Karuizawa Bus Crash Kills 14

[Wage Slave]

If you ever find yourself immediately answering a simple question to friends or family visiting Japan for the first time with huge chunks of detailed grievances that could have easily been ripped out of Alex Kerr's Dogs & Demons (which I still really like - being obsessed with it however isn't healthy) or Jared Taylor's Shadows of the Rising Sun , or realize somehow that your thinking, beliefs & perception of the world have become rigidly 'black & white' (a term called 'splitting') it's probably a good indicator as any that you need to take a long deserved vacation or otherwise change your environment or seek professional counseling before the bitter negative psychosis becomes permanent.

This is good advice.

The relative isolation that is an almost unavoidable aspect of gaijin life in Japan, whether you think you're fully assimilated or have naturalised or whatever, sometimes leads the more delicate psyches to very dark, miserable places. Keeping perspective is essential. If that means getting out for a while or making major changes to your lifestyle, that's what you need to do.

It would be good advice, if I were consumed by bitterness. I promise I'm not.

[Yokohammer]

If you ever find yourself immediately answering a simple question to friends or family visiting Japan for the first time with huge chunks of detailed grievances that could have easily been ripped out of Alex Kerr's Dogs & Demons (which I still really like - being obsessed with it however isn't healthy) or Jared Taylor's Shadows of the Rising Sun , or realize somehow that your thinking, beliefs & perception of the world have become rigidly 'black & white' (a term called 'splitting') it's probably a good indicator as any that you need to take a long deserved vacation or otherwise change your environment or seek professional counseling before the bitter negative psychosis becomes permanent.

This is good advice.

The relative isolation that is an almost unavoidable aspect of gaijin life in Japan, whether you think you're fully assimilated or have naturalised or whatever, sometimes leads the more delicate psyches to very dark, miserable places. Keeping perspective is essential. If that means getting out for a while or making major changes to your lifestyle, that's what you need to do.

It would be good advice, if I were consumed by bitterness. I promise I'm not.

Wasn't referring to you at all WS. I didn't get the impression that TC was referring to you personally either, just using your post, which referred to others to whom it might apply, as a launching pad for his advice.

[Wage Slave]

If you ever find yourself immediately answering a simple question to friends or family visiting Japan for the first time with huge chunks of detailed grievances that could have easily been ripped out of Alex Kerr's Dogs & Demons (which I still really like - being obsessed with it however isn't healthy) or Jared Taylor's Shadows of the Rising Sun , or realize somehow that your thinking, beliefs & perception of the world have become rigidly 'black & white' (a term called 'splitting') it's probably a good indicator as any that you need to take a long deserved vacation or otherwise change your environment or seek professional counseling before the bitter negative psychosis becomes permanent.

This is good advice.

The relative isolation that is an almost unavoidable aspect of gaijin life in Japan, whether you think you're fully assimilated or have naturalised or whatever, sometimes leads the more delicate psyches to very dark, miserable places. Keeping perspective is essential. If that means getting out for a while or making major changes to your lifestyle, that's what you need to do.

It would be good advice, if I were consumed by bitterness. I promise I'm not.

Wasn't referring to you at all WS. I didn't get the impression that TC was referring to you personally either, just using your post, which referred to others to whom it might apply, as a launching pad for his advice.

Thanks. It certainly came across that way. It also comes across as a strikingly familiar way to deny and dismiss.

[Samurai_Jerk]

If you ever find yourself immediately answering a simple question to friends or family visiting Japan for the first time with huge chunks of detailed grievances that could have easily been ripped out of Alex Kerr's Dogs & Demons (which I still really like - being obsessed with it however isn't healthy) or Jared Taylor's Shadows of the Rising Sun , or realize somehow that your thinking, beliefs & perception of the world have become rigidly 'black & white' (a term called 'splitting') it's probably a good indicator as any that you need to take a long deserved vacation or otherwise change your environment or seek professional counseling before the bitter negative psychosis becomes permanent.

This is good advice.

The relative isolation that is an almost unavoidable aspect of gaijin life in Japan, whether you think you're fully assimilated or have naturalised or whatever, sometimes leads the more delicate psyches to very dark, miserable places. Keeping perspective is essential. If that means getting out for a while or making major changes to your lifestyle, that's what you need to do.

It would be good advice, if I were consumed by bitterness. I promise I'm not.

Wasn't referring to you at all WS. I didn't get the impression that TC was referring to you personally either, just using your post, which referred to others to whom it might apply, as a launching pad for his advice.

Thanks. It certainly came across that way. It also comes across as a strikingly familiar way to deny and dismiss.

I didn't get the impression he was referring to you either.

[Wage Slave]

If you ever find yourself immediately answering a simple question to friends or family visiting Japan for the first time with huge chunks of detailed grievances that could have easily been ripped out of Alex Kerr's Dogs & Demons (which I still really like - being obsessed with it however isn't healthy) or Jared Taylor's Shadows of the Rising Sun , or realize somehow that your thinking, beliefs & perception of the world have become rigidly 'black & white' (a term called 'splitting') it's probably a good indicator as any that you need to take a long deserved vacation or otherwise change your environment or seek professional counseling before the bitter negative psychosis becomes permanent.

This is good advice.

The relative isolation that is an almost unavoidable aspect of gaijin life in Japan, whether you think you're fully assimilated or have naturalised or whatever, sometimes leads the more delicate psyches to very dark, miserable places. Keeping perspective is essential. If that means getting out for a while or making major changes to your lifestyle, that's what you need to do.

It would be good advice, if I were consumed by bitterness. I promise I'm not.

Wasn't referring to you at all WS. I didn't get the impression that TC was referring to you personally either, just using your post, which referred to others to whom it might apply, as a launching pad for his advice.

Thanks. It certainly came across that way. It also comes across as a strikingly familiar way to deny and dismiss.

I didn't get the impression he was referring to you either.

OK, appreciated. I have to say that when a person directly quotes someone and then uses the personal pronoun "you" in their reply it does rather give that impression.

[TennoChinko]

Thanks for that. What exactly makes you think and/or what have I said to indicate I am suffering from said "splitting"? It seems more to me that anyone who dissents can be silenced by declaring them to be insane. Now where have I heard that before?

Anyway if you think Tacky is not a racist and that discrimination and unequal opportunities are actually in Japan's best interests and further that Japan is doing just fine thank you very much then that's of course your prerogative. If I weren't a stakeholder, for better or worse, then I wouldn't care - but I am and I do. The thing about discrimination and a lack of opportunity is that it comes with a very high economic and developmental cost. Ask any successful multinational corporation.

Err, I was actually referring to Coligny who indicated in part "...Not contesting that my sanity is going down the shitter btw. My daily workout of mostly anger and frustration is not helping..." and of course, Aldwinckle/Arudoh! as the Mother of All Examples... I was answering your post to indicate I wasn't necessarily obsessed or going out of my way to bring up Aldwinckle/Arudoh!, but rather, when looking for an example of expats in Japan that get hit with some form of psychosis or personality disorder that causes their attitudes & life in general to spiral downward out of control, it's hard to find other readily identifiable examples online.

As for Takechanpoo, I'm not saying his online persona doesn't post racist or discriminatory comments. I just don't find myself reacting personally nor viscerally to it/him - not because I've decided to completely ignore him, but because I do see the sliver of tongue-in-cheek sarcasm & even self-deprecating humor he sometimes inserts into his posts and also because I don't see him as somehow being the spokesman of All Things Japan & Japanese. I've known people who've seriously taken huge offense and umbrage at "online columnists" like KAZUHIDE OTANI - ASK KAZUHIDE as in ... "Harro! When Are You Going Back To the America?!" I also wouldn't be surprised to discover one day that TakeP is actually a clever *gaijin* troll.

[TennoChinko]

OK, appreciated. I have to say that when a person directly quotes someone and then uses the personal pronoun "you" in their reply it does rather give that impression.

Sorry, I perhaps should have written it as follows:

If one ever finds themselves (or someone they know) immediately answering a simple question to friends or family visiting Japan for the first time with huge chunks of detailed grievances that could have easily been ripped out of Alex Kerr's Dogs & Demons (which I still really like - being obsessed with it however isn't healthy) or Jared Taylor's Shadows of the Rising Sun , or realize somehow that one's thinking, beliefs & perception of the world have become rigidly 'black & white' (a term called 'splitting') it's probably a good indicator as any that they need to take a long deserved vacation or otherwise change their environment or seek professional counseling before the bitter negative psychosis becomes permanent.

[Wage Slave]

OK, appreciated. I have to say that when a person directly quotes someone and then uses the personal pronoun "you" in their reply it does rather give that impression.

Sorry, I perhaps should have written it as follows:

If one ever finds themselves (or someone they know) immediately answering a simple question to friends or family visiting Japan for the first time with huge chunks of detailed grievances that could have easily been ripped out of Alex Kerr's Dogs & Demons (which I still really like - being obsessed with it however isn't healthy) or Jared Taylor's Shadows of the Rising Sun , or realize somehow that one's thinking, beliefs & perception of the world have become rigidly 'black & white' (a term called 'splitting') it's probably a good indicator as any that they need to take a long deserved vacation or otherwise change their environment or seek professional counseling before the bitter negative psychosis becomes permanent.

Understood. It was just that pesky second person pronoun thing. Anyway, some useful insight and food for thought.

[Samurai_Jerk]

I've known people who've seriously taken huge offense and umbrage at "online columnists" like KAZUHIDE OTANI - ASK KAZUHIDE as in ... "Harro! When Are You Going Back To the America?!"

Offended by the yellowface shtick or the shitty advice?

[TennoChinko]

I've known people who've seriously taken huge offense and umbrage at "online columnists" like KAZUHIDE OTANI - ASK KAZUHIDE as in ... "Harro! When Are You Going Back To the America?!"

Offended by the yellowface shtick or the shitty advice?

In a strange way - neither ... or, mostly the latter, I guess... 'shitty advice' but with a significant difference - an inability to perceive conventional forms of humor. One in particular assumed that Kazuhide Otani was a real person, as well as the Q&A in the column; the cause wasn't a low IQ or inability to understand English, it was actually a form of mental illness similar to what I described earlier. In a similar vein, another took great offense at the Ali-G and Borat characters when shown excerpts online as he angrily declared "he's insulting Americans!"

[matsuki]

Anyway if you think Tacky is not a racist and that discrimination and unequal opportunities are actually in Japan's best interests and further that Japan is doing just fine thank you very much then that's of course your prerogative. If I weren't a stakeholder, for better or worse, then I wouldn't care - but I am and I do. The thing about discrimination and a lack of opportunity is that it comes with a very high economic and developmental cost. Ask any successful multinational corporation.

Is there really any disagreement about that though? Even Take has said people here often don't advance based on merit....regardless of it being due to one's FGness, Sex, Age, an that is the real problem. It izzzzzz how you say? 自分の首を絞める

[kurogane]

It would be good advice, if I were consumed by bitterness. I promise I'm not.

Seconded. Over the years his lack of bitterness has often been a source of bitterness for me and others, not that I am bitter about it

I didn't get the impression he was referring to you either.

Me three, but we've already kissed and made up, which is nice. Sometimes nice is nice. As is mindful pizza time.

BTW, I get why references to He Who Is can get tiresome, but I do regard him as a textbook case of poor attitude, bad methods, sophomoric analysis and rampant ego and without going all Havill on him think he is a fine example of how to avoid being, and how one bad apple can poison the well, even though the issues are worth discussing, as you emphasised. OTOH, a good point about how it only feeds the monster, so I shall take a sabbatical.

[Coligny]

I don't go full crusader, but when i come here to talk aboot daily shit, having this moss licker defecate on the carpet is a bit much.

billyj.jpg

Dood please...

image.jpeg

[Samurai_Jerk]

I don't go full crusader, but when i come here to talk aboot daily shit, having this moss licker defecate on the carpet is a bit much.

billyj.jpg

Dood please...

image.jpeg

Did you just refer to Take-chan as "it"?

That's racist (or possibly transphobic).

[Takechanpoo]

brake fade?

[wagyl]

brake fade?

Occam's Razor still says ice.

And this, Matsuki, is why even if you clear snow, in a place that is not used to snow, people are not used to and not aware of the dangers of driving in those icy conditions, and are instead lulled into a false sense of security that the roads are safe. Note that Karuizawa is a low snowfall but cold region, and while snow is rare, black ice is likely in freeze thaw conditions.

[matsuki]

Yeah, that's why I suggested the sprinkler system. Could also go heated pavement, I've seen that used here before.

[wagyl]

Yeah, that's why I suggested the sprinkler system. Could also go heated pavement, I've seen that used here before.

I was going to comment on that before: Cost of obtaining rights to the well water/compensating other well users, cost of pumping, cost of annual adjustment of jets, cost of installation. Where I am, the pumping power bill is so large that they have a special contract with the power company that requires that the pumps are off for two hours during the daytime, whatever the weather, and there can be lumps of heavy wet snow to dislodge once it starts up again. Urban locals also have a tendency to dump the snow from their own properties on the road to be melted, something the system was never designed to cope with. I challenge you to say that Tokyo will be better behaved.

The earlier heated footpath installation was never turned on after the first year, because of the power cost. It will be interesting to see how many seasons the new system will be used for.

Incidentally, areas that are cold but have little precipitation are not suitable for sprinklers: you just make an ice rink that way.

[matsuki]

Resistance wire is cheap...add solar panels FTW? There's got to be a better solution than the black ice we have today.

[Samurai_Jerk]

Resistance wire is cheap...add solar panels FTW? There's got to be a better solution than the black ice we have today.

Yeah, stay the fuck home till midday when the rain has cleared the roads.

[matsuki]

Resistance wire is cheap...add solar panels FTW? There's got to be a better solution than the black ice we have today.

Yeah, stay the fuck home till midday when the rain has cleared the roads.

Does that even work? I mean...I can pull it off in my situation but I can't imagine employers here being so lenient??

[Samurai_Jerk]

Resistance wire is cheap...add solar panels FTW? There's got to be a better solution than the black ice we have today.

Yeah, stay the fuck home till midday when the rain has cleared the roads.

Does that even work? I mean...I can pull it off in my situation but I can't imagine employers here being so lenient??

I don't really care. I don't drive. If people want to risk their lives, fuck 'em.

[wagyl]

Solution: Coligny has mentioned Singapore. You never hear of black ice there, not even two days a year.

My rule of thumb (although it has a certain degree of flexibility): If I don't want to walk in it, I don't want to drive in it.

Anyway, good luck with your snow strategy at Log Mahal.

[Takechanpoo]

really? i still dont see the bus was skidding in the latter half of the vid, though.
actually, according to a testimony from one of survivors, it seems like the driver said "brake doesnt work!" before the accident.

[wagyl]

really? i still dont see the bus was skidding in the latter half of the vid, though.
actually, according to a testimony from one of survivors, it seems like the driver said "brake doesnt work!" before the accident.

Perhaps. The announcer was certainly keen to describe the bus as swerving/snaking/meandering across the road.

What does a driver say when they put their foot on the brake pedal but the vehicle does not slow down because the wheels have gone into a skid? 「あっ，ブレーキが効かない！」

Anyway, we are both away from the scene and relying on poor material. It is conjecture on both of our parts. I will say that going in the direction they were going, there is very much less descent than ascent, so hot brake surfaces leading to fade seem less likely to me.

[Coligny]

really? i still dont see the bus was skidding in the latter half of the vid, though.
actually, according to a testimony from one of survivors, it seems like the driver said "brake doesnt work!" before the accident.

All the video teams reporting just after the crash were zooming in on the road showing it was perfectly dry and clean.
The rule #1 dowhill is to use engine braking as much as possible. (Which is maybe the only good reason to have paddle shift gearbox on cars since the L stick position is getting confusing as fuck especially with CVT)
The rule #2 is... Engine braking completely fuck with the ABS. Which on snow or gravel road is just a Darwin accelerator anyway. Usually on big stuff like this the ABS act only on the front axles to preserve steering.

What the video shows is an overspeeding bus still able to swerve. Apparently until the speed renders steering useless. Brake busted... The weird tire tracks talked aboot at the start would let think that the bus was on its right wheels only when it hit the rail. Would also explain the violence and straightforwardness of the collision with the tree. It might have went flying away on it right side only to be stopped and crushed by the tree near immediately without time to roll over more conventionnally.

[TennoChinko]

really? i still dont see the bus was skidding in the latter half of the vid, though.
actually, according to a testimony from one of survivors, it seems like the driver said "brake doesnt work!" before the accident.

From this afternoon on FNN (the last part of the video mentions brake failure or what is referred to as 'brake fade' フェード現象

長野・スキーバス事故　運転手などに違法な環境で労働させた疑い
01/21 12:17
http://www.fnn-news.com/news/headlines/ ... 14200.html

It's happens from time to time... usually the driver is blamed for poor technique.

2014 we have:

フェード現象での大型バス事故、起訴事実を認める
2014年5月19日（月） 09時15分
http://response.jp/article/2014/05/19/223455.html

And, 13+ years ago, we have:

フェード現象が起きたら運転中止---元バス運転手に有罪判決
2003年12月18日（木） 20時48分
http://response.jp/article/2003/12/18/56469.html

For a country that is packed with mountainous roads, and boasts exacting standards of technology ... even though driver error is a factor, why wouldn't the regulators at the MLIT 国交省 demanded transmission retarders "リターダ" for those type of buses? (I don't know whether it would be impractical to do so, or someone is just being retarded...)

[kurogane]

I used to drive tour buses in Canada, and the general skill level of charter tour bus drivers in rural regions in Japan has always struck me as deficient. Far too many can't reverse properly or confidently which does speak to a lack of familiarity with the vehicle itself, if that makes sense.

[matsuki]

....so they drive like chicks? (foot on the brake waaaay more than necessary)

Most of the truckers I've seen in the mountains here are damn scary...nothing like being tailgated by a semi through the local touge to keep you on edge.

[kurogane]

Yeah, good point. Even allowing for the corkscrew mountain roads we don't have much of there is way too much brake where I would use gears and speed management; amateurish is what I always thought. If you can't confidently and smoothly reverse your vehicle you're not much of a bus driver in MYHOMO