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  • fuckedgaijin ‹ General ‹ F*cked News

My Number

Odd news from Japan and all things Japanese around the world.
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My Number

Postby Yokohammer » Fri Sep 04, 2015 4:28 pm

Japan's take on social security numbers, with the cutesy "My Number" title, is almost upon us. We will all be issued numbers as of October this year, and the system will begin administrative operation from January 2016. Legislation has just gone through to allow our "My Numbers" to be linked to our bank accounts, voluntarily initially, but it looks like it will eventually become mandatory.

Reactions range from "what's the big deal?" to "this is an outrage!"

What's yours?

My Number law revised, IDs to be linked to bank accounts from 2018

The Diet passed a bill Thursday to expand the use of a personal identification number to improve tax collection, despite ongoing concerns over the potential leak of private information and identity theft.

Under changes to the so-called My Number system, personal ID numbers can be linked to people’s bank account numbers from 2018. Although such links will be made initially on a voluntary basis, the government is considering making it mandatory from 2021.

The amendment will make it easier for the government to discover tax evasion or welfare benefits fraud by having better access to information on people’s assets.

...

More at the link.
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Re: My Number

Postby Coligny » Fri Sep 04, 2015 4:49 pm

image.jpg


Whars mah Lotus 7 ?
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Re: My Number

Postby wuchan » Fri Sep 04, 2015 5:37 pm

I wonder if my boss will pay me in cash....
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Re: My Number

Postby matsuki » Fri Sep 04, 2015 6:40 pm

In the world of inkan/jitsu-in/hankko, it's definitely a move in the right direction...but I do share in the fear that once they have collected all they can on you and put all that info about you into a nice package...identity fraud will become a bigger issue than it is now unless there are decent security measures that come with it.
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Re: My Number

Postby yanpa » Fri Sep 04, 2015 6:45 pm

Just have it tattooed on your upper arm.
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Re: My Number

Postby Salty » Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:03 pm

What I don`t understand is what is `voluntary`. Is it voluntary from the individual bank account owner`s perspective, or is it voluntary for the banks – giving them time to implement the software changes before it becomes mandatory?

As for linking to bank accounts – it has already been suggested that people with adequate financial holdings should be dropped from receiving pension payouts – which linking to bank accounts might facilitate. I haven`t heard of linking to capital investments, but surely that too will come.

I`m not too concerned over privacy.

I would like to see how many public employees are to be let go, given the administrative `savings` that are spoken of in justification.
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Re: My Number

Postby wagyl » Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:04 pm

matsuki wrote:In the world of inkan/jitsu-in/hankko, it's definitely a move in the right direction.

Please explain. Why and how is this good direction?

matsuki wrote:... unless ...

You have been here how many years now, and you still use this word???
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Re: My Number

Postby wuchan » Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:10 pm

I think it's more about getting people that don't pay nenkin. Instead of sending notices in the mail that people ignore, now all they will need to do is push a few buttons and send a thank you letter in the mail.

I see the government abusing the shit out of this kinda like the American cops abuse the civil forfeiture laws in the US.
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Re: My Number

Postby Salty » Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:12 pm

Is identity fraud a serious issue in Japan? I think not – given that the registration system is in place, and copies are required for most `new relationships` (bank accounts, credit cards, etc.). If this new number somehow replaces the current methods of official identification, then maybe.
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Re: My Number

Postby Salty » Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:15 pm

wuchan wrote:I think it's more about getting people that don't pay nenkin. Instead of sending notices in the mail that people ignore, now all they will need to do is push a few buttons and send a thank you letter in the mail.

I see the government abusing the shit out of this kinda like the American cops abuse the civil forfeiture laws in the US.


There are people who don`t pay nenkin? Who knew? IMO - that would be a ligetimate use, and for NHI too.
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Re: My Number

Postby matsuki » Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:27 pm

wagyl wrote:
matsuki wrote:In the world of inkan/jitsu-in/hankko, it's definitely a move in the right direction.

Please explain. Why and how is this good direction?


I'm thinking of legit uses...like the nenkin/NHI already mentioned. Would also be good to have a form of gov. ID to base credit scores and the likes off of rather than using ones name, address and how many years one has resided there. Even better if they don't segregate FG numbers by using some FG specific prefix or whatever.
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Re: My Number

Postby wagyl » Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:47 pm

matsuki wrote:
wagyl wrote:
matsuki wrote:In the world of inkan/jitsu-in/hankko, it's definitely a move in the right direction.

Please explain. Why and how is this good direction?


I'm thinking of legit uses...like the nenkin/NHI already mentioned. Would also be good to have a form of gov. ID to base credit scores and the likes off of rather than using ones name, address and how many years one has resided there. Even better if they don't segregate FG numbers by using some FG specific prefix or whatever.

You still haven't convinced me as to why linking pension and health insurance* is a good thing: both already have a number connected to each account. Or are you admitting that the system they have used for more than fifty years has been a failure all that time? And what convinces you that changing the number related to each account will suddenly make the system right?

* ..and tax, and employment, and access to credit, and perhaps exit and entry from the country, driving record, ...
and all of this is a long way away from identifying bank account holders based on a carved piece of wood, bone or stone
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Re: My Number

Postby Russell » Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:50 pm

It may be difficult to force banks abroad to use these "my number"s.

Wait for a lot of Japanese to open their accounts offshore...
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Re: My Number

Postby Coligny » Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:51 pm

Salty wrote:
As for linking to bank accounts – it has already been suggested that people with adequate financial holdings should be dropped from receiving pension payouts – which linking to bank accounts might facilitate. I haven`t heard of linking to capital investments, but surely that too will come.
.


BRILLIANT !!!

Pay for the plebes, get nothing in return...
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Re: My Number

Postby Salty » Fri Sep 04, 2015 8:12 pm

Coligny wrote:
Salty wrote:
As for linking to bank accounts – it has already been suggested that people with adequate financial holdings should be dropped from receiving pension payouts – which linking to bank accounts might facilitate. I haven`t heard of linking to capital investments, but surely that too will come.
.


BRILLIANT !!!

Pay for the plebes, get nothing in return...


Well, maybe there is something in return... like lower Nenkin taxes, and maybe fewer unwashed homeless people on the sidewalks to walk around on our commute.... and of course pride in recognition that you made it while many didn`t. (small potatoes...)
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Re: My Number

Postby legion » Fri Sep 04, 2015 9:18 pm

matsuki wrote:
wagyl wrote:
matsuki wrote:In the world of inkan/jitsu-in/hankko, it's definitely a move in the right direction.

Please explain. Why and how is this good direction?


I'm thinking of legit uses...like the nenkin/NHI already mentioned. Would also be good to have a form of gov. ID to base credit scores and the likes off of rather than using ones name, address and how many years one has resided there. Even better if they don't segregate FG numbers by using some FG specific prefix or whatever.


The number is independent of your FG status.

The my number card will be issued if you want one, and carrying it initially will be voluntary, but we all know where this is going. The Japanese controllers have been trying to bring in ID numbers for years, the populace resist this, this is a new angle. I predict an upsurge in bicycle checks and cops asking for "my number" ID in 3-4 years time.

I think the primary driver behind this are large faceless companies that handle data and bureaucrats approaching retirement.
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Re: My Number

Postby Russell » Fri Sep 04, 2015 10:13 pm

legion wrote:
matsuki wrote:
wagyl wrote:
matsuki wrote:In the world of inkan/jitsu-in/hankko, it's definitely a move in the right direction.

Please explain. Why and how is this good direction?


I'm thinking of legit uses...like the nenkin/NHI already mentioned. Would also be good to have a form of gov. ID to base credit scores and the likes off of rather than using ones name, address and how many years one has resided there. Even better if they don't segregate FG numbers by using some FG specific prefix or whatever.


The number is independent of your FG status.

The my number card will be issued if you want one, and carrying it initially will be voluntary, but we all know where this is going. The Japanese controllers have been trying to bring in ID numbers for years, the populace resist this, this is a new angle. I predict an upsurge in bicycle checks and cops asking for "my number" ID in 3-4 years time.

I think the primary driver behind this are large faceless companies that handle data and bureaucrats approaching retirement.

Maybe they will unify the "my number" card and the gaijin card?
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Re: My Number

Postby Yokohammer » Fri Sep 04, 2015 10:49 pm

Russell wrote:Maybe they will unify the "my number" card and the gaijin card?

Of course not. That makes too much sense.

I'm still undecided as to where I stand on this issue. It seems like a reasonable idea, but the potential for abuse and "accidents" is high. And then there's the usual government (especially Abe's admin.) SOP of saying one thing and turning right around and doing the other. My trust in government and bureaucracy in general, not limited to Japan's, is at an all-time low right around now. Lies, lies, and more lies, topped off with a liberal sprinkling of bullshit. Not to mention the poor security record that others have pointed out.

Whatever ... it's going to happen so the only option is to go along with it. I just hope it is administered properly.
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Re: My Number

Postby Coligny » Fri Sep 04, 2015 11:30 pm

Salty wrote:
Coligny wrote:
Salty wrote:
As for linking to bank accounts – it has already been suggested that people with adequate financial holdings should be dropped from receiving pension payouts – which linking to bank accounts might facilitate. I haven`t heard of linking to capital investments, but surely that too will come.
.


BRILLIANT !!!

Pay for the plebes, get nothing in return...


Well, maybe there is something in return... like lower Nenkin taxes, and maybe fewer unwashed homeless people on the sidewalks to walk around on our commute.... and of course pride in recognition that you made it while many didn`t. (small potatoes...)


Why not something even more rewarding:
image.jpg


What you propose is a feudal casts system... I don't really care. But at least forbid alcohol and tobacco to the subhumans. It affect their productivity.
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Re: My Number

Postby Salty » Sat Sep 05, 2015 6:49 am

Just wait for the numerologists to get involved and dream up ways to discriminate based upon your number. :cool2:
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Re: My Number

Postby Russell » Sat Sep 05, 2015 9:42 am

Salty wrote:Just wait for the numerologists to get involved and dream up ways to discriminate based upon your number. :cool2:

You mean all subhuman's numbers will start with "94"?
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Re: My Number

Postby matsuki » Sat Sep 05, 2015 10:03 am

Wags, at the end of the day, Yoko sums up my overall feelings on this:

Yokohammer wrote:it's going to happen so the only option is to go along with it. I just hope it is administered properly.
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Re: My Number

Postby wagyl » Sat Sep 05, 2015 11:16 am

matsuki wrote:Wags, at the end of the day, Yoko sums up my overall feelings on this:

Yokohammer wrote:it's going to happen so the only option is to go along with it. I just hope it is administered properly.

OK. There just seemed to be a long distance between that sentiment and
matsuki wrote:it's definitely a move in the right direction.
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Re: My Number

Postby matsuki » Sat Sep 05, 2015 12:10 pm

wagyl wrote:OK. There just seemed to be a long distance between that sentiment and
matsuki wrote:it's definitely a move in the right direction.


Let's just call that the gap between hope and reality.
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Re: My Number

Postby chibaka » Sun Sep 06, 2015 7:55 am

I know what this "my number" is supposed to achieve, it's similar to the UK's NHI number..... I think. So what was the other number I received a couple of years ago all about? Apart from Abe's SS keeping track of aliens that is. Think it was an FG number...
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Re: My Number

Postby Coligny » Sun Sep 06, 2015 9:20 am

chibaka wrote:I know what this "my number" is supposed to achieve, it's similar to the UK's NHI number..... I think. So what was the other number I received a couple of years ago all about? Apart from Abe's SS keeping track of aliens that is. Think it was an FG number...

Isn't that what happens when the left hand don't know what the right hand is doing ?
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Re: My Number

Postby chibaka » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:29 pm

Coligny wrote:Isn't that what happens when the left hand don't know what the right hand is doing ?


Well the FG number has been filed away, never to be seen since.... hence the question, what the feck is it for? Which number will be used to really calculate the population of Japan? Or, as we FG will have two numbers, pen pushers at the ministry of unnecessary jobs will count us twice and shit the bed thinking an invasion has started?
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Re: My Number

Postby Salty » Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:20 pm

Did I just hear an LDP news item correctly – that there is a proposal to use the My Number card to track purchases so that you can qualify for a consumption tax rebate at end of year? Now that would be really neat – at every purchase, give the government access to your shopping list. Purely innocent for sure right? I mean, what evil could possibly come from that? :wink:
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Re: My Number

Postby Wage Slave » Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:34 pm

Salty wrote:I mean, what evil could possibly come from that? :wink:


To be honest - in the case of my shopping - slightly less than zero. Isn't this rebate for purchases of food and clothing? I am fairly sure we will be availing ourselves of the rebate if we can and if it means getting and presenting a My Number card then so be it. I'll take the money Brian.
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Re: My Number

Postby Russell » Tue Sep 08, 2015 5:02 pm

Wage Slave wrote:
Salty wrote:I mean, what evil could possibly come from that? :wink:


To be honest - in the case of my shopping - slightly less than zero. Isn't this rebate for purchases of food and clothing? I am fairly sure we will be availing ourselves of the rebate if we can and if it means getting and presenting a My Number card then so be it. I'll take the money Brian.

It is meant for low income people, who will get their rebates once the consumption tax goes up again.

I think if you do not want to be tracked you are free to make your purchases "my number"-free.
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