Quick language question

[Crispy]

I feel like an idiot for not knowing this, but I kind of have an excuse: Japanese teachers keep changing the subject when I ask them, and Japanese just giggle and don't give me any input over whether I am right or not. When addressing someone whom you don't know their name, which 2nd person pronoun do you use, and when? This has frustrated me for a long time, and I sure as hell wanna know it before I go over there.

[Crispy]

I dunno, you tell me. I got the idea that anata was not to be used with people you don't know. Again, a vague idea, sensei refuses to give me a straight answer, and Japanese just giggle.

[Crispy]

Well, most Japanese (and mostly females) I talked to (exchange students) never really got past the phase where they are shocked I speak any Japanese. Also, they speak English much better than I speak Japanese, and are in this country to practice it, so our conversations keep drifting into using English. They aren't all that useful for language learning, I really need to interact with Japanese who do not speak English. Oh well, that's what I am going to Japan for.

So anata is relatively safe, and kimi is for talking to chicks? Will using kimi piss off any chicks?

[Crispy]

Must be. My biggest regret so far as a college student is that I only ever got close to one of the Japanese exchange students (of the 100 or so that are at the school at any given time) and it was only a month or so before she had to go back to Japan. And on top of that, we mostly conversed in English.

[Crispy]

Yeah, I'll have to watch it. I know both gaijin who went there to study and didn't learn anything, and Japanese who came here and didn't learna anything for that reason. Gotta be careful.

[cstaylor]

What always works for me is: "Oi! Teme!"

[Crispy]

I'm sure the chicks dig that.

[cstaylor]

Nah, I save that for my wife.

[kamome]

Using "anata" is actually kind of rude to the Japanese ear; in fact, the use of pronouns like anata is disfavored. You can find out someone's name by asking them directly "Dochira sama desuka" or through a mutual friend/acquaintance (a very japanese thing to do).

Also, many people are referred to by their titles: a taxi driver would be "untenshu-san", a guest or client is "okyakusama", and teacher is "sensei". Someone's family member is just referred to by the relationship: "okusama" for wife, "musuko-san" for son, etc.

Keep studying, and don't let them force English on you!

[2triky]

Quick language question.

Is there a Japanese word/equivalent for "sommelier" or "wine steward?"

[ttjereth]

[2triky]

Thank you. Is there a native Japanese word that approximates sommelier? As opposed to a transliteration, that is. I'm not saying there is, but I'm merely asking my question more precisely, perhaps.

[hundefar]

ソムリエ is the only word listed in my dictionaries for Sommelier.

[2triky]

[ttjereth]

Thank you. Is there a native Japanese word that approximates sommelier? As opposed to a transliteration, that is. I'm not saying there is, but I'm merely asking my question more precisely, perhaps.

My guess is no. I've never seen any other word used (and I have a fair amount of experience doing a LOT of wine-related translations for MHD, and several magazines, funny since I don't like wine...).

Even the biggest most detailed dictionary I have available here only lists the katakana and a bunch of descriptions in Japanese.

Edited to fix MHV to MHD... wheeeee good thing I don't get much work from them anymore

[2triky]

My guess is no. I've never seen any other word used (and I have a fair amount of experience doing a LOT of wine-related translations for MHV, and several magazines, funny since I don't like wine...).

Even the biggest most detailed dictionary I have available here only lists the katakana and a bunch of descriptions in Japanese.

Thanks for the info. I trust your correct and appreciate the effort to let me know.

[kurohinge1]

. . . Is there a native Japanese word that approximates sommelier? As opposed to a transliteration, that is. I'm not saying there is, but I'm merely asking my question more precisely, perhaps.

If you really want an alternative, I discovered that &#37202]sakashou[/I]) means a sake sommelier / master of sake, and then found the phrase ワインの匠 (wain no shou) splattered around a few websites (like thisone).

Hope this helps.

But my mischievous side wanted to suggest: "[Jim-san] no hou ga [Bob-san] yori kusai desu" as in "[Jim] is sommelier than [Bob].

[2triky]

[Greji]

But my mischievous side wanted to suggest: "[Jim-san] no hou ga [Bob-san] yori kusai desu" as in "[Jim] is sommelier than [Bob].

Very good Kuro, now let's have a practical exercise. Please say: "I would like to get laid and abused by you while I cosplay a wine sommelier named Bob!"

[ttjereth]

[ttjereth]

[Iraira]

But my mischievous side wanted to suggest: "[Jim-san] no hou ga [Bob-san] yori kusai desu" as in "[Jim] is sommelier than [Bob].

WARNING: oyaji joudan!:doh:

[2triky]

If your friend doesn't speak Japanese it could still have been the katakana pronounciation of &#12477]

He made a distinction regarding the alleged word being something other than a transliteration of sommelier, that's why I fathomed asking my question here

My wife loves celebrity gossip and such and she constantly confounds me with katakana pronunciations of famous people's names (some of whom I didn't know the names of English ).

Yeah those katakana abbreviations of people's names must be hard to follow...not always intuitive to a listener who's used to hearing the real name, if at all.

[ttjereth]

[2triky]

[kurohinge1]

[Tommybar]

I feel like an idiot for not knowing this, but I kind of have an excuse: Japanese teachers keep changing the subject when I ask them, and Japanese just giggle and don't give me any input over whether I am right or not. When addressing someone whom you don't know their name, which 2nd person pronoun do you use, and when? This has frustrated me for a long time, and I sure as hell wanna know it before I go over there.

If it is your first time to meet, the proper way would be to introduce yourself. The person(s) you are addressing should in turn introduce themselves.

You would usually use 'Hajimemashite' and then state your name. Followed by the reason for you being at that particular location.

"Hajimemashite, Tommybar desu, watashi mo Fucked Gaijin desu."

[Charles]

If it is your first time to meet, the proper way would be to introduce yourself. The person(s) you are addressing should in turn introduce themselves.

You would usually use 'Hajimemashite' and then state your name. Followed by the reason for you being at that particular location.

"Hajimemashite, Tommybar desu, watashi mo Fucked Gaijin desu."

This never helped me much, I always forget peoples' names after I've been introduced. So I always have to ask again and again, "o-name wa?"

[Tommybar]

This never helped me much, I always forget peoples' names after I've been introduced. So I always have to ask again and again, "o-name wa?"

In which case I would use 'Shitsurei desukedo, moichido onamae wa?"

[Charles]

In which case I would use 'Shitsurei desukedo, moichido onamae wa?"

oops, I misspelled "o-namae" in my post. I actually DO know better, hell, that is something I haven't goofed up since my first week of Japanese classes.

Yeah, I always start with the apologetic shitsurei, I like your version with "mo ichido" (isn't that mou ichidou?) as that seems to imply I need to hear your name again rather than me never having heard it in the first place.

You know, I seem to have more fluency and familiarity with phrases that explain or work around my language deficiencies. I'm constantly asking for people to repeat their names because I just can't remember names. And I have dozens of ways of explaining how I am slightly deaf, so excuse me I didn't quite catch what you said, could you repeat that? I know many variations of these phrases, since I use them so often. I was self-conscious about this, but then I read a linguistics book that called them "Conversational Strategies," it said these strategies are a vital tool in spoken conversation, they help you draw out the information you need.