"Sexy China Casts Shadows on a Not-Rising Sun"

[Mulboyne]

Bloomberg: Sexy China Casts Shadows on a Not-Rising Sun: William Pesek Jr
China is the economic equivalent of sex -- it sells. If you want headlines and investors calling for prospectuses, stick the word "China" in the name of your company or product. It's not unlike the rush to attach ".com" to the end of anything five years ago.
... China's 9 percent growth -- compared with about 1 percent in Japan -- should be worry enough for officials in Tokyo. An agreement China signed with Asean to cut tariffs on $100 billion of goods, paving the way toward a free-trade zone in five years covering a third of the world's population, is an even bigger threat. It will already be boosting Asia's No. 2 economy by the time Japan gets down to similar negotiations of its own. China's rise is forcing Japan, which in the 1980s and 1990s thought it had joined the West, to look east anew.
... If Koizumi notices that Japan risks being eclipsed by China, he's not letting on. He personifies the stoicism one observes around Japan these days. Folks from Tokyo to Okinawa have heard all the speculation that the future belongs to China, and it's only a matter of time before Japan plays a subordinate role. Most Japanese aren't buying it; aren't conceding their place in the global pecking order. So, the world is doing it for them.
... For better or worse...China is rising while Japan is losing its buzz. If ever there was a time for Japan to worry about its dwindling status on the Asian and global stages, this is it.

[Taro Toporific]

[Skankster]

China is the economic equivalent of sex -- it sells..

And is how you contract VD too.

That article is oblivious to the phallus that China is riding... cheap labor. Low tech.

Compared to Japan, China is an immoral nation.

Dont people see that it is the speculation on China (similar to that of Japan during the bubble) that is getting all the buzz?

There is little substance.

[Samurai_Jerk]

A lot of economists would agree with you Skankster. Quite a few are predicting China's bubble is about to burst.

[Buraku]

[Mulboyne]

Well...I'm no apologist for Japanese finances but the above analysis quoted is gibberish. Losing value and making losses are very different concepts as "backward" Malaysia and Thailand are only too well aware.

[Mulboyne]

This story highlight some of the China risks. The mainland parent company arranged a sale of a stake in CAO to foreign investors, in an attempt to raise funds, without disclosing the hole in the balance sheet.
Kyodo via Yahoo: CAO admits US$550 million loss from speculative derivatives trade

China Aviation Oil has acknowledged that it had suffered a staggering US$550 million, or about S$900 million, in losses from speculative oil derivatives trading...Trading in the counter has been suspended since Monday pending the announcement. China Aviation Oil will propose a plan for creditors to pay its debts and it is asking the High Court to help fix a meeting with creditors.

[Buraku]

Bloomberg tells it the way it is, sure it ain't always 100% truthful and it sometimes highlights stuff with a little exaggeration
& certain people's analysis can be a bit strong. However there is no real economist or writer in Jp that points out the real dangers of the Koizumi policy in the land of sheepish overworked salarymen and bad banking loans.

True China has been a backward nation, a cruel communist state ruled by a cruel dictator called Mao. Yet now China has started to change, the Chinese are open to foreign ideas, there is more economic freedom within the country and foreign nations are allowed set up shop in the middle Kingdom and conduct real trade. Need I remind anyone how cruel, backward and poverty stricken Japan was in the late 40s and early 50s not long after the second world war. Then with some strong leadership, a lot of outside help from Aussies/British/Americans Japan started to slowly grow again and did so for a few more decades. The Japanese grew, the strongest point being the 80s when the yen soared against the dollar, Japan companies made US headlines from buying up American studios & firms and Japanese made headlines by the purchase of over-priced works of art for their company lobby. However none of the warning signs were read and soon the huge bubble would slowly pop ! Many writers say the Chinese are at a stage much like Japan of the 60s or early 70s, they have a lot more to grow, the Chinese industrial production can grow a lot more and theri bubble won't be going pop for another decade or so and by then it may be too late for Japan because it has already been losing badly to other Asian nations in the past few years.

China has been having massive growth, even with rising prices of oil, the unstable economic climate and internal problems the Chinese economy continues on at amazing rates, it was so strong that it came out of the Asian economic crisis totally unscathed. If these problems haven't stopped it in the past years its likely nothing will in the next decade. The Chinese are improving in almost every area of economics, their material industry ( sugar, plastics, slat and aluminiums ) is doing fine, the banking system shows a whole lot more promise than the Japan banks ever did and it has increased its exports of machinery and transport equipment rapidly. Their is a real feeling based on economic performance that Japan with its rising unemployement numbers will be totally bankrupt long before the bubble pops in China. In an economy as large as China 550 in losses is nothing but spare chinage, a couple of cents, a few pennies.... :P
If you want to talk about real losses you only need look at the Japan companies that are losing Billions, because of the growth of other Asian economies, or check out the bad banking practice and pension system that is costing Japan Trillions, or look at the quoted analysis which points to the Quadrillions Japan is sinking in from internal debts.
when it comes to economics Koizumi is clueless

[Mulboyne]

when it comes to economics Koizumi is clueless

You have that right. I think it is almost certain that the China "bubble" will burst but, through painful experience, I've learned that you don't get any credit for trying to pick the top - bubbles always seem to last longer than they should.
China shouldn't be worried about a bubble. They should be planning for what to do in the aftermath which, as you point out, has been Japan's great failing. Bubbles misallocate resources but they only occur when there are resources to allocate and, by and large, most systems get it wrong somewhere along the line because everyting is new. It is clear that China is making mistakes but, in the best case, the country will learn from Japan's mistakes and deal with a post-bubble world in a way which helps us all.

[h22chen]

and stupid industralized nations are going to create free trade with china (eg. New Zealand)

[Buraku]

Blinky is fucked
It has happened - China has overtaken Japan !
2 United States $ 10,400,000,000,000
3 China $ 5,700,000,000,000
4 Japan $ 3,550,000,000,000
http://www.photius.com/rankings/gdp_2003_0.html
How many more people do I need to educate? BTW, check CIA too... lists China even higher [6.5 trillion]
plus there is now the EU factor...which have a huge powerful central banks and trade blocks and the Euro Zone
this would push Japan down to 4th place
Perhaps even India, Russia and others will soon pass Japan out if this economic madness continues for another 10 years

.

The Japanese economy is failing because of the Keiretsu system doesn't work in a global ecomony, at least not after the Japanese caught up to other major players...?


http://www.fuckedgaijin.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11840&start=10
http://forum.japantoday.com/m_77034/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm
http://www.rieti.go.jp/en/miyakodayori/022.html
http://www.network54.com/Forum/thread?forumid=238054&messageid=1108161667&lp=1115101467
http://www.imf.org/external/np/tr/2004/tr041019.htm
IshiHitller is going down
China's potential internal economy is 10 times as big as the Japanese market

[jingai]

Well... there is more than one way to calculate GDP. Using purchasing power parity (i.e. what in China can a Chinese person buy with their currency- a lot, compared with high cost of living Japan) China is #2.
If you do GDP other ways it's not so high.

From the CIA world factbook,

Measured on a purchasing power parity (PPP) basis, China in 2004 stood as the second-largest economy in the world after the US, although in per capita terms the country is still poor.

GDP - per capita:
purchasing power parity - $5,600 (2004 est.)

[devicenull]

Well... there is more than one way to calculate GDP. Using purchasing power parity (i.e. what in China can a Chinese person buy with their currency- a lot, compared with high cost of living Japan) China is #2.
If you do GDP other ways it's not so high.

From the CIA world factbook,

Measured on a purchasing power parity (PPP) basis, China in 2004 stood as the second-largest economy in the world after the US, although in per capita terms the country is still poor.

GDP - per capita:
purchasing power parity - $5,600 (2004 est.)

In real dollars, it is much lower than that, in the city, a decent job for a college graduate will be around $250-300 a month. In the poor regions, $100 a year or less is not so uncommon. But, it goes a lot further domestically than outside the country.

[Buraku]

Japan Increasingly Alarmed By The Land Of The Setting Sun
http://www.spacedaily.com/dragonspace.html
http://www.spacedaily.com/news/china-05zzl.html
China is preparing to open its arms industry to private and foreign investment to take advantage of the private sector's resources to modernize its military, state media said

Hiroshi Okuda, president of Nippon Keidanren (Japan Business Federation) is starting to piss his pants as Japan economy corps and J-firms may face a showdown with China

[Buraku]

Hate Chinese

http://www.japantoday.com/e/?content=news&id=339909

Hate-China' sentiment spreading at Foreign Ministry

[cstaylor]

What did you expect after the Chinese trashed the embassy?

[Buraku]

What did you expect after the Chinese trashed the embassy?

I actually expected more from those China commies,
afterall guys like Nakasone and Mori call them Negro or Chink while Uyoku ram their buses into the China consulate kamikaze style

I thought the Chinese might be more agressive perhaps send out a few ships or fire a few missiles or something,
perhaps they'll do something soon enough

[cstaylor]

I thought the Chinese might be more agressive perhaps send out a few ships or fire a few missiles or something,
perhaps they'll do something soon enough

They don't need to do that. All China needs to do is continue growing their economy.

All that would do is push Japan even closer to the U.S.

China's inability to turn off the oil tap to NK is now biting them in the ass. If NK really has nukes now, China can't push them around as much as they could in the past.

[Buraku]

and stupid industralized nations are going to create free trade with china (eg. New Zealand)

China to Overtake Japan's [fill in gap] etc etc
look at the other China topics
Quote :

China's entertainment and media industry is expected to overtake Japan to become Asia Pacific's biggest market by 2008, according to the latest PricewaterhouseCoopers' report...Factors contributing to the growth of China's...industry include the emergence of new TV channels and magazines...Meanwhile, the 2008 Beijing Olympic Games is also expected to boost China's advertising industry...Findings from PwC revealed that China's online advertising income is expected to leap from US$19 billion in 2004 to US$90 billion in 2009.

[homesweethome]

Buraku wrote:

thought the Chinese might be more agressive perhaps send out a few ships or fire a few missiles or something,
perhaps they'll do something soon enough

What is more important than the reality in this is the 'perception' of reality. China and both Koreas think Japan is an aging, economic power that is on the ropes. They can smell blood, and they want blood for what Japan has done to them in the past. They have both drawn a line in the sand with this territorial issues around a few small rocks in the South China Sea, but these are important national symbols for both countries. How Japan acts will serve as a bellweather for rising nationalism (and resentments) in all the region. Japan is in a no win situation, neither can it expect help from it's big brother (US) unless it is attacted directly. You can have any opinion you want about the regime in China and it's human rights record, but this doesn't mean squat. They are a fiercely proud and nationalist folk, and there are a lot of them willing to sacrifice themselves to any government willing to 'payback' Japan. Expect some sort of military confrontation at any time. Just keep your heads down when the shooting starts, gaijin in Japan will be the first to get the heat.

[Buraku]

China's growth shows no sign of slowing, according a new report by the Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD).

In its first analysis of China's economy, the OECD said the private sector now provided half its output.
It found much to praise in one of the most rapid economic transformations of modern times but said there was also room for progress in key areas.
China must do more to improve education spending and protect the environment.



China's economy has grown by an average of 9.5% a year over the past 20 years and the OECD says it won't slow down any time soon.

China plans to launch its second manned space mission after the National Day holiday next month, a state-run newspaper said
Shenzhou VI to be launched soon
http://www.int.iol.co.za/
The spacecraft Shenzhou VI will be launched from the Jiuquan Space Launch Centre in north-west China's Gansu province, using a Long March 2F rocket, the report said.
The space flight will involve two astronauts, as previously reported, and will last 119 hours or five days, the newspaper said.

[Buraku]

China




Vs

Nippon

[Greji]

China

Vs

Nippon

Nippon wins hands down. No army in the world could face that beast. Instant retreat!

[Buraku]

Top U.S. officials are criticizing what they call China's indiscriminate sale of weapons to rogue countries, suggesting that Beijing's shortsighted policies has had made the world more dangerous.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/15/AR2006091500169.html

[Buraku]

[Buraku]

Thursday, Nov. 15, 2007
The fusillade against China


http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-b...0071115gc.html

It's a 'Gregory Clark' article so take it with a pinch of salt