My Number

[Salty]

Will it be legal to make a purchase without a "mah numbah" card or are they going full Brazil on our asses ?

Since having a card is not required at this initial stage, of course making food purchases without it is legal. But a few years down the line, and I`d bet that it will become required for pesticides, knives, cars, alcohol, tobacco, prescription medication, etc. - anything that is at least semi-regulated now.

[Coligny]

Will be easier to implement rationning coupons when they lose the next war of aggression...

Have to stockpile flour and butter again...

[Yokohammer]

Will be easier to implement rationning coupons when they lose the next war of aggression...

Have to stockpile flour and butter again...

Get ready for your weekly ration of whale and dolphin.

[Coligny]

I need to lose weight anyway...

[Mike Oxlong]

'My Number' system: A worrying glimpse of the future

Due to launch in January 2016, the “My Number” system is proposed to aggregate and centralize personal information relating to tax, social security, medical, automobile registration, visa and passports.

The Social Security and new Tax Number System applies to foreigners who have legally resided in Japan for more than three months and have an address in Japan. Recipients will be issued with a 12 digit number that will remain with them until death- akin to a social security number in the U.S. or a national insurance number in the UK.

The system is pitched as being more convenient that the current one with centralization resulting in less necessary paperwork and documentation for certain procedures e.g. claiming benefits or filing taxes (e-Tax). It is also theorized that it will make evacuation and disaster response more efficient; saving time and potentially saving lives.

This aggregation of personal data could potentially be a double-edged sword and begs the question, “what if a security breach lead to this personal information being used nefariously?”. To cite the UK’s National Insurance Number and the U.S.’s Social Security Number system as long-standing points of reference, both countries have on numerous occasions been on the receiving end of scrutiny as a result of ‘misplacing’ sensitive data and have become victim to prolonged and systematic fraud, costing tax-payers millions in unlawful benefit claims.

The U.S. has recorded 11.7 million cases of data breaches involving Social Security numbers since 2006. Identity thieves often steal pension or unemployment insurance payments or run up a victim’s credit card debt. Victims have lost tens of billions of dollars in the U.S. alone. More approximately, South Korea reportedly suffered the leaking of 40 million numbers, or 80% of the population, through 2014 as their government network was compromised leaving Seoul facing pressure to rebuild the network at a cost of $650 million.

In aim of prevention, strict accompanying guidelines and laws will be enacted in Japan to safeguard this new store of personal information. Those leaking the numbers that they are tasked with safeguarding will face punishment, including prison terms of up to four years and as such companies will therefore need to guard the records closely. The management of employee data, for example, will present a considerable work-load to human resources departments and necessitate new software (or at the very least cabinets with locks!) to compliantly manage, the onboarding, storage and deletion of sensitive data.

People will also have the option to receive an “Individual Number Card” containing an IC chip. The card will have the bearer’s name, address, date of birth, and sex (known as the “four basic information items”) as well as an ID photograph on the front, and the “Individual Number” on the back. Holders may use the card as a form of personal ID to confirm their identity and for many it could conceivably replace the “gaijin card” as the ID card of choice.

This is where things get questionable. Because the card contains all of your personal credentials along with an ID photograph it can be used for a wide range of purposes, e.g signing up to a sports club, getting a mobile phone contract or anywhere else you could conceivably be asked to identify yourself. Now, the other party is prohibited from copying your “Individual Number”, but the issue is the actual location of this information- on the back of the card. Conceivably, in a similar manner to credit-card skimming, it would only take 1 second to take a snapshot of the card and the all-important “My Number.”

The government hopes that the system will be successful in “streamlining” and automating historically manual procedures but you are not legally required to receive or carry the “Individual Number Card.” Undoubtedly the new system is conducive to the Japanese government receiving much-needed tax revenue via keeping closer tabs on its populace, but at this early stage the scope for abuse would appear to be substantial.

http://www.japantoday.com/category/opin ... the-future

[matsuki]

the scope for abuse would appear to be substantial.

This says it all...

[Salty]

The basic information is the same as that on a drivers license, which also acts as an ID today in most any situation. So it seems to me that any additional risk would be in associated programs and procedures which might be developed.

[Salty]

… But there is a danger the individual should be aware of: After receiving tax returns describing their true incomes, the tax office may relay that information to the municipal government, which would then send a document detailing the total local levies to the daytime employer — because that employer is typically responsible for deducting the amount from wages. The employer might spot discrepancies between the tax sum and the presumably low salary a female clerk, say, might be earning.

Hostesses fear this scenario may lead to their daytime employers, and potentially their colleagues, finding out about their second identity.

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/1 ... hBM___ovIV

Surely a city office – would not do as this article suggests, and violate the laws on information confidentiality by sending information to a non-government entity (a private employer), but would instead notify the individual that they owe more in taxes.

A company is only responsible for deducting the correct amount of taxes from what they pay an individual, and it is the individual who is responsible for paying the right amount of tax on their total income, no matter the source of that income.

[Salty]

Yikes! I can see it now… When fully deployed, My Number used to report which channels were viewed, whether porn was watched, etc., etc.

NHK considers utilizing My Number system to boost fee payment rate

http://mainichi.jp/english/english/news ... 4000c.html

[Russell]

Yikes! I can see it now… When fully deployed, My Number used to report which channels were viewed, whether porn was watched, etc., etc.

NHK considers utilizing My Number system to boost fee payment rate

http://mainichi.jp/english/english/news ... 4000c.html

How would knowledge of someone's number help to collect fees?

[Coligny]

IT's called diabolisashiun. Soon mahnumbah (like the local mongoloids will certainly pronounce it) will also be blamed for poor crops, the next olympic fiasco, trains delays and your girlfriend not taking it in the pooper...
This kind of bullshit is gold for the proponents of mahnumbah. Ichiro Tanaka get all scared on outrageous bullshit, then is quickly comforted by protectors of the scheme who really don't need to work hard to prove that mahnumbah will not rape their dog, meanwhile real issues will look tame and be overloked.

[Russell]

IT's called diabolisashiun. Soon mahnumbah (like the local mongoloids will certainly pronounce it) will also be blamed for poor crops, the next olympic fiasco, trains delays and your girlfriend not taking it in the pooper...
This kind of bullshit is gold for the proponents of mahnumbah. Ichiro Tanaka get all scared on outrageous bullshit, then is quickly comforted by protectors of the scheme who really don't need to work hard to prove that mahnumbah will not rape their dog, meanwhile real issues will look tame and be overloked.

Your girlfriend demanding to know your mahnumbah before sex, will certainly help in identifying the father of her future offspring...

[Samurai_Jerk]

Surely a city office – would not do as this article suggests, and violate the laws on information confidentiality by sending information to a non-government entity (a private employer), but would instead notify the individual that they owe more in taxes.

A company is only responsible for deducting the correct amount of taxes from what they pay an individual, and it is the individual who is responsible for paying the right amount of tax on their total income, no matter the source of that income.

Most people who work for a company full time have their residence tax deducted from their salary and paid to their local government by their employer. In such cases the information is sent directly to that employer. I think that's what they're talking about. However, I believe you can opt to take care of that on your own. Same with filing your tax return which would also expose any additional income. I know I can at my company but I let them take care of it because I don't have any good reason to do it on my own.

I like the way the article tries to make the story sexier by focusing on young OL's moonlighting as hostesses. However, this could affect anyone with a side job their employer doesn't know about. Forget about the embarrassment of being outed as a hostess. How about getting fired for working another job which most full-time employment contracts forbid? Besides the most a company would find out is your residence tax is too high relative to your income. They wouldn't be told the source of the additional income that raised your taxes.

I don't feel much sympathy for those who've been evading taxes by getting paid under the table. However, if it does end up exposing extra income and people lose their day job because of it, that sucks. I think it's outrageous that Japanese employers can forbid people from moonlighting as long as they aren't working for the competition. The most ridiculous case I know of is a guy who had to get special permission from his company to enter bass fishing competitions that had cash prizes. They said yes but the fact that he had to ask is beyond silly.

[Coligny]

'
I like the way the article tries to make the story sexier by focusing on young OL's moonlighting as hostesses. However, this could affect anyone with a side job their employer doesn't know about. Forget about the embarrassment of being outed as a hostess. How about getting fired for working another job which most full-time employment contracts forbid? Besides the most a company would find out is your residence tax is too high relative to your income. They wouldn't be told the source of the additional income that raised your taxes.
.

The mutli job issue is a civil servant thing only ? No ?
Other than that private work contracts only include non competing clause. But forbidden to take a side job ? It's japanese only ? Sounds like an abusive clause, like porking between colleagues...
Cause even for university research they can take official work hours for side jobs.
And holy fuck did it pay well. Like 50man/weekend of reserve duty.

[Russell]

The most ridiculous case I know of is a guy who had to get special permission from his company to enter bass fishing competitions that had cash prizes. They said yes but the fact that he had to ask is beyond silly.

In that case you would also need permission from your employer to play in the lottery or to do pachinko, isn't it?

[Takechanpoo]

its a matter of time that hackers of the specific government agencies hack it.
even if its not the case, its perfectly obvious that sooner of later some staffs secretly take out the part of the imformations to the outside
and hand over it to certain newly-risen religions or organized crime syndicates.
and you will be pinpointedly locked on by them.

[Salty]

This is a catch-all reply….

If My-Number gets linked to tax and bank accounts – the NHK fee can simply be deducted from bank accounts, or from pension, or from tax rebates – if doing so is permitted by law.

All companies (that I know) – restrict second-job employment for their full time employees. Violate this, and you can be let go.

I do get the point about `residence taxes` being deducted from payroll, and for that to happen – HR needs to know how much to deduct. But there are additional income streams (investments, royalties, winnings, etc.) not tied to secondary employment that could cause a payment to increase above what a simple (first job) salary might demand. Plus, as has been pointed out – a person can file their own taxes, and can even specify the amount that they want HR to set aside each month.

[Samurai_Jerk]

The mutli job issue is a civil servant thing only ? No ?
Other than that private work contracts only include non competing clause. But forbidden to take a side job ? It's japanese only ? Sounds like an abusive clause, like porking between colleagues...
Cause even for university research they can take official work hours for side jobs.
And holy fuck did it pay well. Like 50man/weekend of reserve duty.

Nope it's standard practice in Japan and perfectly legal. You can get a second job but you have to ask for permission first which means you have to give them all the details about that job.

In that case you would also need permission from your employer to play in the lottery or to do pachinko, isn't it?

Competitive fishing is considered a sport and once you get paid for doing a sport you're a professional and it's a job. That's the logic. A professional poker player would probably also need to get permission. I have some friends who are pro MMA fighters. It's the same for them though generally speaking pro fighters don't work as permanent employees because they need a flexible schedule and a lot of time to train.

[Salty]

TV news program this morning reported on the `first my number fraud` - with a 70ish woman relieved of a couple of million yen over her `illegal disclosure` of her number. I don`t yet see it in print. The fun begins....

[chibaka]

TV news program this morning reported on the `first my number fraud` - with a 70ish woman relieved of a couple of million yen over her `illegal disclosure` of her number. I don`t yet see it in print. The fun begins....

The lucky winner is......

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/1 ... er-system/

[Salty]

We received our `numbers` yesterday. Nothing remarkable about mine – so probably will not try to remember it. I`ll drop it into my document safe and forget about it until it becomes necessary to fish out. I don`t think I will need it before the banks go anal asking for `missing` information.

What I don`t know yet, is who can obtain it without my disclosure, but I would guess that the NTA and maybe even the banks might be able to do so.

[chibaka]

File it with the FG number, still haven't figured out what that's for and it's been filed for 2 years.

[Yokohammer]

Ours arrived last weekend (on a Sunday!).

They have been stored in the safe until further notice.

[J.A.F.O]

What I don`t know yet, is who can obtain it without my disclosure, but I would guess that the NTA and maybe even the banks might be able to do so.

It's not who can lawfully obtain it that concerns me it was this statement that concerns me more

Those leaking the numbers that they are tasked with safeguarding will face punishment, including prison terms of up to four years and as such companies will therefore need to guard the records closely.

4 years in jail for billions of yen worth of information ... fair trade to to me and I'm a relatively honest guy. I can only guess what the less upstanding members of j-society could be thinking.

[Samurai_Jerk]

I got mine yesterday.

What I don`t know yet, is who can obtain it without my disclosure, but I would guess that the NTA and maybe even the banks might be able to do so.

It's not who can lawfully obtain it that concerns me it was this statement that concerns me more

Those leaking the numbers that they are tasked with safeguarding will face punishment, including prison terms of up to four years and as such companies will therefore need to guard the records closely.

4 years in jail for billions of yen worth of information ... fair trade to to me and I'm a relatively honest guy. I can only guess what the less upstanding members of j-society could be thinking.

I'm sure there are other charges that can be piled on top of that depending on the situation. Like if you give numbers to a criminal organization in exchange for money. If the leak is due to negligence of some sort, it's a different story.

[matsuki]

The mutli job issue is a civil servant thing only ? No ?
Other than that private work contracts only include non competing clause. But forbidden to take a side job ? It's japanese only ? Sounds like an abusive clause, like porking between colleagues...
Cause even for university research they can take official work hours for side jobs.
And holy fuck did it pay well. Like 50man/weekend of reserve duty.

Nope it's standard practice in Japan and perfectly legal. You can get a second job but you have to ask for permission first which means you have to give them all the details about that job.

In that case you would also need permission from your employer to play in the lottery or to do pachinko, isn't it?

Competitive fishing is considered a sport and once you get paid for doing a sport you're a professional and it's a job. That's the logic. A professional poker player would probably also need to get permission. I have some friends who are pro MMA fighters. It's the same for them though generally speaking pro fighters don't work as permanent employees because they need a flexible schedule and a lot of time to train.

Won't this eventually have to become an illegal clause as the demand for workers exceeds eligible workers? I know faaaar too many people with secondary "baito" that get paid in cash but I can't see that type of thing continuing forever.

[J.A.F.O]

I'm sure there are other charges that can be piled on top of that depending on the situation. Like if you give numbers to a criminal organization in exchange for money. If the leak is due to negligence of some sort, it's a different story.

Yep and if there aren't those charges yet they will be as soon as the first situation comes up. I guess the next thing is to "negligently" allow criminal organizations to get a hold of the information. "But i didn't mean to bring home and the classified information, how was I supposed to know the coso nostra was going to break in and take my p.c.... " I would say it's funny but with everything that happens in the U.S. I can't even muster a chuckle.

[Samurai_Jerk]

Won't this eventually have to become an illegal clause as the demand for workers exceeds eligible workers? I know faaaar too many people with secondary "baito" that get paid in cash but I can't see that type of thing continuing forever.

Corporate Japan will fight tooth and nail to keep it and most Japanese I've ever spoken with about it seem to think it's reasonable. I think it's like the no 'baito for high school kids thing. People think the rule is OK but they also think it's OK to ignore that rule and do things on the sly. My guess is corporations also like that rule because it gives them a way to punish or fire employees they don't like but also keep wages low and pretend they don't know a lot of their low-level employees are doing it. If they do actually start tracking that money making it tougher to work under the table, attitudes may change though.

[matsuki]

Won't this eventually have to become an illegal clause as the demand for workers exceeds eligible workers? I know faaaar too many people with secondary "baito" that get paid in cash but I can't see that type of thing continuing forever.

Corporate Japan will fight tooth and nail to keep it and most Japanese I've ever spoken with about it seem to think it's reasonable. I think it's like the no 'baito for high school kids thing. People think the rule is OK but they also think it's OK to ignore that rule and do things on the sly. My guess is corporations also like that rule because it gives them a way to punish or fire employees they don't like but also keep wages low and pretend they don't know a lot of their low-level employees are doing it. If they do actually start tracking that money making it tougher to work under the table, attitudes may change though.

So basically the companies that benefit from it will try to keep it and the suckers eat it up, not knowing how much better it would be for them if it didn't have to be done under the table. On that note, I wonder if the J-gov will ever adopt e-money and get rid of cash...it certainly fits with their komakai, push to recover every yen they can....but it might make less than savory dealings a little more transparent and inconvenient.

[Samurai_Jerk]

suckers eat it up, not knowing how much better it would be for them if it didn't have to be done under the table.

Will it be? Tax fee income is a better deal for a lot of people. I know an FG who even though he has a good job and makes a decent income still does the fake priest thing on the weekends. He came make over 100,000 yen cash off the books on a good day. I don't see how making it legit would benefit him financially in any way.

I personally enjoy my free time too much to do a side job. I'd probably have to be facing homelessness to consider it. But I'm single with no kids so I don't have to take care of anyone.