A few questions about living/working in Japan

[Kodack]

I found this site through the good captain, and I have greatly enjoyed reading about life in Japan.

I have a few questions though.

How long is the flight from the US?

What kind of demand is there for Telecomm Engineers over there? I know a lot of the products I work on make there way to China, but I am not sure about Japan.

Nihhon Drivers license.
Is it as hard to get as I've heard? I know IDL is only good for about a year and if I can get to Japan I'd probably be staying longer.

What can someone expect to pay in the way of rent? I wouldn't mind living in a big city like Tokyo but I think it would be interesting to live in the country as well.

Would you say that living in Japan, you either love it or hate it?

I am teaching myself the language a few hours a night. It's working well and my ear is getting used to the language. When I have basic language skills I want to find some way to live in Japan indefinately.

Thank you in advance.

Kodack

[Taro Toporific]

How long is the flight from the US?

From Houston, it's 10 to 14 hours depending on your route. Don't worry---on your first trip you'll be too pumped to be bored or even notice the length of the flight.

What kind of demand is there for Telecomm Engineers over there?

Plenty!! BUT, you better be good enough to be headhunted. There aren

[Taro Toporific]

PS: If you know IP telephony, you're in good luck for finding Telecom work...


=============================================================
Booming IP Telephony Challenges NTT's Telecom Empire

J@pan Inc Magazine's online newsletter, 20 Jan 2003

In Brief: Nippon Telegraph and Telephone (NTT) Group has held a de facto monopoly in the fixed phone business over the past 100 years. Despite the keitai boom, as well as the coming of the broadband age, the Japanese still need NTT's connections for their fixed phones even if they use other fixed line providers such as Heisei Denden and Cable & Wireless IDC for intermediary connections. But the recent expansion of voice communications via IP telephony in Japan may change the whole picture.


READ THE REST AT http://www.japaninc.com/


Sources:
NTT East and West financial statement (in Japanese)
http://www.ntt.co.jp/ir/pdf/report2/03/hosoku10.xls

Yahoo! BB promotion (in Japanese)
http://bbpromo.yahoo.co.jp/promotion/campaign/muryou.html

Yano Research Institute (in Japanese)
http://www.yano.co.jp/

"NEC, Oki -3: Demand For IP Telephony Expected To Increase," Dow
Jones, January 28,2003
http://sg.biz.yahoo.com/030128/15/36waz.html

Links:
"Tepco's Power Play," J@pan Inc September 2002
http://www.japaninc.com/article.php?articleID=892

"2.5 Yen a Minute to Call the US Doesn't Sound Too Bad," The J@pan
Inc Newsletter, May 29, 2002
http://www.japaninc.net/newsletters/?list=jin&issue=188


=====================================================================
J@pan Inc Magazine Presents:
T H E J @ P A N I N C N E W S L E T T E R
Commentary on the Week's Business and Technology News
=====================================================================

[Kodack]

By IP Telephony if you mean VOIP then yes I do. I work on several products that can be utilized in that method including the Nortel USP (Universal Signaling Point). I work on the equipment that gives you GPRS/WAP/CSD over your cell phone, as well as equipment used for wireless billing and lawful intercept.

And by learning a few words a night, I mean learning the Kanji, pronounciation, and meaning. I've been exposed to the language for years through Anime so my ear can pick out the words once I know the meaning. Learning the Kanji seems to be the biggest hurdle though. I only know 40 so far. I find it easier to recognize the kanji and know the meaning than to draw it from memory. I guess reading comes before writing.

Seriously though I've been dis-heartened by a lot of the things I'm finding out about life in Japan, but it doesn't last and I always come back to the fascination. I am setting things in motion right now that may allow me to live abroad in a few years, so I'm hoping....

Thanks for your response.

Kodack

[Taro Toporific]

By IP Telephony if you mean VOIP then yes I do. I work on several products

Good. You're in the right technical area. Stress any experience you have with reworking software interfaces, hands-on coding in 1-byte to 2-byte adaptations and you can join the slim ranks of rich-&-infamous henna FG. 8)

And by learning a few words a night, I mean learning the Kanji, pronounciation, and meaning. I've been exposed to the language for years through Anime..

Bad. Don't let Japanese corporate types (or those in US for that matter) learn about your anime affiliation. Far too many clueless fan boys come the Japan and cause Hr/Personel Departments headaches. Say you're into "Japanese film" if you must. I evaluate several FG wannabe resumes every week here at Maybe-the-Biggest Inc. Any mention of anime on a resume is cause for instant placement into the circular file. :P

UGLY.Don't show up for J-interview in Birkenstocks and t-shirt or like a Mormon missionary. Japanese interviewers may feign interest in anime and bunka-baka pursuits, but they want is a majime non-dreamer.

[GomiGirl]

And by learning a few words a night, I mean learning the Kanji, pronounciation, and meaning. I've been exposed to the language for years through Anime so my ear can pick out the words once I know the meaning. Learning the Kanji seems to be the biggest hurdle though. I only know 40 so far. I find it easier to recognize the kanji and know the meaning than to draw it from memory. I guess reading comes before writing.

For Kanji recognition definitely use some flashcards - either ones you make yourself with little slips of cardboard with a hole punched at one end and a ring through it - these is the el cheapo ones. One side has the kanji and the other has the reading and some vocab using the kanji.

You can buy electronic flashcards - or there are some commercial and freeware flashcards for all flavours of PC, MAC, PDA yadi yadi. Now as a software developer, I would suggest you invest in commercial software as it is always better..

Having said that - there is a huige benefit in making your own as you have to write them on the card so that will put you on the right path.

Start with all the kanji for JLPT 4 Go to google and type in Japanese language proficiency test kanji and you will find quite a few sites that list these kanji and have flash cards that you can print and then use as your reference - there are 75 or so for level 4, 300 or so for level 3 etc - that is enough to keep you busy for a while. BTW it starts at 4 and goes to level 1.

With writing both kana and kanji, buy yourself an excercise book with a grid pattern so that you can keep all your writing the same size. Now print off a good example of the kanji you are trying to learn preferably showing stroke order. Now write the kanji about 300 times down the page from right to left in each grid square. Making sure that you use the correct stroke order.

Repeat this for all 4,000 or so kanji that you will have to learn for JLPT level 1 (trust me it ain't fun but it is the tried and true method for learning to write consistant kanji).

If you learn to read and write at the same time it will make things go alot quicker as you are using more of your senses together which aids in the retention.

BTW people don't speak like anime characters in the real world I am afraid to tell you.. best get your self a text book and learn some grammar.

[Steve Bildermann]

Anime - did you say anime! Don't laff. In the netherworld of the young and impressible playstation users there is but one name that stands above all others. Feared and respected as the ultimate fighting master.

King of the Iron Fist
Leader of a world wide financial Empire
Master of his own fighting style of Karate

Yes, you're right it's...

Heihachi Mishima



http://www.gamegen.com/fightgen/characters/heihachi.html

Ok so it's all in good fun right. And we all know that anime ain't for real right. Well not exactly if by sheer co-incidence Heihachi's only daughter (he disowned his son and rival Kazuya) and now successor to his leadership of the Mishima fighting style of Karate just so happens to be called.

Wait for it., Yep your right - Chisato.

Honestly, not a day goes by without my wife receiving earnestly written applications to join the Mishima clan, fight by her side, learn the deep secrets only taught to the elite.

Yoots from all over the world write begging for instruction. She receives offers of money, land and just about anything her hearts desires if she will only dain to admit them to the inner sanctorum. Of course the fact that Chisato is rather good at Karate tends to lend credence to the whole fansatsy.



I swear she could raise an army to take over a small south america country if she merely advertised for volunteers on her website.

AND YOU GUYS THINK YOU'VE GOT PROBLEMS!

[Taro Toporific]

Anime - did you say anime! Don't laff... Heihachi Mishima ...
... AND YOU GUYS THINK YOU'VE GOT PROBLEMS!

You mean there's wannabes that seek "Diaperboy.jpg" Mishima????
http://www.gamegen.com/fightgen/characters/diaperboy.jpg
(Warning this is a 492 KB JPEG)

No wonder these fanboy resumes for engineering positions are so weirded out.

[GomiGirl]

I swear she could raise an army to take over a small south america country if she merely advertised for volunteers on her website.

Venezuela?? Grab some of that oil???

But Argentina is still going cheap isn't it?

What a classic Steve.. Your life is just one adventure after another!!!

But I hope that Chisato has collected all of these.. I would love to see the unofficial web-site with the classics posted..

[Kodack]

Wow. I didn't expect so much comment about Anime. I would think that any exposure to Japanese language would be a good thing VS the alternative of no exposure. And yes I realize the difference between Anime and the real world . I do like Japanese cinema and I am an avid Akira Kurosawa fan. I only mentioned Anime because it was my first exposure to the language and I picked up the rythym and cadence of the language as well as inflection through years of exposure. For someone learning a new language it is a good way of picking up basics since the viewer base is usually grade school kids who don't have mastery over the language.

I'm not a Baka no Gaijin who thinks being an Otaku is the pinnacle of Japanese influence.... But perhaps one day I can work up to Fu*ked Gaijin

[den4]

Good luck with your adventures into J-land....

Taro is right about the anime thingie, though....when you're at work, best to be professional, as you should be, regardless of the country you're in...

and until you are really familiar with the J-lingo, don't pretend to understand when you don't, otherwise you can have some real communication breakdown problems...

Also understand that outside Tokyo, especially in other prefectures way to the north or south of New Edo, you're going to run across dialects that will make you think you're hearing Chinese or some other language...

Just be yourself. And don't try to be a stereotype gaijin just to gain popularity, like some of the gaijin tarentos do on TV....

For every good thing you find in Japan, you'll probably be annoyed by equally aggravating things...it's just life....but it will be 180 degrees different than what you expect while living in the US...especially since you'll be walking and driving on the "other" side of the road.....and get used to saying white and black, rather than black and white, when speaking nihongo...

Learn the kanji for the stations when traveling way outside of Tokyo.....most places are in English, but you do come across some way out place that may challenge you... at least they are in hiragana....

den4

train map of japan....in english..
http://www.zone81.com/arch_sections/trains

[Kodack]

[drone_56a]

Start with all the kanji for JLPT 4 Go to google and type in Japanese language proficiency test kanji and you will find quite a few sites that list these kanji and have flash cards that you can print and then use as your reference - there are 75 or so for level 4, 300 or so for level 3 etc - that is enough to keep you busy for a while. BTW it starts at 4 and goes to level 1.

*chuckle*
I was in Kinokuniya in NYC and impulse bought a JLPT prep book. I didn't do my homework so I picked up the level 1&2 book. I guess that explains why it looked so damn difficult.

[Jack]

Kodack,

Why this fascination of Japan? In any event, you will either love or hate it. I have never worked there but I go often enough that I can get by Tokyo and Osaka just like a local. I love the place. I am thinking of moving there after I get married. I wish you good luck in finding a job that will not require working until 9 or 10 PM everynight.

From what I heard, foreigners in professional positions are well treated in Japan although discrimination would be an issue just as much as a Japanese working at a US company in Dallas or Houston. All my friends have learned to handle discrimination and are hapy there.

By the way, girls also discriminate in Japan. They love foreign guys.

Good ruck.

[Kodack]

Why this fascination of Japan?

I love the culture, and believe the ups outnumber the downs.

There are many reasons why.

[Jack]

I am like you. I learned to speak, read and write by myself at home. I am obessessed with Japan. My post was serious. I wish you good luck.

[Kodack]

Thanks.

[American Oyaji]

I must be the odd one.

I came to Japan and then watched lots of anime and between that and regulary shows, I picked up the language.

I literally watched TV with a dictionary in hand.

But my kanji still sucks to hell. I know enough to get around and read manga, but I can't read a newspaper which is my ultimate goal.

But then again, I never needed too.

[Taro Toporific]

I must be the odd one.
I came to Japan and then watched lots of anime and between that and regular shows, I picked up the language.

I literally watched TV with a dictionary in hand.

Hell, that's not "odd".
My strategy was to watch a sodai gomi TV without a bilingual function for 6 hours a day. Damn, that sure did rot my brain after a few years.

I never used a dictionary though---I just poked at my native-speaker informant when things got too confusing. However, I can't tell you the number of times I have watched NHK's morning news and later picked up the Japan Times to discover that the news "differed" from what I heard.

[Big Booger]

Before coming to Japan, I studied Japanese three years 5 days a week at the university. I learned nearly 400 kanji from a basic kanji grammar book, we covered about 800, but I only knew well 400 or so.

When I got here, I took 2 Japanese classes and said screw it. All the Japanese I had learned was not spoken where I am at. I couldn't understand a damn word anyone said... I gave up.
So here I am now, after 1.5 years here, I have forgotten all the 400 kanji I knew. Haven't practiced anything..

I am just know formulating a plan to get my ass in gear to learn Japanese properly.. I guess I was burnt out on Japanese and am still kind of... but one of my resolutions for the New Year was to master Japanese, progressively.
BB

[Jack]

BB,

Do you mean that in Hyogo (where Kobe is located, right?) they speak a different Japanese? I have gone there several times and never noticed it when I spoke Japanese to the people there. Can you please tell me the difference?

Thanks,

[Andocrates]

Japanese is difficult but not impossible. But forget the crap you learn in most schools in America (you really don't realize how slow the pace of classroom teaching is, you can learn faster on your own) and most books you can buy at Barnes and nobel suck- stay away from Japanese for Busy people. And forget anime except for listening practice (to see how they conjugate and the artform of picking words out of a stream of like sounding syllables)

Learning Japanese is a skill, it's not an academic pursuit. Treat it like learning a musical instrument and you will do better. If you live close to NYC or San Francisco visit "Kinokuniya" bookstore and get some real Japanese textbooks. Don't let the kana scare you, (just make sure the kangi use furigana)

Myself I use a series called Genki Japanese that can be purchased from the Japan Times website - but you HAVE to buy the CD's (18,000 yen) they get you into short forms very quickly which is what you need.

After all that remember this lesson: High School girls don't speak Japanese, they speak a weird shortened form of short forms. That's the real problem is there isn't a clear path to Japanese like there is too english or other languages. Japanese is spoken differently depending on where you are and who you are with. And to top it off due to the nature of the language when you say something it has to be almost flawless.

While Americans can pick up the meaning of a flawed, error ridden sentence Japanese seem to lack this ability - either from some sort of pride or because the language is spoken backwards and they miss clues in the early part of your sentence.

At any rate living in Japan is essential to really learn this language.

[Jack]

Thanks for that. I bought the Genki books (both 1 and 2) but not the CD. So you are saying that I should also buy the CDs. My books are in romajo and Japanese. Is there a version that is entirely in Japanese?

[Andocrates]

I meant you have to get the cd's because they are so usefull and are part of the process the book uses. Without the cd's it's just another textbook.


I could send you an mp3 sample I guess, what lesson are you on?

[Jack]

I am near the end of the first book. Leson 12.

[Andocrates]

e-mail me at mooky_from_mars@hotmail.com and I'll tell you where it is, but the mp3 is 12 megs is that going to be a problem?

[Steve Bildermann]

Andocrates points out many valid points about learning and using Japanese. I would add the following.

From my own experience eventually there comes a point where academic study must give way to simply getting out in Japan and talking to as many different Japanese speakers about as many different things as possible. I used to switch between reading and speaking days (I wasn't too bothered about writing)

On my reading days I used to walk around the Yamanote line (yes the entire loop and try to read *everything* I saw in order as it came up. Advertisements, posters, magazine racks, bus stop signs, shop windows. When I couldn't read something I would stop passerbys and ask them to write it down and then read it to me while I recorded what they said.

On my speaking days I would circle some stories in the newspapers, go out and ask peoples opinion about them. I used to go into banks and discuss interest rates and investment strategies. Lots of people out there are paid to talk to you, salespeople, Govt workers etc.

You just gotta get out there and live in the language.

Just my 2 yens worth.

[Taro Toporific]

You just gotta get out there and live in the language.

I'll agree with Steve and all the others here on their study suggestions. All I can add is, "Sa, gaman da na...

Some days, if not most, I still feel like the worst-case, non-learner in Japan, even though I'm the eldest henna gaijin here on the FG. In my only-Japanese work environment, it's amazing how slow Japanese learning has been over the past 20-odd years... but hell that's why the kidnapped-but-not-forgotten bikkle calls this place F*ckedGaijin.com.

On my reading days I used to walk around the Yamanote line (yes the entire loop and try to read *everything* I saw in order as it came up. Advertisements, posters, magazine racks, bus stop signs, shop windows. When I couldn't read something I would stop passerbys ...

My favorite learning trick is to ride around the Yamanote line with a wacky manga I've snatched and ask cute girls sitting next to me on the train what things mean, like cho-kimoi. It always gets a giggle out them and me.

[gomichild]

I agree - get out and live it is the best way...have a couple of botles of warm sake under your belt when you do - it's amazing how fluent ou can become...

[Jack]

Andocrates,

Thank you for that. I just realized I don't have and MP3 player. Is there another way I can hear that. My e-mail is neverman8@aol.com.

Thanks