
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Postby Coligny » Mon Jan 31, 2011 3:20 pm

I was OBLIGED to hack my PSP to run my copy of Maplus (GPS Software) from memory stick. Using it from the disk was making any route calculation so long that it was continually in need of recalculating to make it for the time lost between my position at the start of the recalculation and my position at the end... Incredibly dangerous...


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It ain't all bad news

Postby 2triky » Tue Feb 08, 2011 7:38 am

Sony Reports 3Q Earnings
By Mike Sharkey | Feb 3, 2011
Games division, generating major losses just two years ago, now on fire.

Lower production costs of the PlayStation 3 console and strong software sales propelled Sony's PlayStation division to a $564 million profit in its third quarter, the Japanese tech giant reported, an impressive leap of 135% compared to third quarter 2009.

The hefty profit for Sony's Network Products and Services division is even more impressive given recent history. Just two years ago, the PlayStation division reported an operating loss of $338 million.


Given the results, Sony said it now expects to sell 15 million PlayStation 3 consoles for fiscal year 2011 (ending March 31). That's 2 million more PS3s than the company sold in 2009.

With the PSP2 on the horizon and a roster of AAA PS3 exclusives on the way, SCE President Kazuo Hirai said the company expects to see further growth in its games division in fiscal 2011 and beyond. Notably, Hirai said Sony projects PlayStation Network will generate more than $3 billion in revenue in fiscal 2012.

http://ps3.gamespy.com/articles/114/1147669p1.html
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Postby Kuang_Grade » Tue Feb 08, 2011 12:08 pm

Those improved profits in the Networked (Playstation and Vaio) products came when revenue actually dropped about 6% from Q3 09.....and while PS3 and PSP hardware sales were either stagnate or down slightly from Q3 09...so it is coming from better cost controls and PS3 install base getting large enough that they can now actually sell a decent number of games month in/month out as well. And, at least in the US, Sony threw around at ton of promo money in December (and has continued to do so in 2011. in the form of $50 gift cards with the purchase of PS3 at major US retailers) on the PS3 and all they managed to do was end up a below 2009 Q3 levels
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Postby 2triky » Fri Feb 25, 2011 7:18 pm

After raid, hacker releases 'bible' for PS3 reverse engineering
by Elinor Mills

A Playstation 3 hacker says he has released information about reverse engineering hypervisor technology used in the PS3 after his home in Germany was raided earlier this week, reportedly at Sony's request.

In a comment to a post on his PS3 Linux and Hyper Reverse Engineering Blog, Graf-chokolo writes in the comments section: "Guys, SONY was today at my home with police and got all my stuff and accounts. So be careful from now on."

After several readers expressed doubt about the legitimacy of the post, he says in another comment: "Guys, I don't joke, it's serious. And to prove it, I kept my word and uploaded all my HV reversing stuff. Upload it everywhere so SONY couldn't remove it easily. Grab it guys, it contains lots of knowledge about HV and HV procs."

He writes: "Here is my HV bible" and provides four links to sites where he placed his files. As of this afternoon, the files had been removed from three of the sites, with one of the sites citing a copyright complaint.

Sony did not immediately respond to an e-mail request for comment, but gaming news site Kotaku reported that a representative from Sony Computer Entertainment Europe had confirmed the raid.

Sony is taking aggressive action against PS3 hackers. Last month, Sony requested a restraining order against George Hotz for releasing a jailbreak for firmware version 3.55 that allowed people to run home brew applications on the console. Sony says the action violates the Digital Millennium Copyright Act and the Computer Fraud Abuse Act, but Hotz disagrees. Game consoles are not mentioned in the DMCA. A U.S. District Court ruled in Sony's favor, granting a temporary restraining order

http://news.cnet.com/8301-27080_3-20036111-245.html#ixzz1ExrSolgK
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Postby matsuki » Mon Feb 28, 2011 9:57 am

LOL, soo much non profitable effort here that probably decreases sales and just drags the company image in the mud...lame lame lame.
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