beware of propaganda

[DJEB]

Regarding the Russian spying, it looks very much like the NSA was doing to members of the Security Council.

Also, it sounds like the Russians were trying to say that the U.S. was serious to Iraq. Not that this justifies spying.

On the NSA spying:

To: [Recipients withheld]
From: FRANK KOZA, Def Chief of Staff (Regional Targets)
CIV/NSA
Sent on Jan 31 2003 0:16
Subject: Reflections of Iraq Debate/Votes at UN-RT Actions + Potential for Related Contributions
Importance: HIGH
Top Secret//COMINT//X1

All,

As you've likely heard by now, the Agency is mounting a surge particularly directed at the UN Security Council (UNSC) members (minus US and GBR of course) for insights as to how to membership is reacting to the on-going debate RE: Iraq, plans to vote on any related resolutions, what related policies/ negotiating positions they may be considering, alliances/ dependencies, etc - the whole gamut of information that could give US policymakers an edge in obtaining results favorable to US goals or to head off surprises. In RT, that means a QRC surge effort to revive/ create efforts against UNSC members Angola, Cameroon, Chile, Bulgaria and Guinea, as well as extra focus on Pakistan UN matters.

We've also asked ALL RT topi's to emphasize and make sure they pay attention to existing non-UNSC member UN-related and domestic comms for anything useful related to the UNSC deliberations/ debates/ votes. We have a lot of special UN-related diplomatic coverage (various UN delegations) from countries not sitting on the UNSC right now that could contribute related perspectives/ insights/ whatever. We recognize that we can't afford to ignore this possible source.

We'd appreciate your support in getting the word to your analysts who might have similar, more in-direct access to valuable information from accesses in your product lines. I suspect that you'll be hearing more along these lines in formal channels - especially as this effort will probably peak (at least for this specific focus) in the middle of next week, following the SecState's presentation to the UNSC.

Thanks for your help
- http://www.observer.co.uk/iraq/story/0,12239,905954,00.html

Also see http://www.observer.co.uk/international/story/0,6903,905899,00.html

[DJEB]

Okay one more:

DJEB, the following link, for those who come stomach reading DJEB's meandering books, indicated that the US would NOT license 5 chemicals that could be used in the production of chemical weapons. Furthermore it indicated that the US was considering selling the base chemicals to BOTH Iran and Iraq.

I urge others to read the pdf for yourselves. Gai has completely left out reference to the proposed Aqaba pipeline.

[Gaisaradatsuraku!]

DJEB, I love how you take this long quotes and draw conclusions from them that don't exist. It is clear that the Russians were leaking information to our enemy. Your response to this is to post some letter asking for information and equate that to what the Russians did?

GOOD!

Also, the war is not "illegal" as you put it. Where do you get this nonsense (please keep it to 1,000,000 words or less).

[Gaisaradatsuraku!]

Okay one more:

DJEB, the following link, for those who come stomach reading DJEB's meandering books, indicated that the US would NOT license 5 chemicals that could be used in the production of chemical weapons. Furthermore it indicated that the US was considering selling the base chemicals to BOTH Iran and Iraq.

I urge others to read the pdf for yourselves. Gai has completely left out reference to the proposed Aqaba pipeline.

I urge you all to read it to (if for no other reason than to get an idea as to what a crackpot this guy is). Oh, excuse my red herring ad hominem personal attack.

Also, it is NOT a red herring to bring up the fact that the UN has been stymied time and time again during crises. I suggest YOU check the definition of red herring. If the world only rose to action when the UN could get its act together this would be a dictators dream.

Fortunately, there is the US and when we tell the petty dictators around the world that their time to respond is limited I think that they will be listening.

[Gaisaradatsuraku!]

Okay one more:

DJEB, the following link, for those who come stomach reading DJEB's meandering books, indicated that the US would NOT license 5 chemicals that could be used in the production of chemical weapons. Furthermore it indicated that the US was considering selling the base chemicals to BOTH Iran and Iraq.

I urge others to read the pdf for yourselves. Gai has completely left out reference to the proposed Aqaba pipeline.

Excuse me, but the document meanders on and concludes the US will not sell the chemicals to either Iran or Iraq and then makes a reference to a potential pipeline deal with Bechtel. And what am I supposed to conclude from this? What is the diabolical plot here? Oh yeah, we won't trade chemical weapons for deals. If you want that you have to go to the French.

[DJEB]

DJEB, I love how you take this long quotes and draw conclusions from them that don't exist. It is clear that the Russians were leaking information to our enemy. Your response to this is to post some letter asking for information and equate that to what the Russians did?

Thanks for proving that you didn't read the link that I posted (and you wonder why I tend to post everything on this forum).

Also, the war is not "illegal" as you put it. Where do you get this nonsense (please keep it to 1,000,000 words or less).

I posted it in the post titled "a big post". Nice to see you are paying attention.

[DJEB]

Okay one more:

DJEB, the following link, for those who come stomach reading DJEB's meandering books, indicated that the US would NOT license 5 chemicals that could be used in the production of chemical weapons. Furthermore it indicated that the US was considering selling the base chemicals to BOTH Iran and Iraq.

I urge others to read the pdf for yourselves. Gai has completely left out reference to the proposed Aqaba pipeline.

I urge you all to read it to (if for no other reason than to get an idea as to what a crackpot this guy is). Oh, excuse my red herring ad hominem personal attack.

I agree. Others should read it. Also, while you did offer a personal attack here (of course), there was no red herring.

Also, it is NOT a red herring to bring up the fact that the UN has been stymied time and time again during crises. I suggest YOU check the definition of red herring. If the world only rose to action when the UN could get its act together this would be a dictators dream.

It is a red herring. If not, show how it is directly related to the point at hand (if you remember what that was). [Besides, if you were to look into UN history, you would find that the U.S. has blocked some very progressive moves (like the U.S. vetoing a messure calling on all states to obey international law). - Not good for someone who wraps themself in the Stars and Stripes.]

Fortunately, there is the US and when we [italics mine] tell the petty dictators around the world that their time to respond is limited [after you use them for your own foreign policy gains as you admitted was the case with Iraq. - DJEB] I think that they will be listening.

[/b]

[DJEB]

Excuse me, but the document meanders on and concludes the US will not sell the chemicals to either Iran or Iraq and then makes a reference to a potential pipeline deal with Bechtel. And what am I supposed to conclude from this? What is the diabolical plot here? Oh yeah, we won't trade chemical weapons for deals. If you want that you have to go to the French.

What it says and shows - especially from the date - is that the U.S. was selling dual use equipment to the Iraqis at a time when they knew that Iraq was using chemical weapons against Iraq (but you know all about histroy, so I don't really need to mention this). The concern the U.S. had was not with the violation of international law, it was with a potential "embarrassing situation". An "embarrassing situation" would have hindered the planned Bechtel project (mentioned in the memo).

If you want more, go here: http://www.ips-dc.org/crudevision/crude_vision.pdf

[jez]

Oh, a deep thinking Australian. That's scary.

You're obviously not a very deep-thinking american.

Lastly, you foreigners really piss me off when you try to imply that the US ever was a "supporter" of Saddam. Yeah, when we were confronting an even crazier maniac in the Ayatollah Khomeini we chose Saddam but that is not because we support him. We chose a fucking side to counterbalance an even more dangerous enemy.

And (as with Bin Laden), we are now reaping the fruits of that 'choice'.
I heard a guy called Joseph Cisco on VOA, praising an Iraqi imam, who had issued a fatwa calling for Iraqis to cooperate with the coalition, as pursuing 'democracy'. I think that rather illustrates the US policies since WWII.
BTW, are you not a gaijin?

[Gaisaradatsuraku!]

Oh, a deep thinking Australian. That's scary.

You're obviously not a very deep-thinking american.

Lastly, you foreigners really piss me off when you try to imply that the US ever was a "supporter" of Saddam. Yeah, when we were confronting an even crazier maniac in the Ayatollah Khomeini we chose Saddam but that is not because we support him. We chose a fucking side to counterbalance an even more dangerous enemy.

And (as with Bin Laden), we are now reaping the fruits of that 'choice'.
I heard a guy called Joseph Cisco on VOA, praising an Iraqi imam, who had issued a fatwa calling for Iraqis to cooperate with the coalition, as pursuing 'democracy'. I think that rather illustrates the US policies since WWII.
BTW, are you not a gaijin?

Like DJEB your posts are a little schizoid. It is totally unclear what you are talking about. Thanks for the laughs DJEB. Your "research" doesn't support in the slightest your bizarre viewpoints. Knock yourself out.

[ramchop]

yuck!

[jez]

Like DJEB your posts are a little schizoid. It is totally unclear what you are talking about. Thanks for the laughs DJEB. Your "research" doesn't support in the slightest your bizarre viewpoints. Knock yourself out.

Please clarify

[jez]

Now Powell is saying the US will not attack Syria, because "democracy must come from within". My god!the sheer hypocrisy...Attitudes and moral values seem to change after each US action.
Blair says the UN will have a central roleif certain memebers of the security council cooperate. If not, the US and UK will take things into their own hands. I thought international law was supposed to override national interests...If some want to return to the dark ages of imperialism, they shouldn't claim to believe in international cooperation.

[Gaisaradatsuraku!]

Now Powell is saying the US will not attack Syria, because "democracy must come from within". My god!the sheer hypocrisy...Attitudes and moral values seem to change after each US action.
Blair says the UN will have a central roleif certain memebers of the security council cooperate. If not, the US and UK will take things into their own hands. I thought international law was supposed to override national interests...If some want to return to the dark ages of imperialism, they shouldn't claim to believe in international cooperation.

The absolute height of idiocy. Please go to the Funk & Wagnalls and look up the world "imperialism." You clearly do not know what the word means if you can call what America and the UK have done and will do in Iraq. This analysis is incredibly juvenile. Where did you kids go to school?

Also, re the situation in Syria and the comment that democracy should come from within. Here is another factoid for you. The Iraqi people wanted Saddam out. US intelligence knew this and was able to bring forth an incredibly successful campaign and put its soldiers on Arab land WITH the support of the local populace. They want democracy and new leadership and we spent the last several weeks giving them the courage to state their minds. Our role will now gradually be reduced and, hopefully, they are on their way (like Japan) with their own version of a democratic capitalist structure.

The difference is that the Syrians may not have the same attitude toward their current government and may not show the same support toward a US coup that the Iraqis have. Any other questions? This is not the height of arrogance but the statement of an American statesman with knowledge. Unlike you and the leadership of most of Europe he is not just talking out of his ass. That you can even make comments like you do really proves the point that the Europeans in general are closed minded gutless weak powers mired in the past.

Based on your definitions of Imperialism and Hypocrisy it was also wrong to topple Hitler. We did that too after telling you Europeans to get your acts together (which you didn't until it was too late).

[den4]

jeez...this topic sure is getting a beating.... :P

[DJEB]

This thread lost about a page and a half of comments.

And I had read some Qutb as Chris had asked. All moot now. Too bad.

[Buraku]

Catch you tomorrow!

Jewish settler Avi Farhan, determined not to give up his home overlooking the sea when
Israel quits the occupied
Gaza Strip, is looking into becoming a Palestinian.

"I have met with Palestinians. I am willing to be a test case for peace and take up Palestinian citizenship," Farhan told Reuters. "It will hurt me to give up my Israeli citizenship, but I want to remain here."

One Palestinian official suggested he might be allowed to stay in overcrowded Gaza -- home to 1.4 million Palestinians -- as long as he obeyed Palestinian laws. Actual citizenship could only be decided on an individual basis and any applicant would have to meet the same conditions as anyone else.

Most settlers have pledged to remain in Gaza until they are evacuated, and few contemplate remaining afterward.

But a Palestinian official said they would be welcome.

"Unlike Zionism which is religiously exclusive, Palestinian nationalism is not," said Diana Butto. "So if these settlers wish to come in and be subject to Palestinian law, then of course we welcome them."

[Buraku]

Biden pursued botched Afghanistan withdrawal against diplomats’ advice: ex-negotiator
https://nypost.com/2024/05/01/us-news/b ... ator-says/

Turkey says Iraq sees need to eliminate Kurdish PKK militia
https://www.france24.com/en/asia-pacifi ... kk-militia

Old video shows rocket launcher during 2014 Russia-Ukraine conflict, not Iran's attack on Israel
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/old-video-sho ... 32592.html

Kabul airport bomber was an ISIS operative freed from prison by the Taliban
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/kabul-airp ... rcna147810
A new U.S. military review identified the bomber for the first time and found that the 2021 deadly attack was not preventable.

[Buraku]

Globalism is over?

Dem Kangz uf Wakandaz wuz dez Sam-o-rais n sheeeeeiiit?

'The Japanese don’t seem too happy about that Assassin’s Creed Shadows video game with the black samurai.'

twitter.com/stillgray/status/1791885993400054075

https://x.com/stillgray/status/1791885993400054075

France is no longer France? Ubi Soft Entertainment is a French video game publisher headquartered in Saint-Mandé, Quebec there is Yves Guillemot and Frédérick Duguet, French mass media company Vivendi has been seeking to expand, Ubisoft's internal investigation and a study by the newspaper Libération, employees had been found to have records of sexual misconduct, also they have tried to save moeny by firing males workers and hiring feminists, Africans and transexuals? March 2024, Ubisoft laid off 45 employees from its publishing teams, https://web.archive.org/web/20240402113 ... evolution-


http://www.ubisoft.com/ja-jp


Russia not seeking Kharkiv capture, claims Putin

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-69025424



it was all propaganda?

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=10384

What should Japan do? The only solution for Japan is to open up -- not only its economy, but its society, its universities, its media, its think tanks, and, indeed, its bars and bathhouses.

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=15473

By 2007, Japan's population is expected to peak at 127 million, then shrink to under 100 million by the middle of the century. This means 30 million fewer workers at a time when the number of elderly will have almost doubled.

"In the year 2050, if the birth rate remains the same people over 60 will make up over 30% of the population," explains Shigeo Morioka of the International Longevity Centre in Tokyo.

[Buraku]

quote

'Japanese waving Palestinian flag confronted by Israeli tourists in Tokyo' ?

https://x.com/narrative_hole/status/1820864369166872887