Tohoku Earthquake, Tsunami and Nuclear Disaster!!!

[Mike Oxlong]

http://no-radioactive-waste2.blogspot.jp/2012/04/49_07.html

Looks like a proposed change to the law is in the works to allow private companies to accept disaster debris, likely to get around the inconvenient local governments' refusals.

[Yokohammer]

http://no-radioactive-waste2.blogspot.jp/2012/04/49_07.html

Looks like a proposed change to the law is in the works to allow private companies to accept disaster debris, likely to get around the inconvenient local governments' refusals.

This is obviously a bad idea from the controllability and accountability standpoint. But I can also sort of understand why the government might decide to take this route in order to break a stalemate in any way they can and get the job done (and I'm still not saying it's a good idea).

It is, however, a perfect example of entropy at work. Like I said.

[cstaylor]

I got one too:

suck on cesium and die douchebag

[Yokohammer]

I got one too

Aw ... but you got a comment with yours! I'm jealous.

Divisive subject I guess.

[canman]

Well "Hammer, if it was anything about US military personel pissing in rice fields, the red snot must have come from American Oyaji, since that was his past time when he was stationed in Misawa!;)

[cstaylor]

Aw ... but you got a comment with yours! I'm jealous.

Divisive subject I guess.

Well, it couldn't have been Coligny, because anonymous spelled douchebag correctly.

[2triky]

I got a grey snot from some brainless n00b for a 7 year old comment the other day. Gave me a good laugh too.

As did I, he got irked apparently because I posted a YouTube video about Steve Jobs in the "Steve Jobs passes away" thread.

His incisive commentary:

steve jobs and u 2 assholes

[cstaylor]

I saw that movie...

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Coligny again.

[Mike Oxlong]

...It is, however, a perfect example of entropy at work. Like I said.

Guess it's time to update the Wikipedia page with another interdisciplinary application of entropy:

Nuclear contamination always flows "spontaneously" from regions of higher contamination to regions of lower contamination, in the form of tsunami debris rammed down the throats of unwilling citizens.

[Yokohammer]

Guess it's time to update the Wikipedia page with another interdisciplinary application of entropy:

Nuclear contamination always flows "spontaneously" from regions of higher contamination to regions of lower contamination, in the form of tsunami debris rammed down the throats of unwilling citizens.

Something like that.

I'm surprised someone didn't come back with a more pedantic "you're using the word 'entropy' wrong" type comment.

You got it. I'm talking about entropy mediated by the minds and actions of people, which, since the minds of people operate primarily on fundamental chemical and physical principles, makes perfectly good sense to me. I'm sure the creationists will disagree, but that's how I see it.

It's also why I mentioned "people" in addition to food, water, air, etc., as one of the media that will eventually spread the radiation around. I wasn't only talking about people walking around with radioactive crud on their shoes.

[Coligny]

Well, it couldn't have been Coligny, [s]because anonymous spelled douchebag correctly. [/s] Is too busy eating crayons at the back of the shortbus

Fixed that for youz

[Big Booger]

Yoko I am teachering the peoples of height disadvantage. Lately I am feeling lethargic, which my sex-fiend gf is contributing to radiation, and I am leaning more toward jet lag. I just wonder if they make a kit to test radiation levels at home?? LOL

My family are hammering me to come home, but I came here for my gf. Now she too wants to go back! I think I will tough it out though. Until that is, I start to glow.

[Yokohammer]

Yoko I am teachering the peoples of height disadvantage. Lately I am feeling lethargic, which my sex-fiend gf is contributing to radiation, and I am leaning more toward jet lag. I just wonder if they make a kit to test radiation levels at home?? LOL

My family are hammering me to come home, but I came here for my gf. Now she too wants to go back! I think I will tough it out though. Until that is, I start to glow.

Gotcha. I think we know the true reason for your lethargy though.
So the GF is a Soma girl? You didn't know that Soma is known as the city of wild horses?

[Coligny]

This is obviously a bad idea from the controllability and accountability standpoint. But I can also sort of understand why the government might decide to take this route in order to break a stalemate in any way they can and get the job done (and I'm still not saying it's a good idea).

It's funny (in a way) how we radically don't think the same. Private processing under public inspection would be the good way to go. But in this corporate dictatorship even that would be fucked up because of their system where former public official land 'retirement' job in private companies (which i so surrealistically bad that I don't understand how it's not totally illegal).
But in a world where public servant have legal responsability, being in charge of the quality control for dangerous private activity usually work (also when said country have minimum understanding of the concept of 'conflict of interest' it helps a lot). That's how it's done for health and safety work for construction companies. Corruption of public servant meaning instant jailtime people tend to keep their shit straight. Also -POTENTIALLY- life threatening situations lead to heavy fines and immediate shutdown of the construction site until fixed. In case of death there is also a shutdown, but done by police force and the guy in charge have to answer (and usually sleep) at the police station. It's really a good way to have everybody sharp... Cherry on the cake, while the inspection workers are public servant, all the cost of running their offices are to be paid by the construction companies (yearly tax fixed by law).

It is, however, a perfect example of entropy at work. Like I said.

What you call entropy is what my grandpa called "boulot de bougnoules" (back then "arabic craftmanship" today that would be "towelhead clusterfuck") The status quo that lead us here. But a wishfull thinking too. There might not be any possibility to go back to the previous entropy... No matter how sloppy the debris processing work is allowed to be done... The now public position of Naoto Kan as reported by the ZDF, the former prime minister coming out of the wood against nuclear power... Maybe something is changing...

[Yokohammer]

It's funny (in a way) how we radically don't think the same.

Would you be offended if I said I was greatly relieved to hear that?
Of course I mean that in the nicest possible way.

I also understand what you're saying (this time), but don't think it'd work here in the Land of the Rising Rays. In this case I think the public sector is more of a carpet under which the government is attempting to sweep an intractable problem. And that, depending on your point of view, might be the only viable option they have within the current "system"*

[SIZE="1"]* "System" = "clusterfuck."[/SIZE]

[Coligny]

Something like that.

I'm surprised someone didn't come back with a more pedantic "you're using the word 'entropy' wrong" type comment.

Because we assumed that living in the stick with limited y00man (non local) interactions you use 'entropy' instead of 'status quo' to look edumacated...

But to be honest, your use of entropy would qualify more as being biased than wrong...

[Yokohammer]

Because we assumed that living in the stick with limited y00man (non local) interactions you use 'entropy' instead of 'status quo' to look edumacated...

Nope.

"Status quo" is a state that people want to maintain (as in "no radiation in my prefecture!").
"Entropy" is the principle that makes maintenance of said state impossible.

Obviously I'm borrowing the word from thermodynamics, but it works quite nicely in its new context, so why not?
More an application of imagination than education.

[Mike Oxlong]

I find the analogy to disease diffusion a better fit, obviously YMMV.

[dimwit]

It's funny (in a way) how we radically don't think the same. Private processing under public inspection would be the good way to go. But in this corporate dictatorship even that would be fucked up because of their system where former public official land 'retirement' job in private companies (which i so surrealistically bad that I don't understand how it's not totally illegal).
But in a world where public servant have legal responsability, being in charge of the quality control for dangerous private activity usually work (also when said country have minimum understanding of the concept of 'conflict of interest' it helps a lot). That's how it's done for health and safety work for construction companies. Corruption of public servant meaning instant jailtime people tend to keep their shit straight. Also -POTENTIALLY- life threatening situations lead to heavy fines and immediate shutdown of the construction site until fixed. In case of death there is also a shutdown, but done by police force and the guy in charge have to answer (and usually sleep) at the police station. It's really a good way to have everybody sharp... Cherry on the cake, while the inspection workers are public servant, all the cost of running their offices are to be paid by the construction companies (yearly tax fixed by law).



What you call entropy is what my grandpa called "boulot de bougnoules" (back then "arabic craftmanship" today that would be "towelhead clusterfuck") The status quo that lead us here. But a wishfull thinking too. There might not be any possibility to go back to the previous entropy... No matter how sloppy the debris processing work is allowed to be done... The now public position of Naoto Kan... Maybe something is changing...

Good post. I agree with your analysis. Generally, I think problem comes down to way in which senior Japanese bureaucrats view the notion of 'public service'. Accountably and openness have never part of their life. Recruited from elite universities they have ooze privilege, and can not conceive of a world in which decision making is not on a short leash.

I think that one of the few positive things that has come out of the disaster is that the public has become a great deal more sceptical of government pronoucements.

[Yokohammer]

I find the analogy to disease diffusion a better fit, obviously YMMV.

That works too! Especially since it includes "network diffusion."
The only disadvantage I can think of is that it's not as widely known (including ... to me).

As long as the gist is "x will eventually spread out so that there will be equal amounts of x everywhere", it works.

[Coligny]

Would you be offended if I said I was greatly relieved to hear that?
Of course I mean that in the nicest possible way.

Not that I want to be disrespektfull with an old fart that went to school wit the Wright brothers... But I'd never considered being surrounded with think alike people and yes-men to be a really good environment... (hence my problem with religion... even if the term 'thinking' applied to followers seems to be a little optimistic).

Bestest time evar was mah highschool friends group reaching from far left to far right... always creating some kind of equilibrium... or entropy... or status quo... One was offering to go trashing some arabs (far right guy) to which the far left dude was leaning toward hanging some bankers instead, while the tunisian guy was looking at the sky in despair and the jews waiting for their turn... usually ending in movie+fast food evenings...

[Mike Oxlong]

That works too! Especially since it includes "network diffusion."
The only disadvantage I can think of is that it's not as widely known.

As long as the gist is "x will eventually spread out so that there will be equal amounts of x everywhere", it works.

In my view, you are focusing on just the end result, while I'm more interested in the process by which it happens. Attributing the process as something natural and unavoidable certainly plays well to the home crowd, but to me is akin to a doctor telling a patient, "We found a tumor in your lung. It has not metastasized yet, but it will. There's nothing that can be done.":confused:

Edit: I suppose I should add - why try to limit the spread of anything, like influenza, dioxins or fake Rolexes, when they're just gonna disperse everywhere anyway?

[Yokohammer]

In my view, you are focusing on just the end result, while I'm more interested in the process by which it happens. Attributing the process as something natural and unavoidable certainly plays well to the home crowd, but to me is akin to a doctor telling a patient, "We found a tumor in your lung. It has not metastasized yet, but it will. There's nothing that can be done.":confused:

OK, this is a very interesting comment. I'm going to drag it back a couple of pages and sort of fuse it with the "spread the pain" mode of thought you dislike so much.

If you're thinking for a group there can be advantages to spreading the pain, or allowing the metastasis to happen. Sorta.

For example (silly example), if we're locked in a room with a bottle of some sort of toxic substance that has to be drunk by one or both of us or a guard with a gun will shoot us both dead, and that substance is toxic enough to kill one person who drinks all of it but is only toxic enough to make two people who drink half each temporarily very sick, what do we do?

If we were both reasonable human beings we'd probably agree to drink half each, get sick, recover, and get on with our lives.

Our initial response would naturally be to avoid drinking the stuff, but given our privileged human ability to reason and hopefully show compassion for other human beings, wouldn't we choose to share the pain?

[Coligny]

Mutiny, kill the guard or die trying...

The only way to go...

[Mike Oxlong]

Mutiny, kill the guard or die trying...

The only way to go...

We live in a binary cuntry...

[Yokohammer]

I guess that means you both agree.

Thank you.

[Catoneinutica]

Mutiny, kill the guard or die trying...

The only way to go...

Live Free or Die Hard.

[Coligny]

Seriously:

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2012/4/8/trayvon_martin_un_in

The UN asking for investigation in the Trayvon Martin case...

Meanwhile, Fukushima... business as usual...

[Screwed-down Hairdo]

Seriously:

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2012/4/8/trayvon_martin_un_in

The UN asking for investigation in the Trayvon Martin case...

Meanwhile, Fukushima... business as usual...

Maybe Fukushima wouldn't have developed into such a problem if it had've worn a hoodie?

[Coligny]

I think it's zee opposite... put a hoodie on them plant... and bam... some redneck driving a Bronco will come to gun it down and everybody and their doggs will feel concerned/threatened/oppressed...