Accumulate good karma and help fucked ex-fucked gaijin

[rooboy]

Just got an email today from someone I used to hang out with when they were in Japan. They left Japan last year to return home (fellow Aussie) and as they say themselves, are a cautionary tale about life post Japan for gaijin (no, this isnt in the leaving japan section coz this person needs advice).

They had what I think is a bloody good cv before they went to Japan, they spent 6 years working in Japan at non -run of the mill jobs (unlike my largely chain school record) like good companies that are household names and eikaiwa where they had a lot of responsibility.

They returned to Australia last year thinking that at the most they'd be unemployed for 3 months - and haven't had a job for nearly 1 year. They are desperate to get out of Australia, the desperation being compounded by the fact that they've gone through most of their savings. It's gone on rent and no, they're not on social security thanks to the centrelink nazis' punishment of people who save money instead of throwing it all away and then living off the welfare system.

They were told they couldn't get any benefits til they'd spent much of their savings (no, not as much as you'd think - they told me how much they saved) and they had to rent a flat and pay for it with no work. I'm sympathetic becoz I know what Australia is like for people trying to find work - that's why I've stayed away so long! A lot of the stuff re jobs is word of mouth and contacts.

My friend is fucked because they live in a state with the second worse unemployment rate in Australia. The jobs they did before going to Japan were publicly financed ones and all these programs were axed courtesy of Johnnie Howard's govt's funding cuts while they were living in Japan. They did a lot of teaching work thru these programs but they don't have formal teaching qualifications.

Reading between the lines, their family is useless for helping with jobs or contacts, and they've found that 6 years away from your home country sees your old life drift away, including people who once might have helped you.

They're wondering about South Korea and I don't know a fucking thing about the place becoz I never want to go there - I want to go there like I want to eat rat curry. Have any fucked gaijin here worked in South Korea? If so - is May too late to be hired? My friend has got a rental lease til late April and wants to go after that.

How do you find the real info about good employers? I suggested eslcafe but they said when they wanted to join they were given an email grilling about their reasons for wanting to join and Big Brother declarations that the eslcafe moderators knew their IP address, etc.

So - has anybody got any REAL info on how to get a decent job in South Korea and when the next hiring period would be? Your reward will be, like mine, good karma. I shudder whenever I think of going back to Australia because I'll be even more fucked as somebody with a shitty pre Japan cv and nondescript work here.

Thanks folks.

[Charles]

I was shocked and dismayed to hear your story.. um, I mean your friend's story. It is so hard to believe that an ozzie could be a shiftless, unemployable layabout. As long as there is one gutter not yet occupied by a sleeping, drunken ozzie lying in a pool of his own vomit, there will always be a place for you.. uh, I mean your friend.

[Mulboyne]

I see Google has a bunch of links but I'm sure your friend has already thought of that. Caustic Saint knows Korea well but he hasn't been around on the forums much lately. You could try sending him a PM which he might notice. People on the Japan Teaching forums out there might be able to steer you in the direction too.

[kamome]

I totally sympthize with your friend's predicament. I went through the same thing in the U.S. after living in Japan for years - and my resume had good credentials before I went there AND I worked for household names in Japan. Wound up burning through my entire life savings before I eventually found a job after 8 months of searching. This is why I tell people on this forum not to make the decision to jump to Japan too lightly - the risk is that you can totally fuck up your chances of having a future life in your own country.

Going to Korea isn't a great solution. It means they are running from their problems again. Of course, you have to eat so if Korea offers a chance at a new life and there truly is nothing in Australia for them, then I'd go for it. My question is: before moving to Korea, wouldn't there be more opportunities in other parts of Australia that have a better unemployment rate?

[Samurai_Jerk]

Stop using "they" when talking about one person.

[rooboy]

I'd have buckley's chance (ie no chance) of getting work if I went back to Australia anytime in the foreseeable future and I'm happy to admit that my shit pre Japan cv and chain school/part-time one hour a week gigs in Japan would see me having to go to the centrelink (Australia's social security) nazis when I returned.

I'm respecting a friend's confidentiality and that's why it's 'they' for the info of the last poster. Thanks Mulboyne and Kamome - will tell them about your suggestions. Its not so simple to return home, which is why I'm avoiding it for as long as I can.

Kamome's post was espc. interesting - has the US got the same kind of chip on the shoulder attitude from the welfare drones?

In Australia you can be a no-hoper who doesn't give a fuck if they never get out of bed again except to go down to centrelink. As long as you keep throwing all the rent assistance, phone bill assistance and fortnightly money which amounts to more than for somebody working their arse off at a fast food place down the drain and never try to save, you'll get rewarded by getting more of it.

It helps if you spend it on cigarettes, booze, takeways for Aussies and 'gangster rap' sports clothing and mobile phones for refugees/immigrants who need to be supported by the state. You'll get rewarded for not saving any, and as a bonus the centrelink staff won't push you to take the first job they offer in spite of their propaganda that everybody on social security has to now take work offered.

But if you're a hard working bastard who goes home to Australia and does the social security system a favour by saving it money - you're forced to go through all your savings and in a fucked way, blamed by association for being somebody who got off your duff and did something with your life. I've seen the way the system works when I've gone home and its made me hang around Japan long than I thought.

As for the work situation Kamome, Aussies have a bit of the derukugi mentality. A chip on the shoulder about people who go and do things like working overseas. I've heard it said that we are 'spoilt brats who use mummy and daddy's trust fund to get over there' and crap like that, not my situation. I worked at some shitty jobs to save to go to Japan becoz I couldnt get real work post-graduation from uni. And the kinds of people who go through their social security in a weekend of booze and fast food and those who are working but still want to waste their money whinge about 'privileged bastards who go overseas'. If I'd got their benefits/jobs I'd have gone to Japan earlier, could have saved a lot of money.

With the work situation, teaching English tends to be looked down upon as a 'gap year' no matter how long. You can't teach ESL in Australia without a TESL/TESOL whatever certificate - doesnt matter that you taught TOEC to company employees like a few Aussies I know. And even in the bigger cities, too many opportunities are non advertised. There's a big push on for Aussies to pay increasingly idiotic uni fees to go back and get all these qualifications - like MBAs, various Masters, diplomas etc that basically won't get you far in a country of only 20million people. All good reasons to stay away from my home!

My friend's examples been a wake up call.

[gomichild]

Chatting to a friend back home in Australia - she mentioned that certificates for many types of work is now a necessity - even for those who have never left and have worked in that profession for years. I was surprised by this - and we both concluded that really it's just revenue raising.

The easiest way to move back home is to go into some kind of study. Or at least 6 months before start looking while you are still here - and start making contacts.

[kamome]

I'd have buckley's chance (ie no chance) of getting work if I went back to Australia anytime in the foreseeable future and I'm happy to admit that my shit pre Japan cv and chain school/part-time one hour a week gigs in Japan would see me having to go to the centrelink (Australia's social security) nazis when I returned.

I'm respecting a friend's confidentiality and that's why it's 'they' for the info of the last poster. Thanks Mulboyne and Kamome - will tell them about your suggestions. Its not so simple to return home, which is why I'm avoiding it for as long as I can.

Kamome's post was espc. interesting - has the US got the same kind of chip on the shoulder attitude from the welfare drones?

In Australia you can be a no-hoper who doesn't give a fuck if they never get out of bed again except to go down to centrelink. As long as you keep throwing all the rent assistance, phone bill assistance and fortnightly money which amounts to more than for somebody working their arse off at a fast food place down the drain and never try to save, you'll get rewarded by getting more of it.

It helps if you spend it on cigarettes, booze, takeways for Aussies and 'gangster rap' sports clothing and mobile phones for refugees/immigrants who need to be supported by the state. You'll get rewarded for not saving any, and as a bonus the centrelink staff won't push you to take the first job they offer in spite of their propaganda that everybody on social security has to now take work offered.

But if you're a hard working bastard who goes home to Australia and does the social security system a favour by saving it money - you're forced to go through all your savings and in a fucked way, blamed by association for being somebody who got off your duff and did something with your life. I've seen the way the system works when I've gone home and its made me hang around Japan long than I thought.

As for the work situation Kamome, Aussies have a bit of the derukugi mentality. A chip on the shoulder about people who go and do things like working overseas. I've heard it said that we are 'spoilt brats who use mummy and daddy's trust fund to get over there' and crap like that, not my situation. I worked at some shitty jobs to save to go to Japan becoz I couldnt get real work post-graduation from uni. And the kinds of people who go through their social security in a weekend of booze and fast food and those who are working but still want to waste their money whinge about 'privileged bastards who go overseas'. If I'd got their benefits/jobs I'd have gone to Japan earlier, could have saved a lot of money.

With the work situation, teaching English tends to be looked down upon as a 'gap year' no matter how long. You can't teach ESL in Australia without a TESL/TESOL whatever certificate - doesnt matter that you taught TOEC to company employees like a few Aussies I know. And even in the bigger cities, too many opportunities are non advertised. There's a big push on for Aussies to pay increasingly idiotic uni fees to go back and get all these qualifications - like MBAs, various Masters, diplomas etc that basically won't get you far in a country of only 20million people. All good reasons to stay away from my home!

My friend's examples been a wake up call.

Where I'm coming from, it's just that - for certain professions anyway - overseas experience is not considered an adequate substitute for home country experience in the US and is sometimes even considered inferior training. There is some truth to this, but again it depends on your career.

If you don't have any home country training, the first question most employers will ask is 'what skills can you offer'? Did you learn something overseas that the employer would consider valuable to the business? If you have acquired nothing that would constitute a translatable set of skills, you will have a hard time convincing an employer to hire you. I'm sure that's not a US-only attitude.

[TFG]

This whole thing of having a huge hole in one's resume while living in Japan is the main reason we are all FG's!

I sympathize greatly with your friend, even though some obviously don't give a toss about anyone other than their self esteem.

[D.]

It's written for U.S. citizens but is broadly applicable for any FG. See the following link http://travel.state.gov/travel/living/teaching/teaching_1240.html
For what it's worth, I think if I was looking at working as an English teacher outside of Japan, I'd be more tempted to go to China or Eastern Europe. Good luck!

[FG Lurker]

Going home after a long stint in Japan (3yrs+) is extremely difficult. The longer you are here, the tougher it is to land on your feet at home. Combine that with doing work here unrelated to what you wish to do at home, and you end up fucked in a big hurry.

If your friend wants to live in Australia then the best thing he can do is stay there and hunt for work, even if it means moving somewhere else in-country that has more work on offer. Leaving now and doing another stint of teaching will only make his situation even worse.

If he does want to leave, coming back to Japan where he has contacts and friends is probably the best thing he can do. If he got kicked out for being stupid (a la TFG) then he's fucked and will have to start over somewhere else. (If that's the case he should check carefully into the laws of where he goes, not everywhere is as "nice" as Japan about stuff like that.)

[kurohinge1]

. . . So - has anybody got any REAL info on how to get a decent job in South Korea and when the next hiring period would be? . . .

Your friend could apply for the role of a "bitter old bigot" in Coralville, Iowa (U.S.), but they'll have to wait for charles to retire from it first.

Everyone else's posts appear helpful and I agree with those who say not to just run away from the problem.

If this guy/girl has failed to secure work in their desired field within 12 months, they should seriously consider further study to either get better qualified or to get into a new field.

Just my 2 cents.

[kamome]

[quote="kurohinge1"]If this guy/girl has failed to secure work in their desired field within 12 months, they should seriously consider further study to either get better qualified or to get into a new field.

]
That's right, school is probably the best escape valve if staying in country. Of course, there are drawbacks to this course of action: Once they graduate, they will be starting at zero in their new job in terms of seniority and whatever prior experience they have likely will be disregarded. So you could wind up being 35+ years old with a boss several years younger.

There is also the expense of paying for schooling and the opportunity cost of not working during those school years. If you have no money to begin with, it's hard to embark on a program that requires you to pay tuition and the cost of books in addition to living expenses.

[Adhesive]

If your friend was returning to the U.S. I would suggest graduate school without hesitation. Even if he didn't do well at his undergraduate institution, there are more than enough places here that will take "mediocre" students who are willing to pay big tuition for something like a master's degree. Also, unlike the real world, the admission committies love seeing "worked abroad" on your CV, as it helps promote their goal of diversity, etc. And tuition is not a problem if you don't mind taking out a student loan. As a graduate student you are allowed to take out a ridiculous amount of money. Trust me, I'm forced to borrow over $50k a year for law school.

I don't know what the situation is like in Australia, but maybe this is something your friend could check into. The debt is terrifying, not doubt about it, but if it is for a degree that will land him a decent-paying job, than the low interest student loans are absolutely worth it. I mean, what's his alternative, really?

[Samurai_Jerk]

I mean, what's his alternative, really?

Getting stuck in Japan with the rest of us loser.

[rooboy]

You certainly gave food for thought for fuckedgaijins staying in Japan but fighting the future outside (me!) and you helped my friend who's grateful and says the Bundy's (Bundaberg Rum) on them if you ever go to Australia!

They've decided to go back to uni and focus on marketing/human resources. It won't cost as much as in the US.Australia's a bit deadbeat economically but tho higher ed costs have gone sky high compared to what they used to be, Aussies are still better off because the tuition fees are still more subsidised by the govt.

That way they've also got alternatives to watching their savings disappear under rent and other living costs. They'd be better off even living in a uni college which is expensive but at least provides 3 meals a day and everthing's inclusive in the accommodation fee and there might even be a way to get some student assistance.

I meself thought that heading off to Korea was gonna prove the cemetery of their hopes of ever getting back into the workforce in Australia, just putting off the bleak future a bit more. Memo to anybody including myself - we should be a bit more positive about Japan. I am usually but when I get pissed off by some things here I wont forget that I dont have to worry about centrelink nazis or other chip on the shoulder morons like I would in Australia.

Japan rocks! a lot of the time. Even Yamaguchi Prefecture rocked compared to what'd be waiting at home for me!

[mr. sparkle]

I never considered that 3 years as a FG would make it tough to return home. 3 years goes by in no time these days. At least for me.

[FG Lurker]

I never considered that 3 years as a FG would make it tough to return home. 3 years goes by in no time these days. At least for me.

It entirely depends on what you do in Japan and what you wish to do at home.

If you put your career at home on hold and teach at Nova for 3 years in Japan, you're going to be very fucked indeed.

However, if you find a way to keep active in your own career here, hopefully while maintaining contacts at home, you probably won't have so much trouble settling back into the workforce at home.

Everyone is different though... These are just broad generalizations.

[mr. sparkle]

It entirely depends on what you do in Japan and what you wish to do at home.

If you put your career at home on hold and teach at Nova for 3 years in Japan, you're going to be very fucked indeed.

However, if you find a way to keep active in your own career here, hopefully while maintaining contacts at home, you probably won't have so much trouble settling back into the workforce at home.

Everyone is different though... These are just broad generalizations.

Fair enough. I'm gonna continue to take my Japan in bite sized chunks. About a month is fun, but then I yearn to return to the homeland.

[TFG]

If he got kicked out for being stupid (a la TFG) then he's fucked and will have to start over somewhere else.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
TFG was not being stupid neither did I get kicked out.
He was thanked by the cops for being the perfect gentleman after the cops sat on his sofa smoking cigarettes after asking him for an ash tray that there would not be a problem with, then proceeding to half open two draws apologizing profusely for having to do so, sticking a couple of fingers inside a swishing my underwear around for 5 seconds.

[FG Lurker]

TFG was not being stupid neither did I get kicked out.

You weren't being stupid?

Take illegal drugs in Japan. Get sick, go to the hospital, give a urine sample, and actually admit to the staff that you have taken illegal drugs. Cap it all off by posting about it (in detail!) on a public bulletin board.

If you think any of the above isn't unbelievably stupid then you're even stupider than I thought -- and that's saying something.

[TFG]

You weren't being stupid?

Take illegal drugs in Japan. Get sick, go to the hospital, give a urine sample, and actually admit to the staff that you have taken illegal drugs. Cap it all off by posting about it (in detail!) on a public bulletin board.

If you think any of the above isn't unbelievably stupid then you're even stupider than I thought -- and that's saying something.

The Lurking Turd once more raises its head.

Illegal HERB is the preferred vocabulary.
And what trouble has this gotten me in and why did YOU bring this up initially in this thread?

Give me a fucking break.

[GomiGirl]

Herb/drugs what is the difference? They are all drugs.

[Tommybar]

So is coffee, tea, chocolate, cigarettes, etc.

There IS a difference.

[FG Lurker]

Illegal HERB is the preferred vocabulary.

Trying to call it something else doesn't change what it was or help your lack of intelligence.

And what trouble has this gotten me in and why did YOU bring this up initially in this thread?

What trouble!? Your troubles are just beginning. Cops being "nice" does not mean that they aren't going to bust your ass the next chance they get. You're a known idiot, and some smart cop is going to make you his ticket to a promotion.

Give me a fucking break.

Why? Because you're a fucking moron? Sorry, no breaks for morons.

[TFG]

Trying to call it something else doesn't change what it was or help your lack of intelligence.


What trouble!? Your troubles are just beginning. Cops being "nice" does not mean that they aren't going to bust your ass the next chance they get. You're a known idiot, and some smart cop is going to make you his ticket to a promotion.


Why? Because you're a fucking moron? Sorry, no breaks for morons.

That is just where you are wrong Dick Head!
You are the fucking moron here, you self opinionated Jerk Off !:D

[thoughtfire]

I just had to stop lurking and insert my 2 cents here.

Going home after a long stint anywhere is tough. Add to the fact that most people in the United States (and Australia by the sounds of it) really do not know or care much about non-Western cultures except the mental sound bites they get in the pop culture and you may be facing a tough job search.

I lived in Taiwan for a while, Japan for a shorter while, and found that it was a black hole in my resume. 2 suggestions that worked for me, though I still live part of the year in East Asia:

1. If you can speak Japanese well, get a job with a Japanese company in Australia. If they are like the Chinese, overseas Japanese will appreciate that you have lived in Japan. It may not pay as well but it can be good experience and a way of kickstarting your career.

2. Go to grad school. This is like a 'Go Directly to Start' card in Monopoly, allowing you to have a fresh start and putting you before a higher class of employers who may even appreciate your Japan experience.