Advice needed

[Ghost]

Hi guys, Im now in a situation where Im going to have to make a huge decision about where I want to be in the future and I thought I would ask you guys for your opinions and advice, no FG comedy posts please as I would really appreciate the advice. At the moment I am in the UK and I want to leave by the end of the year, I have 2 different places where I can go but Im not too sure which one would be the best for my future. Places are, obviously, Japan and New Zealand. I have lived in both countries for a year each through working holiday visas. I have been offered a managerial position at McDonalds in New Zealand which means I would be on about 1,226 yen and hour plus of course lower cost of living, the job isnt great but after 3 or 4 years at the job I can end up getting a uni degree plus there are no school fees as it is part of the job, beyond this though I am not sure, after a couple of years at McDonalds I can pick up any managers job in the retail industry in NZ or I could use my degree which I will get to get a work permit for Japan and teach English.

However I am also really toying with the idea of going back to Japan, I have wanted to move back there for the last 2 years and when I came back to visit in February I will didnt want to leave. However because I have had a WHV and I do not have a uni degree the only option I have is becoming a student which means I have to pay over 1 million yen for tuition fees (for a 2 year language course) plus try and find a job in Japan and survive those 2 years working full time plus doing a 20+ hour weekly course. When I lived in Japan before I was only 19 and found it very very difficult at first, I started working in clubs in Roppongi and ended up teaching english for 8 months for GABA (2 months) and Bing Bang Boom Club (which went bankrupt 4 years ago). The plan is for me to save up about 1,442,000 yen in the UK and move to Japan by the end of the year, in the mean time I would try to learn as much Japanese as possible before going and also try to get a TEFL qualification in the UK to help me find work. But what would you guys think would be the better option? and which country do would you feel I have the best opportunities? I am thinking about doing translating if I got a qualification in Japanese or even teaching English if I had to but not sure what the payment for those careers are like (I know that the wages in Gaba are an insult with me getting paid the same amount that Im getting now working at McDonalds).

Now the last part of this is down to my girlfriend who is japanese and is currently doing her nursing course in Japan which finishes in 3 years time, although she has said that she can wait for me to move to Japan I honestly dont think our relationship could last with a 3 year wait if I decided to go down the NZ route.

[Ghost]

Also kind of separate but what would be the best and cheapest language school to go to in the Tokyo/Yokohama area? The one that I had my eye on is the one in Kichijoji which works out at about 1,200,000 yen for the 2 years.

[ichigo partygirl]

i guess the first thing is to work out how important your girlfriend is to you - because if you love her chances are your heart will rule your head whatever advice you are given
You are probably better actually getting a degree and work experience in NZ and studying Japanese on the side as a hobby and going to Japan for trips. Although why you would choose to live in NZ over the UK is a puzzle to me. No uni degree and living in Japan generally doesn't work out all too well career wise.
Best of luck - if you come back to NZ send me a PM, i live there about 2/3 of the year.

[aquamarine]

Yea, I must agree. Get your degree.

My biggest mistake in life wasn't losing my passport with my working-holiday visa in it while in Japan. It was not going to university RIGHT out of high-school and thinking "pff, what do I need a degree for?" Oh yea... right... to stay in Japan... forgot.

Fuck me.

Get that degree, then head back to Japanaland

[Ghost]

Well I do love her of course but I wouldnt be going out to Japan just for her, simple fact is I am split 50/50 over the 2 countries, obviously Japan is going to be the most difficult because of having to learn a new language and culture ect but i need to decide if it will be the most rewarding in terms of career as well.

I have a friend who has been living in Japan the last 5 years on a spouse visa who has no degree but has had no difficulty finding work, although he has had to find 2 jobs on occassion. But would a uni degree be really important to find work as a translater?

[Ghost]

Although why you would choose to live in NZ over the UK is a puzzle to me.
Best of luck - if you come back to NZ send me a PM, i live there about 2/3 of the year.

Well I just do not like the UK at all, constant yobbish behavior by drunken kids, ridiculously high taxes and cost of living which at the moment is going up up up, crap weather and just too much stress. NZ is a beautiful country, I love the people and as it is constantly growing in size (the population, not the actual island :P ) there is more opportunity there imo.

[gomichild]

I have a friend who has been living in Japan the last 5 years on a spouse visa who has no degree but has had no difficulty finding work, although he has had to find 2 jobs on occassion. But would a uni degree be really important to find work as a translater?

It's not the work - it's that having a degree is a requirement for a working visa.

[Ghost]

It's not the work - it's that having a degree is a requirement for a working visa.

Ah if its that case then it shouldnt be a problem as my gf and me will probably be married by the time my student visa ran out, if we are still together by then that is.

[kusai Jijii]

no FG comedy posts please ... .

Stay off the drugs bro!:p

[ttjereth]

But would a uni degree be really important to find work as a translater?

Yes it could be, but more important would be being able to spell "translator" correctly. ]http://www.fuckedgaijin.com/forums/images/vbimghost/18574836a994362ec.gif[/img]

[ttjereth]

Ah if its that case then it shouldnt be a problem as my gf and me will probably be married by the time my student visa ran out, if we are still together by then that is.

See my post above, but a university degree is still fairly important for (decent) translation work. Being a translator you should ideally have good Japanese and tranlating skills in addition to professional level knowledge in another field (construction, engineering, finance, medical/biotech, etc.) which would be your field of expertise/specialization.

All of the fields that can be hobby related (electronics, games, anime, entertainment, tourism) are ridiculously over populated and (No shit) generally offer rates at about 1/2 of other fields (at best, I've seen anywhere as low as 1/20th).

Also, despite popular belief, getting married does not equal free spouse visa. They can and do turn people down, and you will have a hard time because 1. they will suspect you of getting married just to get the visa to be able to work since you have no degree and 2. they will be skeptical of your ability to support yourself and gf because of no degree.

[Ol Dirty Gaijin]

Fuck me.

How much does that pay?

[Iraira]

Also, ask yourself these very very important questions.
1) If you want to be a translator, that means you will be generally sitting in front of a computer for at least 8 hours a day...can you feel those arteries hardening?
2) You will "be corrected" on your work by people who cannot speak English at all, even though you are correct. Can you suck it up, apologize for your mistake, and take them out for a dozen beers to preserve the revenue source?
3) Do you have a field that you can sell yourself as being an expert in? If so, then really get familiar with the terms, concepts, etc., in Japanese for that field.
4) Do you have someone sitting next to you now, or will in the future, who will provide you with the constructive criticism and translation advice for the next 3-5 years to get good at becoming an ace translator in the field you are working on becoming proficient in?
(note: if your answer is "my Japanese gf helps me, when I translate"... jaa...you get the point.)

I'm not raining on your omatsuri, you just need to know what's looming in your not so distant future should you decide to embark on the landmine-filled Translator's Road.

[Charles]

..I have been offered a managerial position at McDonalds in New Zealand which means I would be on about 1,226 yen and hour plus of course lower cost of living, the job isnt great but after 3 or 4 years..

IMHO, if you consider spending the next 4 years working at McDonalds an attractive option, you need to take a long hard look at your life.

Go back to school. It will give you more options.

[kamome]

Just about everyone is saying to get your degree first, and I completely agree. You could try to beat the system and skip steps to go where you want to go, but it doesn't work. Get the degree then figure out what you need to do to get to Japan.

[ttjereth]

IMHO, if you consider spending the next 4 years working at McDonalds an attractive option, you need to take a long hard look at your life.

Go back to school. It will give you more options.

I'm pretty sure he specified the McDonald's job would pay for school. If he can get a degree paid for out of it, 4 years at McDonald's is no worse than 3 years on JET or wasting time as an English teacher etc.

[ttjereth]

1) If you want to be a translator, that means you will be generally sitting in front of a computer for at least 8 hours a day...can you feel those arteries hardening?

Let's be honest with the boy, 8 hours are the good days. I have plenty of deadlines when I don't sleep at all in a 48 hour period in order to get the work done in time.

2) You will "be corrected" on your work by people who cannot speak English at all, even though you are correct. Can you suck it up, apologize for your mistake, and take them out for a dozen beers to preserve the revenue source?

That's where you handle comes from isn't it? ]
4) Do you have someone sitting next to you now, or will in the future, who will provide you with the constructive criticism and translation advice for the next 3-5 years to get good at becoming an ace translator in the field you are working on becoming proficient in?
(note: if your answer is "my Japanese gf helps me, when I translate"... jaa...you get the point.)
[/quote]

Yep. This is why a lot of people get an in-house job first, then go freelance (myself included), but have fun getting an in-house job with no degree.

[Ghost]

IMHO, if you consider spending the next 4 years working at McDonalds an attractive option, you need to take a long hard look at your life.

Go back to school. It will give you more options.

Erm whats wrong with working at McDonalds? Its a multi billion dollar corporation which means its stable work as the company are highly unlikely to go out of business anytime soon, its an easy job and one that I am good at, the hours are flexible which means I can pick to work when and whatever hours I want and not only that but if I move to NZ and work for McDonalds there I can get a degree out of it and not have to pay a penny, in actual fact I WILL GET PAID to get the degree

[Ghost]

Also, ask yourself these very very important questions.
1) If you want to be a translator, that means you will be generally sitting in front of a computer for at least 8 hours a day...can you feel those arteries hardening?
2) You will "be corrected" on your work by people who cannot speak English at all, even though you are correct. Can you suck it up, apologize for your mistake, and take them out for a dozen beers to preserve the revenue source?
3) Do you have a field that you can sell yourself as being an expert in? If so, then really get familiar with the terms, concepts, etc., in Japanese for that field.
4) Do you have someone sitting next to you now, or will in the future, who will provide you with the constructive criticism and translation advice for the next 3-5 years to get good at becoming an ace translator in the field you are working on becoming proficient in?
(note: if your answer is "my Japanese gf helps me, when I translate"... jaa...you get the point.)

I'm not raining on your omatsuri, you just need to know what's looming in your not so distant future should you decide to embark on the landmine-filled Translator's Road.

Thanks for the advice, I cant say I particularly want to be a translator, I was merely using it as an example of the type of work that I would be able to get if I could speak and read fluent japanese on top of the usual jobs of working in bars or teaching English.

[Charles]

[quote="Ghost"]Erm whats wrong with working at McDonalds? Its a multi billion dollar corporation which means its stable work as the company are highly unlikely to go out of business anytime soon, its an easy job and one that I am good at, the hours are flexible which means I can pick to work when and whatever hours I want and not only that but if I move to NZ and work for McDonalds there I can get a degree out of it and not have to pay a penny, in actual fact I WILL GET PAID to get the degree ]
When I first went to university, I was a Chem major and they got me a job in their medical labs. If you're not getting experience in your field, your diploma is not going to be worth much.
But I could be wrong. Perhaps you're attending Hamburger University.

[Samurai_Jerk]

At least if you manage a McDonalds you'll actually have some marketable experience if you go back to the UK. The same can't be said if you teach English.

By the way, how do you expect to get good enough at Japanese to be a translator without serious academic study of the language? Going to a Japanese language school doesn't count.

[Ghost]

At least if you manage a McDonalds you'll actually have some marketable experience if you go back to the UK. The same can't be said if you teach English.

By the way, how do you expect to get good enough at Japanese to be a translator without serious academic study of the language? Going to a Japanese language school doesn't count.

Well looking at the school's website it says that you do get qualifications and tests so I assumed that there would be something that I could use towards a job by the end of it. As I said before the instructor job was just an example, I would probably go back to teaching as I already have experience doing it.

As for the degree in McDonalds, it will be in catering and hospitality and is from the NZ government and not from a hamburger university. From what I have heard from friends of mine in Japan it doesnt really matter what subject you have a degree for, it is just a minimum requirement mainly for getting a work permit, although obviously this isnt the case in specialised fields it does apply for most teaching jobs which are not in high schools or universities.

[Western All Stars]

I agree with everyone here about the importance of getting the degree. Plus it'll give you time to decide what you really want to do. The connections you make at school alone will be well worth it. Skip the McCollege and don't be afraid to take out student loans.

[nottu]

[Charles]

Now Charles, your sounding very practical about college ed unlike some of your previous ivory tower stuff - is the world getting to you?

Yes it is. I just spent the last month doing a temp job, grading high school english essays for a No Child Left Behind test. I despair for the state of education today.

[Samurai_Jerk]

Well looking at the school's website it says that you do get qualifications and tests so I assumed that there would be something that I could use towards a job by the end of it. As I said before the instructor job was just an example, I would probably go back to teaching as I already have experience doing it.

As for the degree in McDonalds, it will be in catering and hospitality and is from the NZ government and not from a hamburger university. From what I have heard from friends of mine in Japan it doesnt really matter what subject you have a degree for, it is just a minimum requirement mainly for getting a work permit, although obviously this isnt the case in specialised fields it does apply for most teaching jobs which are not in high schools or universities.

I guarantee those qualifications and tests don't mean shit to anyone.

Is NZ degree a bachelor's degree or some kind of technical degree? I ask because your need a bachelor's degree for the visa.

By the way, going to NZ to manage a McDonald's and get a degree in something you don't seem to have much interest in just to get a Japanese visa in the future has to be one of the dumbest ideas I've ever hear.

[ttjereth]

I guarantee those qualifications and tests don't mean shit to anyone.

Is NZ degree a bachelor's degree or some kind of technical degree? I ask because your need a bachelor's degree for the visa.

By the way, going to NZ to manage a McDonald's and get a degree in something you don't seem to have much interest in just to get a Japanese visa in the future has to be one of the dumbest ideas I've ever hear.

It still beats moving to Japan to be an English teacher and hoping to somehow magically become good enough at the language in anything less than 5 or 6 years of study to be able to translate professionally all to be with a girl with whom you don't think a relationship would last if you aren't right there next to her the entire time

[Iraira]

It still beats moving to Japan to be an English teacher and hoping to somehow magically become good enough at the language in anything less than 5 or 6 years of study to be able to translate professionally all to be with a girl with whom you don't think a relationship would last if you aren't right there next to her the entire time

sounds like a 1970s sit-com....what's the girl's jiggle factor? On second thought, it sounds like one of those ABC After School Specials....all of them starring Meridith Baxter Birney or Robbie Bension on drugs.

[Marked Trail]

...no FG comedy posts please ...blah, blah...McDonalds in New Zealand...blah, blah....ended up teaching english for 8 months for GABA (2 months) and Bing Bang Boom Club ...

[Catoneinutica]

sounds like a 1970s sit-com....what's the girl's jiggle factor? On second thought, it sounds like one of those ABC After School Specials....all of them starring Meridith Baxter Birney or Robbie Bension on drugs.

Heh. And don't forget Tatum O'Neil. Oh wait, that was a real-life drug-drama.

Jiggle Factor - think that was a Fred Silverman thing at ABC.