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Yokohammer wrote:Sad news about the hostages. Current reports are that they were most likely not killed during the police raid, however credible those reports might be. But the terrorists are dead, and I'm not in the slightest bit sorry about that, just the loss of information they might have been able to provide about other assholes with similar plans.
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Coligny wrote:Yokohammer wrote:Sad news about the hostages. Current reports are that they were most likely not killed during the police raid, however credible those reports might be. But the terrorists are dead, and I'm not in the slightest bit sorry about that, just the loss of information they might have been able to provide about other assholes with similar plans.
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Because martyrs was just what we needed...
Russell wrote:So, what happened in that supermarket that 4 hostages died?
Authorities had hijacked the shop's CCTV cameras to watch the unfolding hostage crisis inside, as Coulibaly threatened to murder the men, women and children he had captured if police made a move on the Kouachi brothers.
[...]
Fifteen hostages were freed but four were already dead according to Coulibaly, who told a French television station he had killed them.
Yokohammer wrote:Thing is ... the violent ones are just violent people looking for an excuse to be violent. Their religion gives them that, which is why they choose that particular flavour. The violent aspect is already established and it appeals to violent people. All their demands could be met to a "T" but they'd still find something to be offended about that needs to be avenged "with the blood of the infidel".
What a crock. They are violent people, pure and simple.
If the true leaders of a peaceful Islam are out there, they're the ones who need to get off their haunches and make it clear to everyone, worldwide, that those violent people are not true followers of the faith and reject them unequivocally. It could be done, but we're still waiting. The smattering of authoritative Islamic voices denouncing the violence is just too feeble and tentative to carry any real weight.
Yokohammer wrote:If it's a war between Islam and everyone else, it cannot be won either way. It has to be "True Islam" pulling "Misguided Islam" into line (I'm being charitable here for a minute). An Islamic Peace Corps, for example? Missions set up worldwide to re-educate the misguided ones in the ways of True Islam?
Seriously ... where's the effort? No central authority?
Gee, d'ya suppose the "central authority" might sort of be supporting all this violence?
I truly pity the peace-loving followers of a religion that can't get its act together enough to establish the ground rules for a peaceful existence in unequivocal terms.
legion wrote:Well the French don't mess around do they.
The criminals were known to the police, makes you wonder how they had access to weapons. Perhaps blanket surveillance of the general populace is a waste of resources better spent elsewhere.
Russell wrote:So, what happened in that supermarket that 4 hostages died?
Regarding them becoming martyrs, isn't there a way to deny them a decent funeral? Like mixing their ashes with pork meat and menstrual blood, and dump it at the foot of the statue of liberty...
Samurai_Jerk wrote:Yokohammer wrote:Thing is ... the violent ones are just violent people looking for an excuse to be violent. Their religion gives them that, which is why they choose that particular flavour. The violent aspect is already established and it appeals to violent people. All their demands could be met to a "T" but they'd still find something to be offended about that needs to be avenged "with the blood of the infidel".
What a crock. They are violent people, pure and simple.
If the true leaders of a peaceful Islam are out there, they're the ones who need to get off their haunches and make it clear to everyone, worldwide, that those violent people are not true followers of the faith and reject them unequivocally. It could be done, but we're still waiting. The smattering of authoritative Islamic voices denouncing the violence is just too feeble and tentative to carry any real weight.Yokohammer wrote:If it's a war between Islam and everyone else, it cannot be won either way. It has to be "True Islam" pulling "Misguided Islam" into line (I'm being charitable here for a minute). An Islamic Peace Corps, for example? Missions set up worldwide to re-educate the misguided ones in the ways of True Islam?
Seriously ... where's the effort? No central authority?
Gee, d'ya suppose the "central authority" might sort of be supporting all this violence?
I truly pity the peace-loving followers of a religion that can't get its act together enough to establish the ground rules for a peaceful existence in unequivocal terms.
I'm sure there are nutjobs and mercenaries who are attracted to this movement and are just there for the chance to kill but you can't say this is just violent people looking for an excuse to cause death and destruction. These guy have specific religious and political goals.
Shiism has stronger central leaders who interpret Islamic law and could push for this kind of change (That hasn't really worked too well in Iran though). However, there is no central authority in Sunnism which it makes it a lot harder. Al Qaeda, ISIS, The Taliban, and Boko Haram are all Sunni. That being said there are Muslim groups trying to fight extremism but that's often a suicide mission so I don't think you're going to have people signing up en masse to join the cause. There's nothing these assholes hate more than the wrong kind of Muslim and not everybody has balls the size of Malala's.
kagemusha wrote:Russell wrote:So, what happened in that supermarket that 4 hostages died?
Regarding them becoming martyrs, isn't there a way to deny them a decent funeral? Like mixing their ashes with pork meat and menstrual blood, and dump it at the foot of the statue of liberty...
Actually a certain European army used to bury some Islamic militants wrapped in pigskin for a body bag back in the 60's. From a religious point of view it is much worse than what you suggested.
But I think since it is a culture war more than a religious one the answer is to stand by what positively defines the western liberal culture and hit them back with a demonstration of ballsy free speech, intolerance for racism and increase demand for secularism in public life.
Russell wrote:
In the same line it would be helpful if it is possible to convince those guys that even if they think they're going to die a "heroic" death, the state will not allow them to have the funeral arrangements they wish to attain their martyrdom.
Wage Slave wrote:
Saudi blogger Raif Badawi was sentenced to 10 years in prison and 1000 lashes in front of al-Jafali mosque in Jeddah for "insulting Islam" on the internet. His sentence began on Friday. The sentence amounts to torture.
Samurai_Jerk wrote:Wage Slave wrote:
Which terrorist organization is Holly Fisher affiliated with?
Wage Slave wrote:Samurai_Jerk wrote:Wage Slave wrote:
Which terrorist organization is Holly Fisher affiliated with?
The Tea Party? Infowars? Or some violent right to life group or another. They are not so different - Geddit?
Coligny wrote:Ok, it's not over, Hayat Boumedienne escapped and is armed. Considered dangerous.
Shoot or shoot. Then call municipal street sweepers.
All the male perpetrators met in prison...
Samurai_Jerk wrote:Wage Slave wrote:Samurai_Jerk wrote:Wage Slave wrote:
Which terrorist organization is Holly Fisher affiliated with?
The Tea Party? Infowars? Or some violent right to life group or another. They are not so different - Geddit?
Are you trolling or are you really that dishonest?
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