J-men are "black panthers"?

[Taro Toporific]

Japan Minister Under Fire Over Alleged Rape Remark
Thu July 3, 2003 06:33 AM ET

TOKYO (Reuters) - A top Japanese cabinet member who is also in charge of gender equality issues came under fire on Thursday for allegedly saying that many women who are raped seemed to be "asking for it" by the way they dress.

Yasuo Fukuda, the top government spokesman, was quoted by a magazine as saying many women invited rape by dressing in a provocative manner, because men are "black panthers."

He was commenting on remarks by ruling party lawmaker Seiichi Ota, who was forced to apologize last week for saying perpetrators of gang rape were "vigorous" and "close to normal."

"Ota apologized... Maybe Ota doesn't know that gang rape is a crime. But among women there are those who seem to be really asking for it. If you walk around, there are many of them. Many who have a provocative appearance," Fukuda was quoted as saying.
"Those who have that kind of appearance are at fault. Because men are black panthers," he was quoted as saying....

Earlier this week, former Prime Minister Yoshiro Mori faced demands for an apology for implying that only women who bear children should be eligible for pensions.

"These kinds of politicians are idiots. There's nothing to be done with them, so they should resign," said Takiko Nakano, a magazine editor in her 30s.

[American Oyaji]

You know what it seems to me?

These guys were the geeks and social outcasts in school. And if they hadnt had their positions, they would never have gotten married let alone laid.

They aren't really looking at reality.

HOWEVER! I do indeed believe that wearing a micro mini and a bikini top in the wrong part of town is asking for trouble.

I look at it this way. Don't advertise the goods if you aren't willing to sell.

There are ways to look nice without all the flesh hanging out. This goes for men AND women.

[blackcat]

J men are black panthers

More like primate gorrillas with no self control over what they do..or say

anyway, I`m a black panther
bye for now.
Blackcat

So its the girls fault for dressing nicely??? or even slutty????
well I can see the old blame the victim theme alive and well in Japan.

can see that in many areas of japanese lifestyle.

[cstaylor]

You know what it seems to me?

These guys were the geeks and social outcasts in school. And if they hadnt had their positions, they would never have gotten married let alone laid.

They aren't really looking at reality.

I'll let Blackcat unleash the vitriol, but from my beginner's view of Japanese politics I would say that this is certainly NOT the case. Mori graduated Waseda as well (coincidence?), and most of the Ministry members are Tokyo University grads. These guys got where they are because they are connected via family and school ties.

The real question will be answered in November when Kozuimi dissolves the Diet for an election. If we see the same clowns back again, then at least the voting constituents of their respective districts don't find the comments offensive.

[Crispy]

Wow, not only is gang rape acceptable, but women ask for it and men are unable to control their actions? Wow, these guys make American polititians seem like geniuses at not blurting out crazy shit.

[GargoyleTS]

Double posted: deleted text

[GargoyleTS]

"These kinds of politicians are idiots. There's nothing to be done with them, so they should resign," said Takiko Nakano, a magazine editor in her 30s.

There you go! Straight from the mouth of someone personally responsible for how women dress!

The politicians (and IMO other people too) who say tha women are "asking for it" by dressing this way seem to be missing out on the fact that society tells them to dress like this in order to be considered beautiful, thus enabling them to get a man and everything that goes with survival instincts. No time to type more (though I'd love to) gotta get to school!

[Crispy]

By "dress like that" do they mean seifuku? Unfortunately, when I think gang rape, I immediately think of school uniforms.

[Iambobo]

Perhaps the solution to the problem is to make all the men wear 'slutty' dresses, and women to wear the least sexy things possible? Then no-body would ever go outside. Hey we could stop crime in it's tracks at the same time. Good thinking me! (btw, I'm not gay with the whole 'I think men should wear dresses' comment....not that there is anything wrong with being homosexual)

[Taro Toporific]

Perhaps the solution to the problem is to make all the men wear 'slutty' dresses

Check out the MEN'S Spring/summer 2004 collection, in Milan, June 22, 2003

[katakori]

Don't advertise the goods if you aren't willing to sell.

i love this phrasing!!

when I think gang rape, I immediately think of school uniforms.

isn't it that j-men are not black panthers but merely kitten just too used to see all kind of pornography everywhere all the time, and eventually they just can't make the distinction between a genuine 12 year old schoolgirl, and a 20 yo AV queen in school uniform??

[GomiGirl]

Well women get raped wearing burlap sacks - it is not about sex rather about power and control.. ie a demented, loser guy who feels powerless in this crazy world and so feels powerful by taking it from a women who is smaller and easier to overpower.. the sex is just a by-product.

The underlying perception is that during sex a women is debased as she has allowed herself to be "penetrated" by giving herself.. IMO this is horsecrap and is the cause of most of the misunderstandings between men and women!!

As for clothes.. women get raped wearing Bhurkas..

[GargoyleTS]

Exactly GG, I couldn't finish what I said earlier, so here goes. Like GG said, rape is about power or insanity. This party kid guy would show his friends a good time by letting them do whatever they wanted to these girls and letting them get away with it, thus proving he was powerful. The sex for him was probably incidental after the first couple of times. Insane rapists tend to choose a specific type of woman and rape (and sometimes kill) that type only. His only requirement seemed to be based on who he could get alone with himself and 5 guys. I am personally glad he got caught and hope he suffers for it. Sex shouldn't be about power or fear or anger, shouldn't be negative at all! Sex is for some a way to show your love. For me its the best way for 2 people to play together. Love comes before or after, but the point of sex to me is too have fun (and yeah, I do not want kids, so to ME its not about procreation)

[cstaylor]

The best (and probably least likely) outcome will be jailing en-masse of all the suspects (not just Wada), and those that are convicted get a minimum 10 year sentence at Nagoya.

[Naniwan Kid]

Oyaji wrote:

HOWEVER! I do indeed believe that wearing a micro mini and a bikini top in the wrong part of town is asking for trouble.

I look at it this way. Don't advertise the goods if you aren't willing to sell.

I hope I am not a victim of misreading sarcasm, again, (I don't see any smileys.) But I must say "Shame, Shame, Oyaji" That's like blaming a grandmother for leaving not buying a big dog to keep out the attacker who broke into her house and robberd her and took her money.

Rape is NEVER excusable, and is the second worst crime after murder, if you ask me, as the effect it has on it's victims and their families rarely ever fully goes away.

[American Oyaji]

Oyaji wrote:

HOWEVER! I do indeed believe that wearing a micro mini and a bikini top in the wrong part of town is asking for trouble.

I look at it this way. Don't advertise the goods if you aren't willing to sell.

I hope I am not a victim of misreading sarcasm, again, (I don't see any smileys.) But I must say "Shame, Shame, Oyaji" That's like blaming a grandmother for leaving not buying a big dog to keep out the attacker who broke into her house and robberd her and took her money.

Yeah, I said it.
What is your point? It is STILL the truth. Rape is indeed a selfish crime. Sometimes it is NOT about power. But the desire to HAVE a particular woman. Some rapes are not planned but are "crimes of passion". I don't say rape is right. I never said that. But what I said is still true.
Women wear provacative and "sexy" clothing in order to attract the attention of men. Some may say "not so" and say it is because it makes them feel good. OK. Clothing that is hard to walk in, hard to breath and move in makes you feel good? Keep lying to yourself.
Clothing can look REALLY nice without drawing the wrong kind of attention.

But if a woman is gonna wear clothing that shows off every curve of her body and then walks down a dark alley in a bad part of town, I won't feel sorry for her. And I will tell her to her face she deserved what she got, because she should have known better that the world we live in is a dangerous place. That doesn't maker her less the victim, but in some cases, people put themselves in the position to allow someone to victimize them. Thats the point. And you can say shame all you want to. It still doesn't change the TRUTH of the matter.

Don't advertise if you aint willing to part with the goods.

As for GGs comment of women being raped in bhurkas. Of course it happens. I never said it didnt. And I think men who rape should be castrated.

However, modern female clothing in the west is akin to male sexual torture in my opinion. We live in a sexually charged society. If I want to see Tits and Ass, I'll go to a strip club or rent some porn. OR some trashy B movies. It's the same as the flamboyant homosexuals (yes, homosexuality is wrong, but we wont beat that dead, desicated, rotting horse) who on their Pride Days put on such racy and raunchy displays that kids shouldn't even be allowed to those parades.

I think morals around the world have slipped and people think it's OK and normal. I didn't always have high moral standards. I look at my past actions and cringe at how crazy I was

Anyway. Cover it up. I don't need or want to see it. It's about the personality anyway, not what your body looks like. That goes for BOTH sexes.

[GomiGirl]

Rape is indeed a selfish crime. Sometimes it is NOT about power. But the desire to HAVE a particular woman. Some rapes are not planned but are "crimes of passion". I don't say rape is right.

OA I have to say that on this point you are just plain wrong. Rape is about power and the desire you are talking about is just that desire for power projected onto a man's perceived weapon of power - "the dumb stick". Even the language you use - "To HAVE a woman" is the language of power.. how can you "HAVE" another person as if they were a chatel. I am happy that you recognise that it is a crime but..

But if a woman is gonna wear clothing that shows off every curve of her body and then walks down a dark alley in a bad part of town, I won't feel sorry for her.

Rape rarely happens in dark alleys with dark and evil predators - except in movies. Rape is often a planned action where predators seek out their victims.

However, modern female clothing in the west is akin to male sexual torture in my opinion.

Again this is a pathethic excuse. This is the type of reasoning that the Taliban used put women in Bhurkas.. men can't control themselves so we need to take away the distraction.. bullshit.. people need to be responsible for themselves and stop looking at women as simply sexual objects or as second class citizens to do with as you will.

People need to take responsibiltiy for their actions and stop thinking that the world revolves around them or that some people exist for the sole purpose of the amusement of others.

/rant

[GomiGirl]

Women wear provacative and "sexy" clothing in order to attract the attention of men. Some may say "not so" and say it is because it makes them feel good. OK. Clothing that is hard to walk in, hard to breath and move in makes you feel good? Keep lying to yourself.

I can't speak for other women, but when I get dressed, either for work or play, I don't think to myself "How would men think about this"!! It is "How do I feel about this". Yes sometime I like to wear sexy clothes, but then I like to feel sexy. I am not waiting for someone to pick me out of the blue like they would picking out a pair of socks.. it gives me the confidence to be myself and choose what I want to do..

women are not passively waiting for others to control their lives, they can actually do things on their own and if they choose to take someone into their life - trust me they had some active participation whether they let you know of their intentions or not. Women over the centuries have become very good at letting men think that they call the shots or are waiting to be rescued.. this is why the rise of feminists came as such a shock to most men. But it has been there all the time but in just subtle ways - it was just hidden because the options were limited.

[GargoyleTS]

I know it sounds weird, but I agree with you both. AO: I do agree that some women dress provocatively for the express purpose of "being cockteases". They claim not to understand why the guys don't wanna take no for answer. Baby, if your gonna advertise, people are gonna expect a product. And alot of them know it. Women do abuse their sexual power, and some don't even realize it! But the ones who do, they are the ones to watch. They accept your drinks while leading you on, in fact hanging out with you and flirting solely to keep you buying drinks. I have known women who did this. They even bragged at work the next day how they went out with 5 bucks in their pocket (just enough to cover the door cost) and drank all night on "some chump" then ditched him and went home. She never planned on doing anything with him, she threw away his number, and she had a blast telling her friends about the things she did to this guy just to keep him buying. Its disgusting.

But so is the loser rebuffed who refuses to accept her disinterest. The guy who thinks that just because he buys her one drink (the first one she usually doesn't have any say in) he owns her for the night and she WILL go home with him. Even if she says no to the drink, he will not og away until she has embarrassed himby pretty much yelling at him to piss-off! These guys are the bulk of the "date rapists" class of predator. I hate them. They can't get a woman via normal means (usually due to lack of trying cause they think women are just magically attracted to people and they don't have to put forth any effort) so resort to drugs and other unscrupulous means of getting sex.

Rape is always about power. If nothing else it is about a man feeling power-less sexually and seeking to redress that lack of power. Its not about sex. Sex is the means, not the reason. The only rape case I can't attribute to power is a case here in the states (and probly has happened elsewhere) in which an 83 year old woman was raped by the men (both!) who broke into her house and robbed her. Robbery, okay thats from not having money and being too incompetent or lazy to get a job. But why in the world would you get a kick from raping an 83y.o. woman??? And even if one guy did, why would the other???

And finally, as far as the "male sexual torture" comment goes...is it torture if I like it? I do get a bit frustrated seeing women walking around in outfits designed to "show it off". I don't like being "on" all the time and have done my best to counter-train myself against it. Society tells me X is sexy. X should turn me on. X is beautiful and all you could ever want. Since I was born society has done this. TV, magazines, movies, peer groups etc...all of them telling me what I should find attractive in a female. Not who would be a good mother. Not who would bear strong or intelligent children. Not who would ensure the continued upward evolution of the species. Just what's worthy of putting my dick in, who create the strongest physical urge to mate. I hate that. Its part of why I will not have children. I won't put them through that. (and I am afraid of becoming my father too, but aren't most of us?) I wouldn't be surprised if humanity de-volves in the next 100 years (if we last that long) to reliance on chemical signatures again to determine who we mate with. Its also another reason I prefer to see sex as way to play together. Cause if your not fun to play with, then why would I want you around. I can find 100 other women who look just like you just by walking out my front door. Be something special please. Have a brain, a personality and a backbone. Looks are secondary. Hopefully with the deluge of beauty info people will begin to become disenfranchised with looks and maybe give personality or brains a chance. Or masturbate so much they drop out of the gene-pool!

You people make my fingers hurt!

[cstaylor]

Why does this sound like personal experience?

[Naniwan Kid]

OYAJI WROTE:

Yeah, I said it.
What is your point? It is STILL the truth. Rape is indeed a selfish crime. Sometimes it is NOT about power. But the desire to HAVE a particular woman. Some rapes are not planned but are "crimes of passion".

All crime is about power. It's about taking power that you don't have a right to.

I want to drive a Lexus. If my neighbor drives a Lexus does that give me a good excuse to steal it from him?

By your logic if he soups it up with nice rims and a big stereo, it's HIS fault for it getting stolen.

Pardon my Japanese, but I call bullshit.

But if a woman is gonna wear clothing that shows off every curve of her body and then walks down a dark alley in a bad part of town, I won't feel sorry for her. And I will tell her to her face she deserved what she got, because she should have known better that the world we live in is a dangerous place.

Great, you have just described less than 1% of rapes. What you describe comes out of a slasher movie. This is NOT reality. Most rapes are by people the women know, and using her clothes as a defense went out with acid-washed jeans.

Women wear provacative and "sexy" clothing in order to attract the attention of men. Some may say "not so" and say it is because it makes them feel good. OK. Clothing that is hard to walk in, hard to breath and move in makes you feel good? Keep lying to yourself.
Clothing can look REALLY nice without drawing the wrong kind of attention.

Why they wear it is not an issue. What is wrong with wanting to feel "sexy"? It's nice being a man, as in my dance-club days I tried to wear clothes that would make me attractive to women, but I knew I could go home without getting raped, and then being blamed because of it.

Sure there are less revealing clothes women can wear...they can also wear chastity belts with combination locks on them. Maybe we should require those to prevent rape.

Baby, if your gonna advertise, people are gonna expect a product.

Jesus, man. You are saying "don't wear a mini-skirt unless you are ready to suck some dick." Hate to say it, but that is a real oyaji speaking. Those attitudes scare me a little. I have been turned down millions of times. Know what I do? Have another beer and call it a night. I don't "expect" anything of any woman (or man, for that matter).

Women do abuse their sexual power, and some don't even realize it!

Especially those 16-year-olds in Shinjuku! Man, they really deserve a good raping, don't they?

I have known women who did this. They even bragged at work the next day how they went out with 5 bucks in their pocket (just enough to cover the door cost) and drank all night on "some chump" then ditched him and went home. She never planned on doing anything with him, she threw away his number, and she had a blast telling her friends about the things she did to this guy just to keep him buying. Its disgusting.

It's called "sour grapes", oyaji. They may be low class or shallow, but that does NOT excuse raping them.

[mercutio]

You are a very confused person . There are more holes in what you said than swiss cheeze but this is my favorite:

And alot of them know it. Women do abuse their sexual power, and some don't even realize it!

within 2 sentences you've said ...they know ...they dont know.... make up your damn mind, boy.

actually you just sound a little bitter from one too-many nights of buying girls drinks to no avail...

We should encourage women who dress nice, not make them feel like their doing something wrong. And anyone who thinks makes a woman feel like *SHE* is at fault for being raped needs to have some sense knocked into them.

I think rapists should recive a punishment that fits the crime, make sure they get a prison cell with some big fucker twice their size and make sure they get to know what it feels like to be made someones "bitch".

[American Oyaji]

1. I don't agree with the crime of rape.
2. I do stand by the statement of don't advertise.
3. I won't feel sorry for the victim if she is wearing next to nothing at 2 am and decides to go walking in the bad part of town. But the rapist should be castrated.

And the comment that ALL crime is about power? No. Thats just 20th century psychobabble. I don't believe it. Most crime is an act of utter selfishness. Covetousness. Or envy. Or desire. It's the supreme "I WANT". A criminal wants something, but doesn't want to get it through the proper means, so they take it, whether its money, sex or someones car. People don't commit crime to feel "empowered". Talk to some REAL criminals who have turned over a new leaf and you'll understand.

Of course SOME crime is the criminal wanting to "get even" on someone or to make them feel demeaned or debased, but the root is still WHAT THEY WANT.

As for wanting to feel sexy GG? What makes you feel sexy? Why is it that women who "want to feel sexy" tend to wear the stuff they find in Victorias Secret. Or what they find in a magazine. You've been programmed by the fashion media about what is sexy or what you should feel sexy in. And every year "what is sexy" gets tighter and shows more skin. I can't speak to YOUR fashion though GG. Understand this. This is a blanket observation of what I see on the street and comments from my parents of what they see kids wearing in these schools. (they both teach) Kids are wearing "club clothes" to school. I really eel sorry for boys in school these days.

Personally, I think feminism has taken a turn for the worse.
NOW, saying that, I see nothing wrong between equality between the sexes. I'd rather have a female boss than a male one in some cases. I think we should have a woman president. But if a woman needs to show skin to feel empowered, something is wrong IMHO.

Anyway. I'm done with this. I'm pretty entrenched in my opinion, and nothing short of an alien invasion is gonna change my mind.

[Big Booger]

Does prostitution help reduce rape? If so I am all for controlled and legalized prostitution like that in LV.

[Naniwan Kid]

And the comment that ALL crime is about power? No. Thats just 20th century psychobabble. I don't believe it. Most crime is an act of utter selfishness. Covetousness. Or envy. Or desire. It's the supreme "I WANT". A criminal wants something, but doesn't want to get it through the proper means, so they take it, whether its money, sex or someones car. People don't commit crime to feel "empowered". Talk to some REAL criminals who have turned over a new leaf and you'll understand.

Of course SOME crime is the criminal wanting to "get even" on someone or to make them feel demeaned or debased, but the root is still WHAT THEY WANT.

You just described several situations which are all about POWER. I don't want to waste time on semantics...Power...desire....revenge...all factors.

3. I won't feel sorry for the victim if she is wearing next to nothing at 2 am and decides to go walking in the bad part of town. But the rapist should be castrated.

What if she were murdered, would you feel sorry for her then?

As for wanting to feel sexy GG? What makes you feel sexy? Why is it that women who "want to feel sexy" tend to wear the stuff they find in Victorias Secret. Or what they find in a magazine. You've been programmed by the fashion media about what is sexy or what you should feel sexy in. And every year "what is sexy" gets tighter and shows more skin.

Oyaji, sorry again, but you sound like an oyaji again. True the days of seeing a woman's ankle being scandalous are over, but the popular fashion today is no more or less revealing than it was in 1969.

[GomiGirl]

True the days of seeing a woman's ankle being scandalous are over, but the popular fashion today is no more or less revealing than it was in 1969.

I will agree with that.

I don't know what kids are wearing to school in the US but I have always thought that uniforms are best for schools kids. Kids will show their individuality by changing how they wear their socks, the length of their hems, hairstyles, piercings etc so it is not about making kids into robots but it does take away a heap of time wasting in the morning deciding what to wear.

[GargoyleTS]

You are a very confused person . There are more holes in what you said than swiss cheeze but this is my favorite:

And alot of them know it. Women do abuse their sexual power, and some don't even realize it!

within 2 sentences you've said ...they know ...they dont know.... make up your damn mind, boy.

actually you just sound a little bitter from one too-many nights of buying girls drinks to no avail... [/quote]

My statement is not contradictory, just bad grammar. the first sentence belongs to the previous sentence, not the next. And I don't do pick ups in bars, just going by reports from friends.

We should encourage women who dress nice, not make them feel like their doing something wrong. And anyone who thinks makes a woman feel like *SHE* is at fault for being raped needs to have some sense knocked into them.

I think rapists should recive a punishment that fits the crime, make sure they get a prison cell with some big fucker twice their size and make sure they get to know what it feels like to be made someones "bitch".

I don't mind women dressing "nice". I don't need to see her panties, or be able to tell you how many piercings she has, if she shaves her cooter, what size panties she wears (from reading the label) and the exact size, shape and color of her nipples. I don't think women are at fault for being raped. But there is such a thing as dressing like a target. Picture this: a 25y.o. lady dressed in high heels (black stilletto), fishnet stockings, black G-string, Micro-mini skirt, Ripped-halter T-shirt that shows the bottoms of her non-Bra enclosed breasts sitting at a table in a bar with 4 friends dressed in a similar manner bitching about being treated like sex-objects and getting hit-on by the scuzziest men while the woman at the bar in the elegant ankle-length single shoulder black dress is turning away their dream guys. Irony? Or simply pathetic? Irregardless of your answer, the fast remains they dressed this way looking for sex and trying to abuse their sexual power to land the man they want.

As far as punishing rapists, they are punished. Why should rape be punished with rape? Do you wanna kill killers? Take all the possessions from a thief? Maybe run over drunk drivers with a bigger car than they drive? Eye for an Eye punishments are not the answer. They neither keep someone from raping again, nor undo the rapes damage to the victim. And nothing will undo that damage, except MAYBE time. Sorry about the tone of this last bit, but Eye for an Eye didn't keep crime from happening when it was in effect (and it still is someplaces, and lo! they still have crime!). And no, I don't think his johnson should be cut-off or he should be made chemically sterile or any of that bullshit. It just becomes other violent crimes and leads to Rape via Instrumentation. Lock 'em up is the best we can do for now, so off to the pokey with 'em.

(BTW, sorry to take so long to respond, I was in jail all weekend...with my friends who work there playin Halo, Red Faction 2, and Warhammer 40K. )

[ramchop]

And no, I don't think his johnson should be cut-off or he should be made chemically sterile or any of that bullshit.

I think chemical castration is the ideal punishment for repeat offenders.

Many have said rape is about power and not sex. I'd largely agree, but it's undeniably testosterone driven.

It just becomes other violent crimes and leads to Rape via Instrumentation.

You got any evidence to back up this statement?

[GargoyleTS]

Well, I apologize and retract that statement Ramchop. After spending hours searching for criminal statistics to back that claim (as I do recall reading in the papers about impotent men commiting rape via instrumentation on more than one occasion) i can find no statistics on this variable. I can find stats on Rape via Inst., but nothing on wether the offender was impotent or otherwise incapable of sexual intercourse. Also, I can find references to men electing/forced to chemical sterility commiting rape again, but there is suspiscion as to wether they stopped treatment for a period of time when they raped again. But I can find stats about rapists raping and commiting other violent crimes after incarceration all over the place! BTW, for all who are interested...GOOGLE SUX!!! (many reasons)

And women commit rape too. M-M, M-F (most prevalent), F-M, and F-F rape all occurs.