Is this guy just bitter or I have totally missed something?

[Fritz1]

I am engaged in a heated battle on another website forum. A guy was thinking about moving from Bangkok to either Japan or Korea and wanted some advice. I gave him some since I have taught in both Korea and Japan. Another poster has contradicted a lot of what I said and is in my opinion giving people a wrong impression of the situation in Japan.

Here is a sample of my advice (A) and his (B).


Did I have an unusually good time in Japan or is the guy out to lunch?


A

250,000 yen
25 hours a week and some office hours
national health insurance - paid by the teacher
50,000 yen for an apartment all arranged by the school (no deposit etc) paid by the teacher


B
Don't forget the $5000 initial "gift" money to pay the landlord (and never get back!) just to thank him for letting you move in. Don't forget the $800 "permission to have a phone line" fee you pay the government phone monopoly if you want a real phone line.

A
As for the "$5000 initial gift money" "$800 telephone lines" that only applies if you getting an apartment on your own. Since 99% of English schools have apartments for full time teachers (and the schools have paid the gift money, telephone money long ago) why would anyone go solo???

B
None of the 6 or so different places I worked for there over the years ever had accommodation. The ones that had accommodation tended to be the places where they were recruiting suckers from overseas for low salaries.
[In Bangkok as opposed to Japan] I don't live in a tiny little rabbit hutch sharing a bathroom with 10 other people (for $400 a month!)

A
Places like Kanazawa, Matsumoto, Fukuoka etc are not the boonies (pop. 200,000-1,000,000 and are much much better in every way that Tokyo, Osaka etc. (in my not so humble opinion obviously)

B
I knew folks who worked out in the country [Kanazawa, Matsumoto, Fukuoka etc] under just the conditions you described, who were miserable.

A
I don't think living in Fukuoka ... is "the country" - a subway system, an international airport, over 1,000,000 people. Neither are any of the other places I mentioned. They all have gaijin bars and a good sized expat community. If you don't believe me, pick up a copy of the Lonely Planet and check them out for yourself.



B
None of the 6 or so different places I worked for there over the years ever had accommodation.

A
Well, if you were willing to accept a job that didn't have accomodation that is frankly your own fault. When I was looking for my second job I checked a lot of places out and I don't remember any (although it is possible) that didn't have an apartment.



The last post was:


"Perhaps it is because no one mentions [the $5000 apartment and the $800 telephone] it enough to the bright young things thinking of going.... "

I would think by now you would have realized that not many people are going to buy your $5000 apartment story but you seem to persist.

So if people went over there and found out they had to shell out $5000 for a room what would happen? 99% of the people would head straight home. Why? 1. 99% of the people that go over do not have that kind of cash on them and 2. Shelling out that kind of cash up front would be really stupid.

If schools forced teachers to do something like that they you would end up with a situation like Korea where, for example, the U.S. Embassy has actually posted a warning it citizens NOT to work there.


"The job listings I looked at in-country had very few accomodations listed"

As I said before the VAST majority of job listings on the internet have accomodation provided. HAVE A LOOK. I have spent an ungodly amount of time checking out the jobs posted because I had two friends come to Japan and they asked me to give them a hand looking a job. They both ended up getting jobs from schools that posted on the internet. They school owners were in both cases happy to have people applying in country because they could interview them. And YES, accomodation was provided.


"The internet may admittedly have changed some things"

When were you there? Before or after Sputnik?
If you have not been in Japan in ages you should have said so in your first post and let everyone know that your info was out of date.


"Perhaps since you got your job outside they focussed on it a little more."

Nope. The school I worked at hired in and out of country and everyone got the same deal.


"I got all my jobs through personal connections"

-You didn't get an apartment with any of your jobs
-You had to fork over $5000 grand for an apartment
-You had a bunch of crappy jobs where you got transferred all over the place
Frankly your connections suck.

"getting a job outside of a country IS a suckerish thing to do in general, because you do not know the conditions on the ground if you haven't been.

Of course it is a risk. As I mentioned before though, the risks in Korea (and Thailand) are much, much higher since there is not that much you can do if you do get screwed. The Korea/Japan debate was the WHOLE POINT of this thread, wasn't it?


"In point of fact, it is also unwise to accept employment with someone who "provides" your accommodations"

Once AGAIN, the chances of anything like that happening in Japan are small. Once again, nobody I know has had any such problems. My boss in my last job actually owned the apartment building I stayed in (which was why it was so cheap). In three and half years, how many uninvited visits did I have? Zero

The vast majority of teachers in Japan are working legally (esp compared to Thailand, Korea) because Japanese immigration is so tough. One three month tourist visa, no extentions. No visa runs over the border - there is none!!


"If you really want to be comfortable there, it'll take a decade or so."


"Fukuoka IS country-town by Japanese standards, fella. It's funny enough that you said friggin' KANAZAWA is a happening place!"

I will repeat again, in case you did not get it the first time.
Fukuoka has a subway system, an international airport and a huge expat community and a poulation of over 1,000,000. That is NOT THE COUNTRY by anyone's standards.

I did not say Kanazawa is "a happening place" - whatever that means. I did say it is a great place. 500,000 people, no pollution, no traffic jams, lot of gaijin. Not to mention the fact that there is a castle IN THE CITY. Japan has three famous gardens which they consider to be the most beautiful in the entire country. One of them happens to be where? Kanazawa. Where is the best seafood in all of Japan? The answer is Ishikawa prefecture. The capital of Ishikawa prefecture is .... Kanazawa. There are three places in Japan that are famous for the beautiful women. Kyoto, Tokuku and.... the Kanazawa area. CHECK THE LONELY PLANET AND SEE WHAT IT HAS TO SAY!!!!!


"the Japanese teachers are making twice your salary (plus bonuses) for basically the same work"

I assume you are talking about public school teachers. If they are getting twice as much, they frankly deserve it. They are most definitely NOT doing the same work. Teaching ESL is very, very easy. Zero responsibility, short hours, no PTA/school board crap to deal with. I would not have done it for double my salary

I realize my posts are not exactly brimming with positive emotions towards you but misinformation/bitterness in your posts are a big turn off.

Fritz