Home | Forums | Mark forums read | Search | FAQ | Login

Advanced search
Hot Topics
Buraku hot topic Debito reinvents himself as a Uyoku movie star!
Buraku hot topic Steven Seagal? Who's that?
Buraku hot topic Best Official Japan Souvenirs
Buraku hot topic Multiculturalism on the rise?
Buraku hot topic As if gaijin men didn't have a bad enough reputation...
Buraku hot topic Swapping Tokyo For Greenland
Buraku hot topic
Buraku hot topic Dutch wives for sale
Buraku hot topic Live Action "Akira" Update
Buraku hot topic Iran, DPRK, Nuke em, Like Japan
Change font size
  • fuckedgaijin ‹ General ‹ F*cked News

No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Odd news from Japan and all things Japanese around the world.
Post a reply
265 posts • Page 9 of 9 • 1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby matsuki » Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:27 pm

So...are you saying that there are people, say French, that naturalize here, throw away their French citizenship...and than go get back the French citizenship?
User avatar
matsuki
 
Posts: 16045
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 4:29 pm
Location: All Aisu deserves a good bukkake
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby kurogane » Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:45 pm

Samurai_Jerk wrote:

kurogane wrote:Please refrain from ethnocentric projectionalising that reeks of Yet More White People telling Japan how to live its life. :razz:


More hipsterism from the guy who hates hipsters. Why don't you go where an ironic T-shirt and drink some super double hop blueberry IPA? :wink:.


I would put it on and post if I knew wear it was................ :lol: No need for FemBeer, btw. Found a place with bottles of Bud for 550 near the Thunder Gate in Arsakoosa.

Anyways, great points, nice discussion. I agree with a general openness to the idea of increased immigration amongst a substantial portion of the Shitamachi crowd here in Asakusa, though they are rather adamant they mean anybody BUT mainland Chinese. I also think of lot of that older I've Got Mine So FU crowd you guys mentioned are simply old and tired and can't handle any more change, and a lot of them really did go through quite a bit since Hirohito announced that events had turned out not exactly in their favour. Still, selfish as all get up to be sure.

One idea I find remarkably absent is the idea of controlled shrinkage on a sort of Nordic model. I suppose the loss of Great Power Status is simply too much for their poor minds to bear.

Now, as for this brilliant end run idea suggested by Choko (relinquishing then regaining a second citizenship): it would be interesting to see if that even contravened the letter of the Jpn naturalisation regulations, though I would hate to try to argue it didn't on the spirit of it.
User avatar
kurogane
Maezumo
 
Posts: 4483
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 5:24 pm
Location: Here
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Wage Slave » Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:54 pm

chokonen888 wrote:So...are you saying that there are people, say French, that naturalize here, throw away their French citizenship...and than go get back the French citizenship?


Not that I have the slightest intention in that direction as I don't really have a dog in the fight here but I fail to see why it is at all difficult for a normal reasonable person if s/he should have a good reason to do it. The UK rules specifically refer to a right to recover your citizenship after you have renounced it in order to gain another citizenship.

I would be very surprised if no-one has done it.
It is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

- Macbeth (Act 5, Scene 5)

William Shakespeare, April 1564 - May 3rd 1616
User avatar
Wage Slave
Maezumo
 
Posts: 3765
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 12:40 am
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby havill » Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:38 pm

chokonen888 wrote:So...are you saying that there are people, say French, that naturalize here, throw away their French citizenship...and than go get back the French citizenship?


That clause about not living in France after renouncing French citizenship is probably to close some tax evasion shenanigans / loophole ala the United States' Belize's Kenneth Dart.

I'm looking at you, Comrade Gérard Depardieu.
Last edited by havill on Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:44 pm, edited 2 times in total.
havill
 
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Samurai_Jerk » Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:39 pm

kurogane wrote:No need for FemBeer, btw. Found a place with bottles of Bud for 550 near the Thunder Gate in Arsakoosa.


Which place is that? I try to avoid the area right around Kaminarimon (except the kick-ass Thai place in the Asakusa Chikagai under Matsuya) and head for deep Asakusa or stay on my side of the river in Sumida-ku.
User avatar
Samurai_Jerk
Maezumo
 
Posts: 14387
Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2004 7:11 am
Location: Tokyo
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby kurogane » Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:43 pm

It's called Tokyo Knowledge, right on the main Thunder Road drag north side 2 back (east or riverside) from Kokusai-Doori, upstairs 2nd floor. It's only been open about 6 months. Their sandwichboard sign on the street is pretty striking. Nice owner, good crowd. It's more of a neighbourhood bar type scene, not a pickup club as one drunken Spaniard found out last week. 500 for Jpn beer, 550 for the luxury brands..............like Budweiser.......... ;)

I have been surprised how dead or schlocky touristy the Kaminari area is, even after the tourists go home. Asakusa in general seems rather dead, but I prefer that to clubby clubby. Nice to hear about the Thai place.
User avatar
kurogane
Maezumo
 
Posts: 4483
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 5:24 pm
Location: Here
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby kurogane » Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:45 pm

Wage Slave wrote:
chokonen888 wrote:So...are you saying that there are people, say French, that naturalize here, throw away their French citizenship...and than go get back the French citizenship?


Not that I have the slightest intention in that direction as I don't really have a dog in the fight here but I fail to see why it is at all difficult for a normal reasonable person if s/he should have a good reason to do it. The UK rules specifically refer to a right to recover your citizenship after you have renounced it in order to gain another citizenship.

I would be very surprised if no-one has done it.


More importantly, the Japanese would never know and the letter of the law would be satisfied.
User avatar
kurogane
Maezumo
 
Posts: 4483
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 5:24 pm
Location: Here
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Hijinx » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:28 pm

Speaking of renouncing citizenship, did anyone happen to see where the U.S. just upped the fee for this procedure?

http://rt.com/usa/183972-fee-renounce-us-citizenship/

I wonder at what point in the future will the U.S. start calling the act defection.
Japan Today's moderators are retarded fuckwits. Especially the one that was moderating the morning of 12/31/18--what a true cunt.
User avatar
Hijinx
Maezumo
 
Posts: 216
Joined: Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:08 am
Location: In a den of sin
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby havill » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:32 pm

kurogane wrote:More importantly, the Japanese would never know...


... until they try to apply for/renew a Japanese passport, that is, then they have to ask themselves, "am I feeling lucky?"
Last edited by havill on Wed Sep 03, 2014 7:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.
havill
 
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby havill » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:41 pm

Hijinx wrote:Speaking of renouncing citizenship, did anyone happen to see where the U.S. just upped the fee for this procedure?

http://rt.com/usa/183972-fee-renounce-us-citizenship/

I wonder at what point in the future will the U.S. start calling the act defection.


There's a difference between renunciation and relinquishment in U.S. law. "Relinquishment", which is what 99% of most people do including everybody who naturalizes, is still free ($0).

"Renouncing" U.S. citizenship is rare, often (but not always) used to do something that Japan, Canada, and most European countries won't even allow you to do anymore: go stateless.
havill
 
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Samurai_Jerk » Wed Sep 03, 2014 6:08 pm

kurogane wrote:It's called Tokyo Knowledge, right on the main Thunder Road drag north side 2 back (east or riverside) from Kokusai-Doori, upstairs 2nd floor. It's only been open about 6 months. Their sandwichboard sign on the street is pretty striking. Nice owner, good crowd. It's more of a neighbourhood bar type scene, not a pickup club as one drunken Spaniard found out last week. 500 for Jpn beer, 550 for the luxury brands..............like Budweiser.......... ;)

I have been surprised how dead or schlocky touristy the Kaminari area is, even after the tourists go home. Asakusa in general seems rather dead, but I prefer that to clubby clubby. Nice to hear about the Thai place.


If you go behind Sensoji and head more or less north across Kotoi Dori towards Asakusa 3-chome, Senzoku, etc., places tend to be open till much later. It's still very much a laid back local scene though.

The Thai place (Montee) is spicy as hell so be prepared for ring of fire the next day if you try it out. They don't dumb it down for the locals or farang at all.
User avatar
Samurai_Jerk
Maezumo
 
Posts: 14387
Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2004 7:11 am
Location: Tokyo
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Hijinx » Wed Sep 03, 2014 6:17 pm

havill wrote:
Hijinx wrote:Speaking of renouncing citizenship, did anyone happen to see where the U.S. just upped the fee for this procedure?

http://rt.com/usa/183972-fee-renounce-us-citizenship/

I wonder at what point in the future will the U.S. start calling the act defection.


There's a difference between renunciation and relinquishment in U.S. law. "Relinquishment", which is what 99% of most people do including everybody who naturalizes, is still free ($0).

"Renouncing" U.S. citizenship is rare, often (but not always) used to do something that Japan, Canada, and most European countries won't even allow you to do anymore: go stateless.


Very interesting!

So what about those who naturalize as Japanese, but keep the U.S. passport? I've heard that while Japan does not allow dual citizenship, the U.S. does--providing you enter the States on the U.S. passport. Though I do wonder how the people who go this route manage to avoid trouble at J-immigration.

-Edit- I did find this: http://www.turning-japanese.info/2013/1 ... ports.html

I wonder how long you could get away with the two passport thingy.
Japan Today's moderators are retarded fuckwits. Especially the one that was moderating the morning of 12/31/18--what a true cunt.
User avatar
Hijinx
Maezumo
 
Posts: 216
Joined: Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:08 am
Location: In a den of sin
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Takechanpoo » Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:45 pm

first of all, why the fuk do you damn gaijin fellows want to live in this shitty small nation?
i was born and raised in this country and speak only japanese so have no choice but to live here.
otherwise its very the last choice to live in this land of nothingness, which is full of small crappy houses, skinny roads, crazy way of labor practices, passive aggressive unpleasant dotards and radioactive contaminations.
dont waste your life time any more and fuk off from here asap
:mrgreen:
User avatar
Takechanpoo
 
Posts: 4294
Images: 4
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2006 10:47 pm
Location: Tama Prefecture(多摩県)
  • Website
  • Personal album
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Wage Slave » Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:55 pm

None of your business TKP. None of your business. But rest assured that Japan got a very good deal out of it.
It is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

- Macbeth (Act 5, Scene 5)

William Shakespeare, April 1564 - May 3rd 1616
User avatar
Wage Slave
Maezumo
 
Posts: 3765
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 12:40 am
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby wagyl » Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:15 pm

Takechanpoo wrote:speak only japanese

whoops!
User avatar
wagyl
Maezumo
 
Posts: 5949
Images: 0
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:08 pm
Location: The Great Plain of the Fourth Instance
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby matsuki » Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:25 pm

Funny but I know more than a few Japanese that have done just that.
User avatar
matsuki
 
Posts: 16045
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 4:29 pm
Location: All Aisu deserves a good bukkake
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Russell » Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:12 pm

wagyl wrote:
Takechanpoo wrote:speak only japanese

whoops!

Would that imply that all his posts are input via Google Translate?

That would explain why his English has become better over the years...
Image ― Voltaire
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.”

“I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.” ― Albert Einstein
User avatar
Russell
Maezumo
 
Posts: 8578
Images: 1
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2010 11:51 pm
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby kurogane » Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:24 pm

havill wrote:
kurogane wrote:More importantly, the Japanese would never know...


... until they try to apply for/renew a Japanese passport, that is, then they have to ask themselves, "am I feeling lucky?"


How so???? I mean the logistics of getting caught out.

Like Hijinx, the double passport trick is one to which I can never quite remember the key , since you usually need to enter a country on that passport. I have 10 or 12 Jpn/naturalised Canadian friends that have both, but I think they travel exclusively on their Cdn passport because they are never in Japan long enough for it to matter.
User avatar
kurogane
Maezumo
 
Posts: 4483
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 5:24 pm
Location: Here
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Samurai_Jerk » Thu Sep 04, 2014 6:30 pm

Where America's 46 million immigrants come from, in one map
User avatar
Samurai_Jerk
Maezumo
 
Posts: 14387
Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2004 7:11 am
Location: Tokyo
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby yanpa » Thu Sep 04, 2014 6:45 pm

Samurai_Jerk wrote:Where America's 46 million immigrants come from, in one map


So that's like 250 million Native Americans or whatever the correct term is? The tribal areas must be bursting at the seams. :twisted:
User avatar
yanpa
 
Posts: 5671
Images: 11
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2007 11:50 am
Location: Tokyo
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Taro Toporific » Mon Oct 13, 2014 1:48 pm

Coligny wrote:Only one step saner the Lizard people takeover conspiramacy theeries...


Throwback Thursday: Did Lizard People live under L.A. 5,000 years ago?
LA Times | 2014jan23
...
Busy Los Angeles, although little realizing it in the hustle and bustle of modern existence, stands above a lost city of catacombs filled with incalculable treasure and imperishable records of a race of humans further advanced intellectually and scientifically than even the highest type of present day peoples, in the belief of G. Warren Shufelt, geophysical mining engineer now engaged in an attempt to wrest from the lost city deep in the earth below Fort Moore Hill the secrets of the Lizard People of legendary fame in the medicine lodges of the American Indian."
The Times had covered other attempts to find these tunnels under downtown L.A., but this one carried an artist's concept of the Lizard People at work...more...
lizardpeople.jpg


Also refer to the original LA Times of 1934 report: http://documents.latimes.com/jan-29-1934-lizard-people/
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
User avatar
Taro Toporific
 
Posts: 10021532
Images: 0
Joined: Tue Sep 10, 2002 2:02 pm
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby Russell » Fri Oct 17, 2014 8:34 am

Welfare rollback underway as ruling empowers xenophobes

The landmark Supreme Court ruling in July that found permanent residents of Japan legally ineligible for public assistance is already having an impact. Moves are afoot both at the national and local levels to try to scale back or remove welfare payments to foreign residents.

In a lawsuit filed by an 82-year-old Chinese woman from Oita Prefecture, the nation’s top court made it clear that permanent foreign residents do not qualify for public assistance because they are not Japanese nationals. Article 1 of the 1950 Public Assistance Law states the law concerns “all nationals,” which the court said referred only to Japanese citizens.

Despite the ruling, the welfare ministry has stood by its long-standing policy of offering the same level of welfare protection to foreigners as Japanese, based on a notice it issued to municipal governments in 1954.

In line with the ministry policy, the municipal governments have distributed welfare benefits — ranging from cash assistance to free health care services to housing aid — to needy foreigners with permanent or long-term residency status, including the spouses of Japanese and migrant workers from Brazil.

But the July ruling has given momentum to some forces, including those harboring anti-foreigner sentiments and advocates of cutting “waste” in government spending, to try to limit foreigners’ access to welfare.

The minor opposition party Jisedai no To (Party for Future Generations), co-founded by ultranationalist Shintaro Ishihara, plans to submit bills to the extraordinary Diet session that would give destitute foreigners a year to choose between two extremes: becoming naturalized citizens or leaving the country.

The move follows an August proposal, by a team of lawmakers in the ruling Liberal Democratic party tasked with eliminating wasteful state spending, to restrict welfare assistance to foreigners.

“The welfare outlays to foreigners run up to ¥122 billion per year,” the Aug. 4 report by the LDP team said. “We must say it is difficult to maintain the status quo.”

The team also said the government “should create guidelines (on public assistance) for foreigners who arrive in Japan, and consider deporting those who cannot maintain a living.”

Taro Kono, a member of the Lower House who heads the LDP project team, said the envisioned revision to the welfare system would not affect permanent residents, but those on mid- to long-term visas. The changes would likely materialize in the form of denied access to public aid for a certain period after one’s arrival in Japan, to prevent abuse by those coming here just to receive welfare, he said. He added that the team has yet to decide on the number of months or years before foreigners would be granted access.

According to Kono, the rationale for creating a probational period is a provision in the Immigration Control and Refugee Recognition Law that states the government would deny entry to “a person who is likely to become a burden on the Japanese government or a local public entity because of an inability to make a living.”

“People who come to Japan on mid- to long-term visas would undergo a lot of events here, and some of them might lose their ability to make a living and apply for public assistance. That’s fine. But if they apply for assistance right after they arrive in Japan, that would mean they made a false claim (about their reason for coming),” Kono told The Japan Times earlier this month.

“Likewise when they renew their visas, they are supposed to have means to support themselves or otherwise their requests for visa renewals would be rejected. But if it turns out that they cannot sustain their living in, say, six months after their visas are renewed, that would mean they were not truthful about their means when they applied for a renewed visa, and (this would constitute) grounds for denial of public assistance.”

The LDP team also proposed that all welfare recipients be prescribed generic drugs unless otherwise specified by doctors. If they want to be prescribed patented drugs, they should pay for their share of the costs, according to the team’s report.

The team’s proposal for an eligibility requirement for foreigners based on their period of stay appears to be more or less in line with practices in other advanced countries.

Most European countries do not have a nationality clause for welfare benefits, but do list a residency period as a condition for eligibility, said Shinichi Oka, a professor of social security at Meiji Gakuin University in Tokyo.

At the same time, in Europe there is little distinction among different visa statuses, Oka said, noting that whether people have permanent resident status doesn’t affect their chances of qualifying for welfare.

“I’m not aware of any major European countries that (enforce) a nationality clause for public assistance eligibility,” Oka said. “The only requirement they have is that the applicants have lived in the country for a certain period of time.”

While the U.S. and Britain in principle deny welfare benefits to illegal aliens, in France, foreigners who have entered or are staying illegally in the country are also considered as “having the right to live” and are often deemed eligible for welfare benefits, Oka said.

More

Articles continues comparing with other countries.
Image ― Voltaire
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.”

“I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.” ― Albert Einstein
User avatar
Russell
Maezumo
 
Posts: 8578
Images: 1
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2010 11:51 pm
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby wagyl » Fri Oct 17, 2014 9:07 am

Another clickbait headline from Japan Times there, I see. A minor opposition party planning to submit a proposed bill (and one which is illogical by the way: if the guys are destitute how do they afford to leave Japan? Is naturalisation guaranteed then and is that the result Ishihara really wants there?) does not equal "welfare rollback." It doesn't sound like the municipalities administering the schemes have made any changes. As for the LDP committee proposal, I wonder how much is spent on assistance to foreigners who are not permanent residents. How much will this save? The tea and biscuits for the committee meetings probably cost more.
User avatar
wagyl
Maezumo
 
Posts: 5949
Images: 0
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:08 pm
Location: The Great Plain of the Fourth Instance
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby matsuki » Sat Oct 18, 2014 2:27 am

The minor opposition party Jisedai no To (Party for Future Generations), co-founded by ultranationalist Shintaro Ishihara, plans to submit bills to the extraordinary Diet session that would give destitute foreigners a year to choose between two extremes: becoming naturalized citizens or leaving the country.


To be honest, this doesn't sound so bad IFFFFFF the J-gov foots the bill to deport them back to their home country.
User avatar
matsuki
 
Posts: 16045
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 4:29 pm
Location: All Aisu deserves a good bukkake
Top

Re: No Welfare for Foreigners – Supreme Court

Postby wagyl » Mon Dec 08, 2014 9:33 pm

Blinky & Hiranuma's party asks us, through the medium of song, why we aren't talking about the fact* that Japan's Public Assistance Welfare system, funded from our [I suppose that mean's voters, but of course the tax base is wider than just those eligible to vote] taxes, has few Japanese citizen recipients, so why are there 8 times as many foreigners?

Many, many anime pigs were harmed in the production of this video.

* if it is in fact a fact. That is the first thing I want to talk about. It is being questioned. In that link, it seems that the Party for Future Generations did their own research to say that 14.7% of foreigners are receiving assistance, and 1.7% of Japanese are. According to that same link, statistics at the Ministry of Internal Affairs say foreigners are receiving assistance at the rate of 5.34%. Of those foreigners, those of the now aging households with Chosen Peninsular nationalities are receiving assistance at the rate of 6.38%. Japanese nationals are receiving at the rate of 3.23%.
User avatar
wagyl
Maezumo
 
Posts: 5949
Images: 0
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:08 pm
Location: The Great Plain of the Fourth Instance
Top

Previous

Post a reply
265 posts • Page 9 of 9 • 1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9

Return to F*cked News

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests

  • Board index
  • The team • Delete all board cookies • All times are UTC + 9 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group