thoughts after a return visit

[privileged]

I lived in Tokyo for over 6 years, moved back to the States, and visited for the first time in around 4 years.

I don’t think I have any groundbreaking insight, just want to blab.

The main difference to me is that Tokyo is such a walking city. It was refreshing to me that even my foreign buddies who lived there before and after me, first suggestion: let’s go for a walk.

The city is so dense and endlessly interesting. You can always take a different path and see something new. I noticed in both residential areas as well as urban centers there are benches, blocks, or some places for people to sit on the sidewalks.

For simplicity and/or clarity I live in Chicago now. And walking here just sucks. The whole city is designed for you NOT to be walking. Streets here have parked cars on either side, an imaginary bike lane, and 2 way traffic. You’re passing sad stores, empty lots, chain link fences, garbage, etc. There is never anywhere to sit. God forbid you need to take a whiz; end of the world.

Tokyo is just such a vibrant, lively, healthy city. Everyone knows public transport is great there but the effects of it are twofold. It’s not like it’s just an option; because it’s so great all those people don’t have cars and are walking, so the streets are full of way more people and way less cars. Most of those residential neighborhoods have tiny shops and restaurants below, next to, or nicely worked into the living spaces in the neighborhood. Plus so many tiny parks scattered here and there. It is really beautiful.

If there was one thing I missed about the States it would be the temperature. I do not miss being uncomfortable for months at a time in Tokyo. When I lived there I cranked the AC and welcomed the priciest electric bill possible. Even entering an air-conditioned restaurant in Tokyo, it’s cooler than outside, but it’s just a slight relief, not the pure heavenly lack of humidity and truly COOL air I so deeply crave…

Anyway between the density of the city and the quality of public transport, daily life in Tokyo is nearly inexpressible to people back home. It is so god damned pleasant to walk a station over, grab a combini beer, sit in a park, drink it slowly, and have a mellow, pleasant time, chatting and people-watching, in a safe, lively but not loud or obnoxious environment. Want another beer? Get up and take a walk, it’s certainly sold for a few hundred yen within a few minutes. There is nothing like that in the States that I know of and certainly not in Chicago.

Here you go to a bar, which is LOUD and EXPENSIVE, or you grab a 6 pack and go to a friend’s house. It’s just not as good. Nothing is walking distance so you probably get a cab there (if you’re at all responsible) and if you miscalculated the alcohol, that’s an issue, then cab home. So no wonder it’s a pain in the ass to get a drink or two on a weeknight; it’s a $30-$40 procedure no matter how you look at it — and that’s just for a couple drinks! Not dinner.

Perhaps oddly, I was glad I did NOT immediately wish I actually still lived in Tokyo. I like my (comparatively) big aparment and ridiculously big (relatively) kitchen with giant fridge, oven, real living room, big bedroom, etc. And oh God, central A/C. If I were ever gay for anything it would be central A/C.

I still don’t think I’ve explained it right and maybe I never will. And maybe that’s why I never get sick of reading and thinking about it. Until you’ve missed the train and realized it’s a nice night and there’s no reason you can’t take the 1-2 hour walk home and grab a beer or two on the way, knowing NO ONE, period, will give you any grief and the walk in fact might be nice… well, that will never happen in Chicago. There is just nothing like it. There is a lot to be said for a city as amazing as Tokyo. I’m happy I got to live there and will always appreciate any opportunity to visit.

As a final note, I feel like there is just this sad trend in Chicago to monetize everything as quickly and brutally as possible. About a year after I moved back I was in my apartment and heard a band playing outside. (There is a kind of public square near my place but it sucks ass compared to any neighborhood park in Tokyo.) I walked out and it was flooded with hipsters, facial hair, PBR (cheap beer), and weed. (The band was called “Bongripper” fwiw.) I didn’t love any particular aspect of that but I found the general concept refreshing.

Next year? That city square was fenced off with a Bud Light trailer parked out front; $5 suggested “donation” to get in. They searched your bags and there were plenty of stalls selling overpriced food and drinks inside.

I mean, give it a rest.

Streets, parks, festivals in Tokyo still seem much more open and freer. Yes they have stalls selling shit but it’s not as obnoxious and you can grab a combini beer and walk around and have a good time without feeling a constant suck on your wallet.

Tips for Chicago: lose the guns, improve public transport, allow public drinking.

[Salty]

[Samurai_Jerk]

Yes, I'm sure Chicago would be a much safer and more pleasant city if they'd allow public drinking.

[kurogane]

There is a lot to be said for a city as amazing as Tokyo.............. Tokyo is just such a vibrant, lively, healthy city. ...............It is really beautiful.

I have never, ever thought of Tokyo as physically beautiful, but it's nice that somebody does. I do enjoy it, and agree it's great fun, though, and lots of my Stuff White People Like type Sooshi/Sakee friends rave about it. And I have heard that Chicago is pretty crap in most ways. I liked your points about the general cost of living. It is absolutely murder to convince almost anybody that life in Tokyo costs barely $0.60 on the dollar compared to anywhere in North America worth living, never mind a nice place in Europistan.

Tips for Chicago: lose the guns, improve public transport, allow public drinking.

Nice on the first 2, and I heartily second the last one. That should help open up quite a few spots for needy Syrians, and it will finally allow the authorities to formalise the hunting season for minority males

Seriously, though: allowing public drinking in North America is a no fly zone. The usual Puritans aside, it's simply too late. Streets would become an impassable mess of drunken, raging stooges flooded by their vomit and piss. The prohibition mindset is simply too ingrained, and the inability of even halfway decent people to just obey the rules would make a mockery of the idea of responsible behaviour. It works in Japan because they are so much more properly individualistic than North Americans and just have a longer history of doing it.

[matsuki]

As a final note, I feel like there is just this sad trend in Chicago to monetize everything as quickly and brutally as possible. About a year after I moved back I was in my apartment and heard a band playing outside. (There is a kind of public square near my place but it sucks ass compared to any neighborhood park in Tokyo.) I walked out and it was flooded with hipsters, facial hair, PBR (cheap beer), and weed. (The band was called “Bongripper” fwiw.) I didn’t love any particular aspect of that but I found the general concept refreshing.

Next year? That city square was fenced off with a Bud Light trailer parked out front; $5 suggested “donation” to get in. They searched your bags and there were plenty of stalls selling overpriced food and drinks inside.

I mean, give it a rest.

Streets, parks, festivals in Tokyo still seem much more open and freer. Yes they have stalls selling shit but it’s not as obnoxious and you can grab a combini beer and walk around and have a good time without feeling a constant suck on your wallet.

I just took two J-girls to the LA-county fair...everything is as monetized (expensive) as you mention but they fucking loved every bit of it. (and it's fucking massive) Not that I have anything against the usual matsuri in Japan....but holy shit, if there ever was a "gap" in culture....

[wagyl]

I find it fascinating that the one change everyone says "Nope, can't be done" is the public drinking, rather than the banning firearms. Not my country, not my culture, but my impression is that banning firearms would be harder.

Matsuki, I have no idea what you are trying to say there. Are you saying that you enjoyed going to the county fair because it reminded you of your younger days, and you don't have that nostalgia for matsuri, and your guests enjoyed it because it was a new experience for them, or are you saying something more than that?

[Salty]

I find it fascinating that the one change everyone says "Nope, can't be done" is the public drinking, rather than the banning firearms. Not my country, not my culture, but my impression is that banning firearms would be harder.

Matsuki, I have no idea what you are trying to say there. Are you saying that you enjoyed going to the county fair because it reminded you of your younger days, and you don't have that nostalgia for matsuri, and your guests enjoyed it because it was a new experience for them, or are you saying something more than that?

I thought that he was saying that his rugrats enjoyed the experience....

[Samurai_Jerk]

I find it fascinating that the one change everyone says "Nope, can't be done" is the public drinking, rather than the banning firearms. Not my country, not my culture, but my impression is that banning firearms would be harder.

Matsuki, I have no idea what you are trying to say there. Are you saying that you enjoyed going to the county fair because it reminded you of your younger days, and you don't have that nostalgia for matsuri, and your guests enjoyed it because it was a new experience for them, or are you saying something more than that?

I think it's best to just give up on trying to understand him.

[Takechanpoo]

most of "tokyoties" live in the suburban area of tokyo. prefab-hut-like small, thin and crappy houses are crammed crawdedly here and there. pathetically its even smaller and crappier than the ones their parents generation built. and most of them are low-payed workers and everyday buy and eat cheap stuffs and ingredients in also crappy franchise chain stores which are placed at even intervals in the colorless scernery.
its a real "tokyoties" life
if you think the same things about the suburb, come back to japan. if not, shut the fuk up, dont vomit that bullshits any more, just stay away from this country and erase the whole japan things from your memory circuit.

[Salty]

Well said....

[matsuki]

I find it fascinating that the one change everyone says "Nope, can't be done" is the public drinking, rather than the banning firearms. Not my country, not my culture, but my impression is that banning firearms would be harder.

Matsuki, I have no idea what you are trying to say there. Are you saying that you enjoyed going to the county fair because it reminded you of your younger days, and you don't have that nostalgia for matsuri, and your guests enjoyed it because it was a new experience for them, or are you saying something more than that?

I thought that he was saying that his rugrats enjoyed the experience....

THIS

Basically, the monetized. cheesy mass of carnies and fried everything was one of their favorite things they experienced here. (wasn't a knock on matsuri...just pointing out it's got a different charm....one that I do enjoy)

[wagyl]

I find it fascinating that the one change everyone says "Nope, can't be done" is the public drinking, rather than the banning firearms. Not my country, not my culture, but my impression is that banning firearms would be harder.

Matsuki, I have no idea what you are trying to say there. Are you saying that you enjoyed going to the county fair because it reminded you of your younger days, and you don't have that nostalgia for matsuri, and your guests enjoyed it because it was a new experience for them, or are you saying something more than that?

I thought that he was saying that his rugrats enjoyed the experience....

THIS

Basically, the monetized. cheesy mass of carnies and fried everything was one of their favorite things they experienced here. (wasn't a knock on matsuri...just pointing out it's got a different charm....one that I do enjoy)

OK, so you were saying that you enjoyed going to the county fair because it reminded you of your younger days, and you don't have that nostalgia for matsuri, and your guests enjoyed it because it was a new experience for them. Got it. I still don't understand why you added

but holy shit, if there ever was a "gap" in culture....

and what you were trying to say by that but I will let it drop. I was sort of concerned that you were trying to compare LA county fair to the matsuri at Higashi Nakamachi 3-chome Suwa Jinja, when the Agricultural Show at El Burro NM also would fail by comparison to that.

I'm not entirely sure that there is such a gap in culture between fried Philadelphia steak sandwich and the lucky dip that comes with 500 yen takoyaki (where in most cases, no forum administrators were harmed in the preparation of this dish).

[Samurai_Jerk]

I find it fascinating that the one change everyone says "Nope, can't be done" is the public drinking, rather than the banning firearms. Not my country, not my culture, but my impression is that banning firearms would be harder.

Matsuki, I have no idea what you are trying to say there. Are you saying that you enjoyed going to the county fair because it reminded you of your younger days, and you don't have that nostalgia for matsuri, and your guests enjoyed it because it was a new experience for them, or are you saying something more than that?

I thought that he was saying that his rugrats enjoyed the experience....

THIS

Basically, the monetized. cheesy mass of carnies and fried everything was one of their favorite things they experienced here. (wasn't a knock on matsuri...just pointing out it's got a different charm....one that I do enjoy)

OK, so you were saying that you enjoyed going to the county fair because it reminded you of your younger days, and you don't have that nostalgia for matsuri, and your guests enjoyed it because it was a new experience for them. Got it. I still don't understand why you added

Matsuki: master of the non sequitur.

[inflames]

I lived in Chicago for more than 10 years and visit basically every year as still have some relatives there.

My advice is to actually spend some money on an apartment and live near the lake - the entire area from Streeterville up to Lakeview is actually quite nice and completely different to what you're describing, especially near the lake. River North seems OK but when I was young it was a shithole. Still better than the area around Cabrini, which is still a shithole (even though the high rises are long gone). Walking home along the lakefront was never a problem, but I didn't live in a shit area.

[Coligny]

Raaaahhh Cabrini...

[matsuki]

OK, so you were saying that you enjoyed going to the county fair because it reminded you of your younger days, and you don't have that nostalgia for matsuri, and your guests enjoyed it because it was a new experience for them. Got it.

Guests enjoyed the LACF due to the overall size, craziness, fried everything, beer, rides, etc. I was trying to say I enjoy a matsuri just as much as the next guy but they're totally different events that probably shouldn't be compared.

I still don't understand why you added

but holy shit, if there ever was a "gap" in culture....

and what you were trying to say by that but I will let it drop. I was sort of concerned that you were trying to compare LA county fair to the matsuri at Higashi Nakamachi 3-chome Suwa Jinja, when the Agricultural Show at El Burro NM also would fail by comparison to that.

I'm not entirely sure that there is such a gap in culture between fried Philadelphia steak sandwich and the lucky dip that comes with 500 yen takoyaki (where in most cases, no forum administrators were harmed in the preparation of this dish).

Gap in culture...dude...even the largest matsuri I've been to here, despite the people one top of people crowd, was small compared to the LACF. Hell, the LACF has a dedicated "Fairplex" complex, complete with everything from keiba to a drag race strip. It's just fucking massive, overwhelming, and you're blasted with everything from carnies to jacuzzi displays...would take at least a day or two to experience everything. Hell, they're selling "season tickets" for whoever is crazy enough to try eating fried sticks of butter on a daily basis. I took em up on one of the several ski-lift like things to get a layout of it all and counted 5 fucking ferris wheels. There is a massive gap in culture...



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L.A._County_Fair

1 million + attendance

Totally good PR for the Korean attendance:

These grounds were once used as a Wartime Civilian Control Administration assembly center during World War II. Japanese Americans were held here before being sent to internment camps.

[wagyl]

The crowd in that photo look like they are having a great time!

Thanks for confirming that the holy shit gap was because of size, and size alone. In a way it is refreshing to know that I can read what level you are writing on.

I would, however, pay a number of your United States dollars to see an orgy of Ferris Wheels fucking.

[Coligny]

Remind me that even the fair in Verdun had bumper cars and ferry wheel... Roller coaster I'm notvso sure anymoar...

[matsuki]

Thanks for confirming that the holy shit gap was because of size, and size alone.

Cause this all sounds like matsuri?

Since its inception, the Fair has been the link between California’s agriculture industry and the public, providing a community gathering place where people learn about California’s heritage and enjoy traditional Fair food, activities and entertainment. In recent years the fair has moved away from such agricultural heritage by transitioning from livestock competitions for area growers and ranchers to hired petting zoos. In addition to the 13-acre (53,000 m2) Ray Cammack Shows carnival, the Fair has an operational farm, an outdoor miniature garden railroad, California’s Heritage Square historical exhibit and America’s Kids-Education Expo, where school children discover A Day Full of Learning Cleverly Disguised as Fun. The End of Summer Concert Series features 19 nights of first-run musical entertainment and freestyle motocross.

The Fair is operated by the Los Angeles County Fair Association, a not-for-profit 501(c)(5) corporation. The Fair is held each September on 543 acres (2.20 km2) of fairgrounds known as Fairplex (Los Angeles County Fair, hotel and exposition complex). The Fair generates a national economic impact of more than $250 million, roughly the equivalent of hosting a Super Bowl every year.

[wagyl]

It sounds like an Agricultural Show.

I think you had it right when you said

they're totally different events that probably shouldn't be compared.

The sad thing is that you were the one person who did in fact try to make that comparison, and suggested that there was a gap.

Perhaps compare Aichi Expo to LA Country Fair next time.

[Samurai_Jerk]

It sounds like an Agricultural Show.

I think you had it right when you said

they're totally different events that probably shouldn't be compared.

The sad thing is that you were the one person who did in fact try to make that comparison, and suggested that there was a gap.

Perhaps compare Aichi Expo to LA Country Fair next time.

Matsuki is making even less sense than usual.

I've always thought matsuri were best compared to those wacky Catholic festivals where they get drunk, eat street food, parade icons around, and beat each other up.

[matsuki]

Matsuki is making even less sense than usual.

Jetlag

[wagyl]

Matsuki is making even less sense than usual.

Jetlag

combined with too many fried butter fritters.

[privileged]

Not sure what to make of takechanpoo. I don’t log in regularly enough to know the usernames here. You can get an apartment that is clearly in legit Tokyo for 80,000 ish a month. I never got the people who wanted one for 72,000 that was a 25 min walk from the station, or 65,000 or whatever that was an hour out of the city.

To each their own.

I definitely wanted to be in Tokyo and thought it was crazy to fly fully around the world and rearrange my entire life to be CLOSE to the place I wanted to be. Why not just do it right?

I’m not running for office and don’t expect my 3 point program to improve America to be taken all that seriously. BUT I adjusted to being able to walk around with a beer. You can’t be a drunken ass and start random fights. But if I’m walking and sipping a beer instead of cola, otherwise well-behaved? I don’t think police/fine/court involvement is called for. Total BS.

inflames, I would like to live by the lake. My brother has a place down there and it’s fucking awesome. Basically this is a non-issue because his rent is literally 3x mine. If I had the money I’d do it. He has a lot of what I miss in Tokyo, which is just being able to walk to most of what you need. On the downside the area is douchebag central; makes my skin crawl walking around there. Anyway I need to make the money FIRST, then worry about if I want to spend it living downtown.

Cars. Do we need em? Chicago is a real city. I can’t believe they still do the same BS thing they did when I lived here a decade ago. I have been in other cities where they have signs that indicate the stable legality of a parking spot. Not Chicago. Listen to this. You get home, late, after work, tired, look for a spot, find one, check the legality. It’s fine. THEN they TIE A FUCKING SIGN TO A GODDAMNED TREE - I swear to God - saying essentially “surprise, this spot now illegal.”



So if you don’t use your car for a day or two, bam, ticket. The best is when you get back and they’ve taken the sign down so all that’s left is an inexplicable ticket on your car.

Anyway I just remember being surprised when I moved to Tokyo that despite taking a lower salary than my (shitty) job (that I hated) back home I easily found myself with more disposable income in Tokyo. A quick analysis concluded gee, no car payments, no insurance, no gas, no random tickets, plus my train pass is covered by work. Shit adds up FAST!

Oh, and never worry about drunk driving.

I took awhile to adjust to living over there. I frankly missed a lot of the conveniences of life back in the States. Car, dishwasher, clothes dryer, apartment space. I’m now basically doing the same in reverse. I never got over apartment space. Having a nice sized apartment rules. But a dishwasher is just not that great and I still don’t use the dryer and refuse to get a car.

You never get the best of both worlds. I knew as soon as I lived in Tokyo I’d always miss stuff back home and if/when I moved back home I’d always miss stuff in Tokyo. I try to look on the bright side and appreciate the best of what both have to offer and that I was lucky enough to fuck around on the other side of the earth for half a decade for no good reason.

[wagyl]

Received wisdoms:

1. Reaching out for something new means that you have to let go of something old. I know that sounds like a Kung Fu master giving advice to Grasshopper, but it has a core of truth. Availing yourself of the things you do appreciate about Chicago means that some of the things you appreciate about Tokyo are no longer available to you.

2. Whenever you are in one place, you will miss things, and friendships, associated with the other. To stop missing stuff constantly, you require a cognitive adjustment. Tell yourself "I can cope, I can manage, I can thrive in two very different cultures/societies, and there are not that many people here or there who can say that." You are a freaking hero! Not someone constantly pining for the place he is not. You can live in two places, where most people are stuck with just one.

[privileged]

Mainly, those are really kind words, and thanks.

It’s not like I feel trapped here and wish I lived in Tokyo. I’m fine. I do miss it and I’m running my mouth about it. And I enjoy reading the responses.

The talk is the point. I’m not looking to present a problem or take action. I just want to talk to people about living in Japan, so thanks.

[Salty]

Not sure what to make of takechanpoo. ...

Damn - you are a quick study! Most of us don`t know what to make of his posts either.

[Coligny]

Not sure what to make of takechanpoo. ...

Damn - you are a quick study! Most of us don`t know what to make of his posts either.

I vote for human toilet...

[matsuki]

Matsuki is making even less sense than usual.

Jetlag

combined with too many fried butter fritters.

I won't go near that stuff...I tried the fried oreos a few years back and it was far from impressed.

Beer and mutant giant turkey leg FTW

[Coligny]

How do you fry oreos ? Like tonkatsu cutlets ?