Korea To Fingerprint & Photograph Foreign Visitors

[Mulboyne]

Korea Herald: Foreigners to have photos, fingerprints taken on entry
Foreigners will have to have their fingerprints and photographs taken when entering the country, according to a law passed in a Cabinet meeting yesterday. Under the revision bill of the immigration control law, foreigners aged 17 or older are to have their photographs taken and fingerprints registered at the airport entrance desk from 2012. Those who refuse to do so may be denied access to the country. Diplomats and government officials will be excluded from the obligations. An automatic identification machine will replace the present face-to-face screening interview at the airport, according to the bill. "The law aims at providing investigators with basic information so as to prevent the entrance of criminals or illegal immigrants," said a Justice Ministry official...more...

I see Korea didn't bother with the Japan's "terrorism countermeasure" justification.

[xenomorph42]

Here we go again...

[alicia454]

Nice to know that the South Koreans can be as xenophobic, racist, and stupid to innocent foreign visitors as are the Japanese, Americans, and British.

Best to vote with your wallet, and whenever possible, boycott all of these fingerprinting countries that treat law abiding visitors as criminals. There are still lots of other countries that still genuinely welcome visitors, international business, and tourist dollars.

[Samurai_Jerk]

Nice to know that the South Koreans can be as xenophobic, racist, and stupid to innocent foreign visitors as are the Japanese, Americans, and British.

Best to vote with your wallet, and whenever possible, boycott all of these fingerprinting countries that treat law abiding visitors as criminals. There are still lots of other countries that still genuinely welcome visitors, international business, and tourist dollars.

You still live in Japan, right?

[Greji]

Nice to know that the South Koreans can be as xenophobic, racist, and stupid to innocent foreign visitors as are the Japanese, Americans, and British.

Best to vote with your wallet, and whenever possible, boycott all of these fingerprinting countries that treat law abiding visitors as criminals. There are still lots of other countries that still genuinely welcome visitors, international business, and tourist dollars.

What is it that you have done that you are so deathly afraid of having your fingerprint taken?

The fingerprint procedure in Japan for your information, was originally taken as a signature because foreigners did not have a legally registered hanko to officially sign the original of a legal document i.e. the left index finger. It is still done for legal documents for fgs or Japanese, if they don't have a hanko, or have forgotten to bring it. It was never intended to be a record for identification although it did eventually evolve into that.

[alicia454]

You still live in Japan, right?

I am still a resident of Taito-ku in Tokyo.

What is it that you have done that you are so deathly afraid of having your fingerprint taken?

I have never been arrested, stolen goods, taken illegal drugs, or commit a violent act. But that is not the point. It is already too late for me, my rights have already been taken away. I have already been fingerprinted several times at Narita and Kansai airports. But I am still against the continued erosion of human rights in general for myself and for everyone else.

Once your fingerprint is recorded by untrustworthy parties, such as the criminals at Accenture that forged the books for Enron and are now managing Japan's fingerprint database, it can be easily forged using simple gelatine and an ink-jet printer. Even without forgery, fingerprints can still be used to convict an innocent bystander that accidently stumbles across a crime scene.

But what brothers me most is the double standard in this fingerprinting business. None of these countries would even dare to engage in wholesale fingerprinting of their own citizens, but consider it acceptable to fingerprint visitors. By your logic, what do the citizens of these countries have to hide?

I have visited Narita and Kansai airports many times, and I have yet to see any Japanese national volunteer to have their fingerprint taken, so they must all be guilty of something.

[sublight]

What is it that you have done that you are so deathly afraid of having your fingerprint taken?

Absolutely nothing. But what have they done to show they can be trusted to handle personal information safely and responsibly?

It's not, "If I've done nothing wrong, I have nothing to worry about," it's "If you've done nothing wrong, I have nothing to worry about." And so far, I've yet to see a government institution of any country that meets that criteria.

[sublight]

Diplomats and government officials will be excluded from the obligations.

Odd that they exclude the two groups most likely to be doing something illegal.

[Greji]

But what brothers me most is the double standard in this fingerprinting business. None of these countries would even dare to engage in wholesale fingerprinting of their own citizens, but consider it acceptable to fingerprint visitors. By your logic, what do the citizens of these countries have to hide?

It is not by my logic love, it is called by the law. The citizens of those countries may have noting to hide, but if they enter a country that legally requires fingerprinting, they will comply with the law, or will return home. It is that simple. If you consider fingerprinting such an erosion of your rights, there is a exit line at the airport as well.

The US has the visa waiver program for 90 days with Japan, but if you have ever had an overstay on a visa, you are not eligible and must obtain a visa. 99.99 percent of all Japanese college students have had an overstay. These normally occurred because of blips caused by going home during summer and end of year vacation times and were never more than one or two days. Under the old system these minor miscues were glossed over. Now, since 9-11, they are formally held as a visa overstay and all of theses former students are ineligible for the visa waiver program and require a regular visa to go into the US. Is that fair? Probably not, but it is not their fault, or yours, or mine, that security was enhanced to that level? No, it is now the law and BTW they are all fingerprinted. So it goes back to square one. It you don't like it, you have an out. Hit the road Jack. But, your belief in whether it is fair or not, does not eliminate the requirement under the law and until the law is changed you and all of us will comply. Shoganai.

[nottu]

[Greji]

Did you have these feelings when you got your passport? It would seem that anyone concerned with "xenophobia" and "racism" would have some problems with the standard passport photo. Fingerprints don't indicate race, but photos give some immmediate insights. Wouldn't it preferable, with your concerns, to have passports with fingerprints rather than photos?

Hey, never thought about that. Interesting come-back Nottu....

[Kuang_Grade]

I think some folks don't necessarily have a huge issue with respective host government getting/having fingerprint data for their own respective reasoning but rather have issues with that data then being transferred to 3rd parties for no good reason at all/being transferred to 3rd parties with zero certainty that the data will not be compromised along the way. After all, it is not likeproblems didn't pop up even under supposedly rigorous law enforcement controls....God knows what is happening now and what data is being comingled with your name and then being transmitted to the US gov.....The J gov has done a shit job protecting their own citizens data, so you can only imagine the complete lack of concern they're going to show for FG data.

[Samurai_Jerk]

I am still a resident of Taito-ku in Tokyo.

Then you really should get off your boycott highhorse.

That doesn't mean I disagree with you that immigration officials shouldn't be fingerprinting people. I actually do agree. You just have no credibility when you talk about boycotting a country that you choose to live in.

the criminals at Accenture that forged the books for Enron

Again, I'm not taking issue with your main point but that wasn't Accenture, it was Arthur Andersen.

[xenomorph42]

It's really quite simple, no one is forcing anyone to stay and live in the US, Japan or S. Korea. Do I like to be fingerprinted, No! But nothing you can do about it. Doesn't really bother me. Do I worry about someone doing something devious with my prints, not really. It really doesn't do any good to stress out about it. You just have to accept it or leave and go to a country that doesn't require fingerprinting, but I think eventually, most countries will adopt this system as time goes on, believe me and each will have their own reason as to why they would implement and incorporate into their system. I also agree, if you haven't done anything wrong, why worry? Sometimes people go overboard worrying about petty things that you really can't change. If the government wants to listen in on your conversations or put cameras on every street block or like in NY, the police can randomly do a "search and frisk" if they feel it necessary to do so. In Japan, when I use my credit card, I am never asked to show my ID, but in the states, its the usual, "can I see your drivers license or another form of ID" if you can't provide that, then you're SOL! Again, I hate it, but that is the system and I just have to either accept it or pay in cash. We live in a different time era. When I was a kid living in LA and I mean near LAX(for those individuals that know the area, you what its like there)Inglewood to be exact, it was very different in those days, no police you could go and walk anywhere and never had to look over your shoulder, but now...
This is the world that we live in for better or worse, again, don't stress so much, nothing you can do about it.

[nottu]

[DrP]

Just get a set of fake prints and use them whenever you travel. I suggest pulling a set off the beer glass of the person sitting next to you next time in an Izakaya. Then repeat the process often. I wonder if there is actually some law or regulation that clearly states you need to use YOUR finger print on the machine... Anytime I've gone through customs - they just asked me to plant my 2 fingers down. What if it doesn't 'match' - they have never taken a reference print as far as I know.

[alicia454]

Then you really should get off your boycott highhorse.
That doesn't mean I disagree with you that immigration officials shouldn't be fingerprinting people. I actually do agree. You just have no credibility when you talk about boycotting a country that you choose to live in.
Again, I'm not taking issue with your main point but that wasn't Accenture, it was Arthur Andersen.

Would if I could, but economic circumstances prevent me from moving currently. If I won a million dollar plus jackpot in a lottery, that would be a different story.

And as a legal resident of Japan, I do think I should have a right to complain about the country where I live when it engages in active discrimination against me.

And by the way, although Accenture started splitting off from Arthur Andersen, it was only in August 2000, as a result of a conclusion of the International Chamber of Commerce, that the split was completed and all contractual ties were terminated. Before then, there was already sufficient criminal activity ("consulting") with Enron and other companies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accenture#Splitting_from_Arthur_Andersen

It kind of reminds me about how Bernard Madoff's wife Ruth is trying to keep millions of dollars of stolen investor assets.

[hundefar]

Fingerprints don't indicate race

Except if the person in question is one of the dangerous jews, of course. His fingerprints will look like that of the gecko because it makes it easier for the money to stick.

[Christoff]

I would say it is worse in the us. Not only do they now fingerprint all incoming visitors, they also take photos of you and will soon be requiring biometric passports. It doesnt really surprise me about the photo thin in korea considering you need to give out you national id number is you want to be part of many korean message boards, such as Duam, by far the most popular.

[Samurai_Jerk]

And by the way, although Accenture started splitting off from Arthur Andersen, it was only in August 2000, as a result of a conclusion of the International Chamber of Commerce, that the split was completed and all contractual ties were terminated. Before then, there was already sufficient criminal activity ("consulting") with Enron and other companies.

No, Andersen Consulting/Accenture had already split from Arthur Andersen about 10 years earlier and had been fighting with them for years over the use of the Ansersen name and the fact that they had to pay a percentage of profits to Arthur Andersen despite the fact Arthur Andersen were operating a competing consulting practice. Anderson Consulting/Accenture was not involved in cooking Enron's books and never got in trouble for it unlike Arthur Andersen which was dissolved by the US government and acquired in bits and pieces by other companies.

There might be plenty of other reasons to have beef with Accenture but Enron is not one of them.

Would if I could, but economic circumstances prevent me from moving currently. If I won a million dollar plus jackpot in a lottery, that would be a different story.

Put your money where your mouth is or STFU.

And as a legal resident of Japan, I do think I should have a right to complain about the country where I live when it engages in active discrimination against me.

I agree you have the right to complain. Again, I agree with you that the system is wrong though I probably don't feel as strongly about it as you do and since my thumb print was already in the system in Japan and my fingerprints were already in the system in the US, I'm was not and am not too worried about it on a personal level.

There are people who would argue that the whole idea of requring visas and passports is wrong and that as free human beings we should have the right to come and go as we please. Developed nations are essentially rationing the good life to their citizens and those they choose to let enter and not giving an equal chance to millions of suffering people who've done nothing wrong but be born with a particular nationality. As a libertarian at heart I agree with that idea on a philosophical level but practically speaking I know we can't just open the borders to any and all comers.

[IkemenTommy]

The more appropriate thread title would be "Korea to Fingerfuck & Photograph Foreign Visitors"

[Ganma]

Another country trying to win a popularity contest with tourists. ...and Korea is an even less attractive tourist destination than Japan - concrete and pollution anyone?

Foreigners to be fingerprinted upon entry of Korea from August.

So writes the Chosun Ilbo today:

All foreigners over 17 will be fingerprinted and photographed when they enter Korea starting in August. A revision to the immigration control law was passed by the National Assembly's Legislation and Judiciary Committee on Monday.

Once the bill passes a plenary session, it will be possible to stop foreigners, who have been deported for crimes in the country, from reentering on a different passport.


Korean-language version here. I was looking around for an offensive cartoon of foreign criminals to pair with this post---Dong-A Ilbo, you taking the day off?---but am a little disappointed to not find one.

This issue has been discussed for years. I've written about it twice before

* December 28, 2008: "Korean government wants to fingerprint foreign tourists and residents by 2010."
* September 22, 2009: "Bill for fingerprinting foreign tourists by 2012 to be introduced next month."


and said that I don't see a problem with asking for fingerprints of tourists upon entry. It was introduced to Japan a couple years ago, and was met with some heavy opposition by readers of Japan Probe and Japan Guide. You'd need to read through some of the articles from 2006 and 2007, which pop up in a Google search, to get a sense of the climate in Japan a few years ago, as a lot of the outrage came because residents and visa-holders were also to have their fingerprints taken at each entry. It's not clear if that would happen in South Korea. The 2008 Korea Times article says

The Ministry of Justice said Saturday that it will propose to revise the Immigration Law so that all foreign nationals, either for short-term stay or long-term, are obliged to provide their biometric information to the Korean authorities when they come to the country.


but it doesn't say whether data of "long-term" foreign nationals would be taken upon first entry or each entry. more...

[Samurai_Jerk]

Korea is an even less attractive tourist destination than Japan - concrete and pollution anyone?

Pretty much everyone I've met who's traveled in both countries (and I'm not including people who lived in either) liked Korea a lot better.

[Ganma]

Pretty much everyone I've met who's traveled in both countries (and I'm not including people who lived in either) liked Korea a lot better.

This hasn't been my experience and I've been there and known people who lived there. That being said I didn't have a bad experience there myself, I liked the food, but I didn't think it was a better place in any way.
What did they say they liked more about Korea?

[Samurai_Jerk]

This hasn't been my experience and I've been there and known people who lived there. That being said I didn't have a bad experience there myself, I liked the food, but I didn't think it was a better place in any way.
What did they say they liked more about Korea?

As I mentioned, I'm not including people who've lived in either. Just people who've been to both as tourists. People who've lived in Korea tend to say it's a shithole. That seems to be changing recently though.

I go once a year and love it but I definitely prefer Japan as a place to live.

Anyway, I haven't gone into detail about what they liked better, they've just found it more fun and more exciting.

[rooboy]

Well I s'pose all the people here who don't mind what Japan and Korea do to foreigners who are actually residents in the country and not tourists,will think it's fine then if our countries reciprocate.

That is - start taking the fingerprints and biometric data of Japanese and Koreans. After all, I haven't heard of any Aussie gangs setting up shop in Japan and Korea unlike the Yakuza coming to do it in Queensland and Korean gangs setting up prostitution and human trafficking networks in Sydney.

And as the Japanese exported terrorism into Europe via the J Red Army and murdered people at an airport counter, then that's enough to start doing it to Japanese. If they're gonna stigmatise us then let's make em undergo the same based on their citizens' track records of organised crime activity and terrorism in Australia, the US, Canada and Europe.