English Teacher Warns Of Racism in Japan

[Mulboyne]

[Buraku]

Abducted Chinese woman released;
police then arrest her for overstaying visa
http://www.japantoday.com/jp/news/405329

[omae mona]

The Japanese Onsens, or public baths have also become more and more reluctant to accept foreigners as bathers. The reason is that Russian sailors made some boo-boo at some Onsens in Hokkaido and now all foreigners are marred. Hey, we all look alike to them.

Did this guy ever actually step out of his apato when he was in Japan? Or did he spend the whole time reading Debito's web site?

Basically, one needs to understand that most Japanese landlords will not rent to a foreigner

I must have been living in Bizarro world until now.

I called all around the Japanese agencies, but had a very poor response

Would it be safe to assume the poor response was because he was speaking English to people who didn't understand a word of English?


Ok, since Mulboyne started a new thread, I'll take the opportunity to spout out my own bullshit theory of discrimination in Japan: it exists, in small quantities, but 95% of the folks complaining about it are not experiencing actual discrimination. Ask people who are fluent in the language if they experience discrimination, and I think you'd find the percentage of complaints goes down drastically. I think unfriendly responses from Japanese people come mainly because we are not behaving like normal members of society (in particular, not speaking the language). Unlike the color of one's skin, one can change this through practice and study, and alleviate the problem. So I don't consider it to be "discrimination".

I can only guess, but I have a hunch the article's author was a victim of not knowing how to navigate the apartment rental market (no Japanese friends helping him, and no language skills). Not a victim of discrimination.

[American Oyaji]

I'd say you are very on point OM. I've gone to quite a few places that said "Japanese Only" because I spoke Japanese. I popped my head into a bar and asked where a good bar was and they said THIS ONE IS, PLEASE COME IN.

I did it to see what would happen because of the Japanese Only sign. Its only enforced when there is a problem with communication.

[Doctor Stop]

I must have been living in Bizarro world until now.

It's quite possible that the author was speaking more for those outside of the Tokyo area. Tokyo is not the real Japan. Tokyo is Bizarro World, or the inaka is, depending on your viewpoint.

I'll try to find some of my "no pets or gaijin" real estate ad photos (taken in Tokyo).

[Samurai_Jerk]

OM, I agree with you to an extent. The better my language skills get the more accepted I am by the locals. And like AO, I've been allowed into places once they determined I could speak Japanese.

However, there definitely are places that won't rent to gaijin and cops do randomly stop people based only on how they look and ask for their ID. The ammount of racism you experience also depends on what kind of gaijin you are. A real estate agent once told me he could probably find me a place because I'm American, but a lot of places won't rent to Chinese people.

I think the reason some people get so worked up about it is they're not used to being the minority. A white guy from Springfield, USA who comes to Japan to teach English has probably never experienced discrimination before. When he does try to go to a bar with a no gaijin policy or can't get a taxi to stop for him at night it's a shock to the system. Then he hears all the rumors about racism directed towards a friend of a friend and comes across debito.org and starts getting a complex.

The thing he forgets about is the positive side of discrimination: Cute girls want to talk to him just because he looks different and they think gaijin packages are big; Oyaji at the yakitori-ya want to cover his beer; Night clubs let him in for less than the local guys. And like the Japanese, he isn't aware of his own racism or the racism in the community he came from.

I've definitely been subjected to blatant racism in Japan but I've always tried to keep things in perspective. Having grown up with a lot of black and hispanic friends I saw difference in how they were treated compared to me and my other white friends when we tried to get a taxi at night or went to a department store to go shopping. And because of my name, a lot of people assume I'm black before they meet me. Some of my girlfriends' parents in high school definitely had some nervous questions for their daughters when they first heard the new boyfriend's name. And these were progressive upper-middle class people that would never consider themselves racist and probably voted Democrat.

Is Japan racist? Yes. Is it as bad as a lot of people make it out to be? No. Is it bad enough that we need to join Debito in his crusade to win greater legal protection and acceptance by Japanese society? I guess that's up to the individual to decide. For me as a single guy it's easy to remain apathetic and enjoy the ride. If I married a Japanese woman and decided to raise kids here then I might get more of an activist spirit because I'd be worried about how they'd get treated and what their futures would be like.

[American Oyaji]

Your best post ever SJ

[kamome]

[quote="Samurai_Jerk"]OM, I agree with you to an extent. The better my language skills get the more accepted I am by the locals. And like AO, I've been allowed into places once they determined I could speak Japanese.

However, there definitely are places that won't rent to gaijin and cops do randomly stop people based only on how they look and ask for their ID. The ammount of racism you experience also depends on what kind of gaijin you are. A real estate agent once told me he could probably find me a place because I'm American, but a lot of places won't rent to Chinese people.

I think the reason some people get so worked up about it is they're not used to being the minority. A white guy from Springfield, USA who comes to Japan to teach English has probably never experienced discrimination before. When he does try to go to a bar with a no gaijin policy or can't get a taxi to stop for him at night it's a shock to the system. Then he hears all the rumors about racism directed towards a friend of a friend and comes across debito.org and starts getting a complex.

The thing he forgets about is the positive side of discrimination: Cute girls want to talk to him just because he looks different and they think gaijin packages are big]
This just about covers all the points. I couldn't add more.

[Samurai_Jerk]

Thanks guys.It must be the drugs and alcohol giving me inspiration.

[Greji]

Thanks guys.It must be the drugs and alcohol giving me inspiration.

I would add one thing, whereas I was well aware that American Oyaji was a commonly used Black name found primarily in Ohio, I didn't know that Samurai Jerk was all that common.

Having said that, great post on all the fronts.

[Samurai_Jerk]

I would add one thing, whereas I was well aware that American Oyaji was a commonly used Black name found primarily in Ohio, I didn't know that Samurai Jerk was all that common.

Having said that, great post on all the fronts.

This might come as a shock to you, but Samurai Jerk is not my real name. My real name is Jamal Malcolm Shabbaz Washington.

[Greji]

Jamal Malcolm Shabbaz Washington.

Sounds Irish to me!

[Samurai_Jerk]

Sounds Irish to me!

Are you calling me Irish? You just crossed the line there buddy.


Don't get me wrong, I'm not racist. I just hate the Irish. I think it's because I had a bad experience with Lucky Charms when I was a kid.

[Greji]

Are you calling me Irish? You just crossed the line there buddy.


Don't get me wrong, I'm not racist. I just hate the Irish. I think it's because I had a bad experience with Lucky Charms when I was a kid.

Ahh, you probably went about wrong. It's Lucky Charms and Guiness for the trip!

[Samurai_Jerk]

Ahh, you probably went about wrong. It's Lucky Charms and Guiness for the trip!

I guess my first mistake was thinking that it was OK to eat Lucky Charms.

[American Oyaji]

Are you really serious about your name? Is that really your name and you're NOT black? Maybe a little bit?

What was the reasoning behind naming you that?

[AssKissinger]

Are you really serious about your name? Is that really your name and you're NOT black? Maybe a little bit?

What was the reasoning behind naming you that?

Haven't read much Alex Haley, have you? Or, are you joking?

[james]

i'm going to agree with those that say this guy was probably trying to get by in english and attributed it to racism when people didn't want to deal with him. dealing with people who don't speak the language can be a right pita. if you're fresh off the boat, for fuck's sake, find someone who does to help you.

i've encountered very little racism out here in inaka. there was one issue with respect to a credit card application but that was sorted out. i was initially denied simply on the basis that "a bunch of brazillians left without paying their bills so we don't issue cards to foreigners any more". apparently my wife was convincing enough to them on the phone to make them reconsider.

have certainly never been refused service anywhere. beyond that, i'd say the worst i deal with is idiots asking me if i can use chopsticks or read hiragana after being here for the better part of the last 11 years.

[ttjereth]

Just chipping in my two cents to say that I think Samurai Jerk's post more or less covers my feelings on things, and to point out that, although I don't feel persecuted or believe that the foreigners here in Japan have it nearly as bad as certain groups back home, I have been turned down for apartments because I am a foreigner (even with a Japanese wife and fairly fluent in Japanese) in both the inaka (Tochigi), Tokyo and Chiba.

Another thing that irritates me a bit at times is my wife took my last name when we married (her choice, not mine) but since we have been married every job she gets will only hire her on the condition that she uses her maiden name at work (so as not to scare the customers they say).

Also, as for the police thing, not to try and sound like a know it all or anything, but everytime I have moved somewhere knew the police come and visit us within the first couple of days and give us those stickers for the door and crap and I always make extra sure to be nice to them and the folks at the local koban. I've found they tend not to give me any trouble about anything when I am on a first name basis with a few of them.

[American Oyaji]

Haven't read much Alex Haley, have you? Or, are you joking?

I haven't read anything by Alex Haley in about 20 years.

[Adhesive]

I often wonder how fast the cute, naive racism that most white gaijin pass off as understandable, would turn into the ugly, ignorant racism worth fighting against if they weren't in Japan simply to bang girls and live a life of pseudo-rock star irresponsibility.

I know a lot of people on this board have real jobs and families in Japan, and I don't mean to accuse every white person in Japan of thrill seeking, but the fact of the matter is most white people aren't forced, or even pressured, to live in Japan. We all have beautiful, modern, safe countries to return to if things get out of hand. When you freely decide to do something you often justify that decision by discounting the negative consequences.

I think if I were dark-skinned and living in Japan out of necessity, I wouldn't hesitate to jump on the Debito band-wagon. Not for myself, but for my children and grandchildren. I don't think battling stereotypes and ignorance is ever a bad thing, regardless of how benign those stereotypes may seem to be.

[Greji]

in Japan simply to bang girls and live a life of pseudo-rock star irresponsibility

Ahh, banging girls and rock staring are irresponsible? You just dissed my whole life style. Damn! It's back to goats!

[ttjereth]

I often wonder how fast the cute, naive racism that most white gaijin pass off as understandable, would turn into the ugly, ignorant racism worth fighting against if they weren't in Japan simply to bang girls and live a life of pseudo-rock star irresponsibility.

I know a lot of people on this board have real jobs and families in Japan, and I don't mean to accuse every white person in Japan of thrill seeking, but the fact of the matter is most white people aren't forced, or even pressured, to live in Japan. We all have beautiful, modern, safe countries to return to if things get out of hand. When you freely decide to do something you often justify that decision by discounting the negative consequences.

I think if I were dark-skinned and living in Japan out of necessity, I wouldn't hesitate to jump on the Debito band-wagon. Not for myself, but for my children and grandchildren. I don't think battling stereotypes and ignorance is ever a bad thing, regardless of how benign those stereotypes may seem to be.

I think that how fast the, let's say, "level" of racism increases depends on how much we inconvienience the locals, whether perceived (they're stealing our jobs/wimmin/etc) or real (fuckhead foreigners who seem to think it is somehow more permissable to break the law or be a complete asshole here than it is whereever they are from).

I also don't think the dismissal of the "garden variety, typical Japanese racism" is limited to "white gaijin", nor are there many people who are "forced" to live in Japan (discounting anyone brought here against their will obviously). Whereas there are people who might not have the option of going home, at the risk of sounding like an "if you don't like it, get out" stereotype, for whatever reason those same people still chose to come to Japan rather than going to some other country, so there is generally an element of choice involved regardless of the original motivation for leaving one's home country.

As for battling battling stereotypes and ignorance, I believe, and I also think this is where a lot of people have problems with Debito, that there is a difference between "perceived stereotypes and ignorance" and "actual battling stereotypes and ignorance". Some people are just a lot more sensitive than others, and some people (my wife for example ) are just always going to see offence in places where none is intended, and I've found that it's often these same people who tend to respond in ways that are all out of proportion to the offense offered (perceived or real).

I think intent has to be factored in, and some battles just aren't worth fighting, and in a lot of cases run the risk of making things worse rather than resulting in any significant imrpovement in circumstances.

On top of all that, going back to the "no apartments for gaijin" thing up top, for me personally, whereas it sucks to be turned down on that basis, I'd really rather know up front that the landlord is a racist asshole and not rent from them, than have some law force him to rent to me and me end up having to live with the racist asshole.

[omae mona]

As for battling battling stereotypes and ignorance, I believe, and I also think this is where a lot of people have problems with Debito, that there is a difference between "perceived stereotypes and ignorance" and "actual battling stereotypes and ignorance". Some people are just a lot more sensitive than others, and some people (my wife for example ) are just always going to see offence in places where none is intended, and I've found that it's often these same people who tend to respond in ways that are all out of proportion to the offense offered (perceived or real).

I think you are spot on. In my earlier post when I mentioned Debito, I was critizicing the article's author, not Debito. I think Debito works to address real issues, though his rhetoric often blows things out of proportion. Debito's site mentions two offending onsens (one a single incident in 1993, and the other a repeat offender, obviously run by assholes, which Debito eventually visited in order to make a point and start a lawsuit). The article, though, takes it to the next level and makes it sound like discrimination is a general problem at all onsens. That's baloney.

On top of all that, going back to the "no apartments for gaijin" thing up top, for me personally, whereas it sucks to be turned down on that basis, I'd really rather know up front that the landlord is a racist asshole and not rent from them, than have some law force him to rent to me and me end up having to live with the racist asshole.

I am sympathetic to these landlords if the policy is based on something practical, like language skills, and if they adjust policy accordingly when appropriate. Every apartment I've lived in in Japan has had *tons* of important communication in written Japanese. Starting with the terms in the rental contract, and continuing with frequent notices dropped in residents' mailboxes ("sprinkler inspections next week!") or signs on walls ("whoever is trying to cram their sodai gomi in the regular trash bins, please cut it out!", it's very important for landlords to know there is not going to be a communication problem with tenants. I suspect that we foreigners can - unintentionally - be a real pain in the ass for landlords and other residents if we don't understand what is going on. I would guess that far less than half of the foreigners in Japan (zainichi Koreans excluded) have language skills up to the task, and I'm actually surprised that so many landlords are flexible and do allow foreigners who can't speak or read the language. A tenant who can't communicate could unintentionally be a real nuisance to the landlord and the other tenants.

If a landlord's exclusionary policy was not based on something very immediate and practical (e.g. they still won't rent to a foreigner who speaks and reads Japanese perfectly well, due to having the wrong skin color), then they lose my sympathy. That's probably real racism and there's no excuse.

[ttjereth]

I think you are spot on. In my earlier post when I mentioned Debito, I was critizicing the article's author, not Debito. I think Debito works to address real issues, though his rhetoric often blows things out of proportion. Debito's site mentions two offending onsens (one a single incident in 1993, and the other a repeat offender, obviously run by assholes, which Debito eventually visited in order to make a point and start a lawsuit). The article, though, takes it to the next level and makes it sound like discrimination is a general problem at all onsens. That's baloney.

I agree, and I also think a lot of the Debito stuff is blown out of proportion by him but I would criticize him on the in that I think the reason a lot of Debito's stuff is often blown out of proportion is because he himself often will refer to things as "Japanese onsens" rather than "this particular onsen", although he does only point out the names of the two specific onsens. Generalizing is human nature, but when you are accusing people of something that is as sensitive as racism, I think you need to be extra careful about how you phrase things.

Also, a bit off topic, but since we are talking about Debito anyway, I would guess (based on my own feelings) that another thing that bugs a lot of people about him is that he has this whole "I will defend your rights, whether you want me to or not!" mentality where he speaks for all foreigners in Japan (again the generalization is the problem I support) whereas there are a lot of people who would rather not have him speaking on their behalf. He often points this out as something along the lines of "even many foreigners in Japan believe that they are nothing more than guests in this country and should behave as such" (paraphrased from memory) and then going on to say (as if it were pure fact, rather than just his personal opinion) that that way of thinking is wrong.

He may do a lot of good stuff (although, in all honesty I can't say as much of what he has done has had a positive effect on my life here), but I can understand why people get irritated by him or just don't like him.

To get slightly back on topic, the article mentioned here though, seems to be one of a new(?) breed of foreigner who comes to Japan practically looking to be discriminated against. This seemed to be extraordinarily common amongst ALTs when I was a JET. I was a CIR and didn't work together with ALTs except at the city hall, but they always all seemed to think they were getting a raw deal because they were foreigners. There were some real problems, but a lot of their arguments just didn't make sense. Most of the people who fall into this category seem to want special treatment because they are a foreigner only when it is advantageous to them but scream and holler about discrimination as soon as there is something they don't like.

I am sympathetic to these landlords if the policy is based on something practical, like language skills, and if they adjust policy accordingly when appropriate. Every apartment I've lived in in Japan has had *tons* of important communication in written Japanese. Starting with the terms in the rental contract, and continuing with frequent notices dropped in residents' mailboxes ("sprinkler inspections next week!") or signs on walls ("whoever is trying to cram their sodai gomi in the regular trash bins, please cut it out!", it's very important for landlords to know there is not going to be a communication problem with tenants. I suspect that we foreigners can - unintentionally - be a real pain in the ass for landlords and other residents if we don't understand what is going on. I would guess that far less than half of the foreigners in Japan (zainichi Koreans excluded) have language skills up to the task, and I'm actually surprised that so many landlords are flexible and do allow foreigners who can't speak or read the language. A tenant who can't communicate could unintentionally be a real nuisance to the landlord and the other tenants.

If a landlord's exclusionary policy was not based on something very immediate and practical (e.g. they still won't rent to a foreigner who speaks and reads Japanese perfectly well, due to having the wrong skin color), then they lose my sympathy. That's probably real racism and there's no excuse.

Again, I agree for the most part.

I also agree that the majority of foreigners in Japan don't speak Japanese to a functional level, even a lot of the long term ones (I personally know two people who have been here longer than me, 10 and 15 years, and still can only barely get by ordering in a restaurant and have trouble if there is too much kanji on the menu). I personally think, that if you make a decent effort, you should be able to at least get by after say 3 years or so.

Unfortunately, whereas most of these landlords' policies may actually be based on communication problems, a lot of them still apply the rule as "no foreigners, period". I don't want to sound conceited, but my Japanese is fairly good, I've lived here 8 years, I work as a translator, and I have a Japanese wife (who obviously speaks Japanese well enough), but I was still turned down (as soon as I walked into the realtor's in some cases, others just when asking about specific properties) for aprtments/mansions because I am a foreigner.

In some cases this is because a realtor or some other agent is just unilaterally applying the landlord's rule, in other cases it is because the landlord/agent thinks that it would be a bother to other tenants simply to have a foreigner around, since it does tend to make some Japanese nervous for one reason or another, and then there are the ones who are just assholes.

I think if they changed it to a language requirement, I think it would be more defensible, but I've not yet personally encountered anywhere where it was explicity stated as simply a language requirement (still talking about apartments, not bars and such mentioned above), and even if it was I think there would still be people screaming about discrimination (How would Debito react I wonder? ).

[Pachipro]

[maraboutslim]

[Mulboyne]

Pachipro, thanks for taking the time to give us your thoughts. One thing struck me in what you wrote:

In Brussels, for example, there are signs on some establishments refusing entry to Japanese only, because many of them are unruly.

Where on earth are these signs?

[Behan]

Pachipro, thanks for taking the time to give us your thoughts. One thing struck me in what you wrote:

Where on earth are these signs?

Yes, details, details. I wanna hear details.

Seriously, did some of the Chrysanthemum FGs in Brussels get out of hand?

[Samurai_Jerk]

Are you really serious about your name? Is that really your name and you're NOT black? Maybe a little bit?

What was the reasoning behind naming you that?

If you believe that's my real name then I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you.