Fixed that 2014 MOFA poster that's been causing a stir

[wagyl]

I really do encourage you to read the 12 pages of comic book.

By the way, the "fear of being surrounded by people who don't look like you" ends up being the "burden of being in a different school without your old friends" which is not, as we all agree, unique to international marriages.

[kurogane]

Thank you for your considered answers. I feel that the subtle, hidden nature of the racism is the US illustration is more insidious: the East Asian parent in this relationship is the one who caused trouble which is affecting this child.

As a canucklehead I can agree with that, but only because measuring our standards and ideals (which are at least aspirational and exhortative in some aspects) by the laughably troglodytic medievalism of the Japanese Official Version is like holding a World Cup Final where one side is a team of legless concussion patients playing the Ubermensch of Germany. Or I suppose I could just say like the Brazilian side in the semi-final.

As you say, it may be worth a read, but the choice of vague, acontextual but rather evocative visual imagery is at least as full retard as that infamous long nosed ANA ad, and far more sinister. When the rank and file you meet at the local bars are at least 25 years ahead of their corp of trained diplomats in their attitudes and knowledgeses you know there is something weird going on. And by weird I mean BAD. Berui Beri BAD.

BTW, I couldn't figure out why you think the East Asian parent is being blamed there (I did look at the links briefly). Just curious. No expellee style investigative animus here, no sirreeeee bob.

[matsuki]

Hong Kong and Macau signed back in the late 90's

TL;DR: very few Hong Kong and Macau citizens, male or female, marry Japanese compared to those from mainland China & Taiwan.
=====
As per "One country, two systems"*, the Ministry of Health, Labour, and Welfare counts the stats for Hong Kong and Macau separately. Q: How many male/female SARs (HK/MO) people married JP in 2009 (latest year I can find on the official stat site)? A: The number is so low** that the MHLW doesn't break the stat out like

• the PRC,
• Brazil,
• Korea (KR+KP),
• Phillipines,
• Thailand,
• Brazil,
• Peru,
• the U.S.,
• and the U.K.

: they're lumped into the "Other" category.

International marriage (Japanese+Other/None-of-the-above) in 2009: 4,687.
That means that Hong Kong and Macao are a fraction of that number.

Compare to mainland China: 13,789
and Korea: 5,992.

* Ironically, for political reasons, the MHLW counts Taiwan, or the ROC as I like to call it , as being part of the PRC.
** Congrats, U.K.: you managed to marry enough Japanese that you were deemed statistically relevant enough to break out into another column in 1995, along with the Brazilians, Peruvians, Thais and Filipinos. In 2009 Brits married 423 Japanese; Americans married 1,632 Japanese that year.

So...what about Korea? Only a year earlier but I imagine there are many Japanese-korean marriages based on all the ones I know...

[matsuki]

We can agree that the US is majority white?

This child is not pure white, so the foreign parent is, I'm guessing, East Asian.

The illustration is suggesting that the children who are subject to kidnapping from the US are kidnapped by their East Asian parent. That is, that the evil parents who do the kidnapping are East Asian.

What about the children of, for example, Danish-US International marriages kidnapped by their Danish parent?

Why are the East Asian evil parents represented by this illustration, and the evil Danish parents not?





OK. You have all read that. It seems a little out there, a little extreme. But if you want to believe it is a racist illustration, you can find your peace with the explanation. If you do not want to believe it is a racist illustration, you go away saying "Wagyl is nuts."



Now, read back over this thread.

We can agree that Japan is majority East Asian?

This child is not pure Asian, so the foreign parent is, I'm guessing, Caucasian. Indeed, the parent is illustrated as such.

The illustration is suggesting that the children who are subject to kidnapping from Japan are kidnapped by their Caucasian parent. That is, that the evil parents who do the kidnapping are Caucasian.

What about the children of, for example, Filipino-Japan International marriages kidnapped by their Filipino parent?

Why are the Caucasian evil parents represented by this illustration, and the evil Filipino parents not?


One of these leads to "Wagyl is nuts," the other leads to "Holy softcream shaped shit, [that's racist]."

Please explain why.

(For the record, I would be hard pressed to suggest either is racist, not even enough to go to my keyboard and draft a stern post to a bulletin board. But I will admit that I have pretty dull receptors for detecting racist activity. It must be an absolute minefield to put these illustrations together for these pamphlets, not wanting to offend anybody.

I read an interesting comment about Doctor Debito the other day: I think it was on a site other than this one, but paraphrasing because I didn't pay attention to where it was or how to find it again, it was suggesting that taking up an activist fight in relation to every little slight, be it empty seats next to you on the train and comments on your chopstick prowess to excessive blond big-nosed illustrations, can lead to audience fatigue where people stop paying you attention because so much of it is about stuff which doesn't matter and you become an irrelevance. And then when an important issue does arise your comments are no longer taken seriously. He fights and moans about every little thing, so who knows whether the issue du jour is big or small, the assumption comes to be that it is small and can be ignored. I start to wonder if this particular battle is one of those which should be bypassed, waiting for an issue which really matters. Opinions may vary on the importance of this issue, of course.)

So Yoko pretty much hit the nail on the head but as far as the US being only a white country, that's a joke, right? Maybe because I grew up there my view s different but as I always say, the place is mixed.

That'sa besides the point though. The child pictured doesn't look like he has any Caucasian ancestry at all but it's really nothing more than a depiction of a suffering child. There are no evil beatings, exclusions etc. depictions at all? It's suggesting the child is suffering, that's it.

[Samurai_Jerk]

We can agree that the US is majority white?

as far as the US being only a white country, that's a joke, right?

Did you not read what you quoted?

[6810]

Holy softcream shaped shit...that's pretty fucking bad.

Well it doesn't, in my opinion, square very well with this view from 6810 the other day:

"Though some people on this board may come from nations where anti-discrimination laws and related penalties are more explcitly coded and/or tested, it is my (uninformed) assumption that many of these people have yet to actively utilise these social and legal frameworks in thier "home countries". It is the same in Japan. This type of framework is slowly being encoded within specific cultural conditions - it's early days and early, high profile, over-represented failures represent a moment in time. Repeated testing is required and given the small proportion of the overall population, their linguistic ability etc - this testing is going to take a while. Doesn't necessarily = instant fail though."

Yeah, I still stand by what I said. New official civic members of Japan (recently naturalised) and long term residents have still got a long way to go toward actively making their voices be heard.

I mean, it's one thing to snark and snipe on a gaijin board like FG - "look at dem Japs get it wrong, racist asshats etc" but it's another to actively get involved in this melee.

After all, pamphlets like this are being produced on the smell of oily rags of assumption. The loudest voices among all this Hague ratification nonsense have been to date hysterical monolingual gaijin from failed relationships trying to kidnap their "own" kids in order to "save them" from Japan etc (and other white trash, cognitive trash). These voices are then amplified by gaijins with grudges (tm) aka debito et al who grow a relatively tiny, hyper minority position into something supposedly representative of national character. This is further amplified by douchebag pseudo journalists trying to make a living just parroting what seems verifiable on the net.

But what strikes me as interesting is that there seems to be a relatively large number of gaijin voices here and elsewhere, with no stakes in this event. Gaijin without local spouses, gaijin on contract who can exit at any time, gaijin without children who are arguing on some assumed superior objective ethical code that states "Hey, the locals, who are essentially still fairly parochial and new to this whole "international" game, fucked up (cos they're a bunch of ojisans with minimal life experience in the relevant areas, working for city hall/whatever branch of govt) not aware with their legal advice pamphlets and are therefore sinister racist asswads.

The reality is that you and I, all of us as residents in Japan have voices in this. Japanese are notoriously accountable, even when faking it. Paper trails are important, lists of people responsible for the production of public documents are available. As much as I think Debito is an all round asshole douchebag, his one smart choice advice to wannabe activists has always been "Well, call the dept responsible, make a complaint yourself". Right on.

Got a problem with this old news? Take it up with the agency responsible for its production. Make it known in quantifiable and concrete terms why it is wrong. Can't do it? Seek others, peers to help you make a case. Be the face of change.

Sure as fuck beats anonymous chest beating and circle jerking on lame-ass, once "great" (well, known...) but currently long past dying gaijin obsolete social networking platforms (bbs forums) on the internet.

[Wage Slave]

"Hey, the locals, who are essentially still fairly parochial and new to this whole "international" game .....

Hang on. We are talking about MOFA not City Hall. And the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of a large country with a long standing vast share of international trade, more multinationals than you can shake a stick at and vast numbers of its citizens resident or studying in other countries.

They have made their attitude clear. Plenty of people have no doubt complained about it, and no doubt directly to them as well, to little effect thus far. There has been plenty time to say something and do something about it and it speaks volumes that they haven't seen any need.

As for me, well like you - I'm all right Jack. I wouldn't on that basis dismiss everyone who isn't as cretinous, linguistically challenged white trash with relationship problems brought on their own moronic heads. And I suspect many others feel the same way. I haven't said anything remotely adjacent to "racist asswads". What I did say is that it indicates strongly to me that they are acting in bad faith and that is something I dislike and distrust deeply.

[kurogane]

That was certainly a nice over the top rant by 6810, but I do doubt that any of that pamphlet was produced in bad faith as I would define it.

Even most of the ones that have studied abroad still subscribe to at least a weak version of the radically bifurcated oppositional worldview and contentious attitudes I think were amply represented in the pamphlet. In short, they really are still largely a nation of grumbling bumpkins, always ready to feel a slight and take offence. Allowing that it is situational and context specific, I regularly meet I Studied Abroad!!!!!!!!!! types with passable to rather good English and revolting Us vs. You attitudes. Whether it end up positive or negative, relativist or absolutist, it is a professional opinion that most educated Japanese come away from extended intercultural encounters with their stereotypes and prejudices reinforced rather than weakened. And that includes all the gushing We are the World Peace Boat types that wear their International Experience the way you and I might have danced around in sparkling pink panties if it had been acceptable when we were still young enough to pull it off (so to speak). I find the urban and rural bumpkins rather more open minded in their friendly ignorance and plebian liberalism. My diagnosis is that the educational paradigm (learned>experiential) and the added motivation of their status and position as Culture Brokers blend into a perfectly toxic potion of cultural and even racial bigotry that is only reinforced by increased exposure. I enjoy it because it is so elegantly contrarian in essence, and it completely guts all the squishy sanctimonies of the Hands Across the Water Westerners that are still waiting for the Japanese to stop being themselves.

I also think, and this is based on long and affectionate observation, that you (Wage Slave) have carved yourself out a healthy and happy bubble where the crap of which I speak is not as common as it is where I travel. And Yeah! for that, of course.

[Hijinx]

Nice read on the subject:

http://www.worldpolicy.org/blog/2014/05 ... laws-limbo

[kurogane]

Yes. A well researched, badly executed piece: trenchant expert commentary oversauced by the usual sanctimonious condescension about a subject they don't understand and a difference they can't fathom (I assume the latter were the bits you liked ). But at least somebody's battng 500.

[matsuki]

We can agree that the US is majority white?

as far as the US being only a white country, that's a joke, right?

Did you not read what you quoted?

Let me put it another way...

The 2010 United States Census reported that **my hometown** had a population of 55,544. The population density was 3,731.5 people per square mile (1,440.8/km²). The racial makeup of **my hometown** was: 29,144 (52.5%) Asian; 18,434 (33.2%) White (21.3% Non-Hispanic White), 2,288 (4.1%) African American; 178 (0.3%) Native American; 106 (0.2%) Pacific Islander; 3,237 (5.8%) from other races; and 2,157 (3.9%) from two or more races. Hispanic or Latino of any race were 11,138 persons (20.1%).

Where I grew up in the US, I didn't know hardly any "white" people. There were plenty of "white looking" people (myself included) that were of mixed ancestry and spoke a different language at home or celebrated a different culture than mainstream America. Even the census, above, tries to separate "white" from "non-hispanic white." At some point, it just gets really silly. How do you define how white someone is? Anyhow, my point is, I grew up with people who's parents were from all over the globe...so when I see the picture of that kid on the pamphlet, I don't automatically assume he's foreign, has foreign born parents, etc. I don't see anything insidious about it or racist about it at all. Now if there were cartoons of only black/white/yellow/red/etc. people beating children, berating people for being different, or stealing children away, I'd be just as offended as I am by that MOFA pamphlet. (and yes, I read the inside...) Say we give them the benefit of the doubt and it was totally unintentional, just innocentbrain dead robotic workers using the stereotypes and kool-aid they grew up with, totally unaware that it might be found offensive or viewed as one sided. Fine...so the the issue isn't intent but a really skewed education/media/etc? Either way, the lack of embarrassment or realization that something like that is offensive is the real kicker.

[wagyl]

Using the same statistical base, the 2010 US Census, of a population of 308,745,538, the sum of 223,553,265, a proportion of 72.4%, self-identified as white. I was going to say that that is a larger proportion than the proportion of eligible voters who turned out to vote in the last Presidential election, but with only 58.2% turn out that is nothing to crow about.

Maybe more interesting is that only 9.009,073 identified as multiracial. That's only 2.9%. I suspect that a lot of those people who claim to be descended from a "Cherokee princess" call themselves white on the forms.

[wagyl]

it's really nothing more than a depiction of a suffering child.

The kid looks pretty damn happy to me, actually. I suppose there are few stock photos for "distressed ethnic child."

[Wage Slave]

A wide range of people will choose white on those forms. An adult education service I worked for once was always getting into trouble for the fact ethnic minorities appeared to be underserved. The reason was we had a large number of middle eastern students and they all answered white to that question. And who am I to argue? It's a pretty meaningless term as are the other colour based ethnic categories.

Cue Kurogane guidance .......

[Wage Slave]

it's really nothing more than a depiction of a suffering child.

The kid looks pretty damn happy to me, actually. I suppose there are few stock photos for "distressed ethnic child."

It's just an image of a child FFS. The intention is just to try and remind people that the convention is supposed to be about the best interests of children.

[Wage Slave]

Yes. A well researched, badly executed piece: trenchant expert commentary oversauced by the usual sanctimonious condescension about a subject they don't understand and a difference they can't fathom (I assume the latter were the bits you liked ). But at least somebody's battng 500.

She's wrong about being married and having different names though. It's not a problem in the slightest.

[Hijinx]

She's wrong about being married and having different names though. It's not a problem in the slightest.

For Japanese married to Japanese?

[Wage Slave]

She's wrong about being married and having different names though. It's not a problem in the slightest.

For Japanese married to Japanese?

I don't know but if we can do it .......perhaps Havill will be along to advise.

[Doctor Stop]

For Japanese married to Japanese?

Remember that her article is about international child abduction.

[Hijinx]

Remember that her article is about international child abduction.

But the point she was making related to Japan's parochial system. Basically, Japan's signing of the Hague thingy is the proverbial cart before the horse, and the separate name example is just one facet of this. Though, when reading the Wiki entry, it does seems as though it is possible in certain circumstances for a Japanese couple, and the author of the article is not entirely correct.

"It's a rule in principle that the two shall have the family name in common following their marriage. However, if one of them is a non-Japanese, this rule does not apply."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_law_in_Japan