Good ISP?

[J.A.F.O]

I'm in the market for new internet service provider. One that preferably doesn't give a damn what I'm doing on the net, although I'm sure that's not much possible anymore. Anyways I'm about to tell my current provider (good deal as it is) to kick rocks. Any suggestions?

[Salty]

I'm in the market for new internet service provider. One that preferably doesn't give a damn what I'm doing on the net, although I'm sure that's not much possible anymore. Anyways I'm about to tell my current provider (good deal as it is) to kick rocks. Any suggestions?

What is it about your current provider that you do not like? I use NTT Hikari, but have no interaction with them outside of the automated monthly debit notification/satement. IMO, nothing to dislike, so long as availability is 100%, which it has been.

[chibaka]

I'm not sure what providers actually do.... In my case my interweb is supplied by AU, via a provider. I used to be supplied by NTT via the same provider. Apart from giving me a mail address, which I don't use, the provider could be cut out of the chain.

Also confusing is that my current AU supply is using the fibre installed by NTT and I'm billed by someone else

[matsuki]

Earlier this year I switched from NTT Hilkari FLETS to J-com cable and got free cable and much faster connection speeds...but recently I've received many a threatening letter, saying my usage is "inconceivable" and they are considering restricting my connection speed.

[Coligny]

How DARE you use what you paid for...

What are you ? A communist ?


Asahi.net for years on NTT ftth. Sometimes the speed is shit these days. It's weird, I think my DNS are a bit wonky too. But sometimes youtube slows to a crawl. To test the line i go fetch a linux source iso. And it goes down faster than could be imagined... Even if i get a version in esoteric language to be half sure it's not from a local cache.

[Samurai_Jerk]

How DARE you use what you paid for...

What are you ? A communist ?

It depends on whether or not there's anything in the fine print warning you to keep your usage under a certain level.

[Coligny]

How DARE you use what you paid for...

What are you ? A communist ?

It depends on whether or not there's anything in the fine print warning you to keep your usage under a certain level.

Also known as bullshit clause.

If usage is the amount transfered by billing period it's utter bullshit. And should be stated numerically.

If usage is the download speed it's also bullshit as it is a technical issue that should be managed at hardware level by the ISP, not the end user.

[wagyl]

As is generally true for any definition of "good" as in "good ISP," to get an answer in any way useful to you you will need to state your location -- not all ISP's have a national footprint -- and also state clearly what it is about your ISP that you think makes it "bad." Otherwise, suggestions made by people here might be "bad" in the same way.

Recognise also that "slow" as in "youtube seems slow" can be because of problems at the server at the other end, and nothing to do with how fat the pipes leading into your house are.

[matsuki]

How DARE you use what you paid for...

What are you ? A communist ?

It depends on whether or not there's anything in the fine print warning you to keep your usage under a certain level.

Also known as bullshit clause.

If usage is the amount transfered by billing period it's utter bullshit. And should be stated numerically.

If usage is the download speed it's also bullshit as it is a technical issue that should be managed at hardware level by the ISP, not the end user.

The letters are actually in English (damn offenders must all be gaijin eh?) and say something along the lines of they are "considering limiting my uploading data transfer" if I don't "check" or "lower the level" of uploading I do. While it's not everyday, I have a ton of video, photos, and graphic design work I am constantly uploading, for example, when I need to print new product catalogs. Each file is a few gigs and I can easily surpass their 30gb per day mark if I have to revise anything and re upload....which is just about everytime. Then there are massive amounts of raw photo files of the car/drivers we sponsor, events, etc. So far I haven't noticed any throttling but the letters are coming weekly so I probably should call and ask WTF?

[Samurai_Jerk]

How DARE you use what you paid for...

What are you ? A communist ?

It depends on whether or not there's anything in the fine print warning you to keep your usage under a certain level.

Also known as bullshit clause.

If usage is the amount transfered by billing period it's utter bullshit. And should be stated numerically.

If usage is the download speed it's also bullshit as it is a technical issue that should be managed at hardware level by the ISP, not the end user.

The letters are actually in English (damn offenders must all be gaijin eh?) and say something along the lines of they are "considering limiting my uploading data transfer" if I don't "check" or "lower the level" of uploading I do. While it's not everyday, I have a ton of video, photos, and graphic design work I am constantly uploading, for example, when I need to print new product catalogs. Each file is a few gigs and I can easily surpass their 30gb per day mark if I have to revise anything and re upload....which is just about everytime. Then there are massive amounts of raw photo files of the car/drivers we sponsor, events, etc. So far I haven't noticed any throttling but the letters are coming weekly so I probably should call and ask WTF?

I wonder if they have a more expensive business plan that they'll try to get you to upgrade to.

[Wage Slave]

So far I haven't noticed any throttling but the letters are coming weekly so I probably should call and ask WTF?

And they will probably say, "Mr Matsuki, your contract with us for internet services is, and is priced as, a home internet service. That is, it is for normal domestic and social use. The amount of data you are uploading and downloading is not consistent with that. Rather it suggests you are using the internet service for business purposes. That being the case we feel you should have a service contract that reflects, and is priced to reflect, that fact."

I might not completely agree with them but you have to admit they have a point ......The more capacity you are using up the less that is available for them to sign up new users and the sooner they have to build new capacity. That all costs money.

[matsuki]

So far I haven't noticed any throttling but the letters are coming weekly so I probably should call and ask WTF?

And they will probably say, "Mr Matsuki, your contract with us for internet services is, and is priced as, a home internet service. That is, it is for normal domestic and social use. The amount of data you are uploading and downloading is not consistent with that. Rather it suggests you are using the internet service for business purposes. That being the case we feel you should have a service contract that reflects, and is priced to reflect, that fact."

I might not completely agree with them but you have to admit they have a point ......The more capacity you are using up the less that is available for them to sign up new users and the sooner they have to build new capacity. That all costs money.

Here's the thing though....I told that to their agent how much I up/download to begin with and that's why I chose the plan I have. It's also not hard to imagine a larger family or residence with several people uploading/downloading more than me in a day..

[Wage Slave]

It's also not hard to imagine a larger family or residence with several people uploading/downloading more than me in a day..

Really?

I have a ton of video, photos, and graphic design work I am constantly uploading, for example, when I need to print new product catalogs. Each file is a few gigs and I can easily surpass their 30gb per day mark if I have to revise anything and re upload....which is just about everytime. Then there are massive amounts of raw photo files of the car/drivers we sponsor, events, etc.

I do actually sympathise with you on this one as I think the telecoms companies are not being fair or transparent about their services and pricing. I also agree that they are overpricing data services. But if I may offer a piece of advice - Never represent or advise yourself in any dispute in which law is involved. Always pay for a lawyer - at least to advise.

[Coligny]

If your contract say : max 30G upload and you use more... STFU and upgrade your subscription.

I might not completely agree with them but you have to admit they have a point ......The more capacity you are using up the less that is available for them to sign up new users and the sooner they have to build new capacity. That all costs money.

The don't build, they rent bandwith to an operator having direct POP with the net. If their users need more BW than their contract allows they are overselling.

You rent a line between your house and the ISP office. The ISP usually just buy bandwith to bulk operator most certainly NTT. And They plug you to the internet through the undersea cables leaving from the Big T, Shima or Tokyo.

[kurogane]

I might not completely agree with them but you have to admit they have a point .......

That would only be true if he were in fact using his internet service to perform commercial functions..........
(IOW: does he want to admit that what he is doing is effectively fraudulent or at least improper use given what he contracted for)

Nice points about the opaque BS and outright lies of most providers, though. It amazes me that they still think that Obvious BS still baffles brains, but since they have a captive audience maybe they just don't care?

[Wage Slave]

If your contract say : max 30G upload and you use more... STFU and upgrade your subscription.

I might not completely agree with them but you have to admit they have a point ......The more capacity you are using up the less that is available for them to sign up new users and the sooner they have to build new capacity. That all costs money.

The don't build, they rent bandwith to an operator having direct POP with the net. If their users need more BW than their contract allows they are overselling.

You rent a line between your house and the ISP office. The ISP usually just buy bandwith to bulk operator most certainly NTT. And They plug you to the internet through the undersea cables leaving from the Big T, Shima or Tokyo.

Yes - thanks, I'm sure that is exactly right. So they don't have to build new capacity at all. They do however have to rent extra capacity if some users are using more than they contracted for. Or face the wrath of consumers who can't get what they contracted for because peers are using more than their allocation.

It's overselling if they can't keep all their customers happy up to the contracted limit. In a way I suppose they are overselling because if every single customer tried to use 30Gb a day they wouldn't be able to supply it. However, that will never happen so they have to gauge what actual peak demand is likely to be and make sure they can meet that.

What's the betting that they set that number as low as they can possibly get away with? So yeah - they probably are all overselling.

[Coligny]

Depends what they mean by commercial use.
If I buy a blowup doll and sell used panties on ebay is it commercial ?
Usually commercial use on the internet sense of the term mean hosting commercial website. Not sending work emails no matter how big they are. He is not directly making money from his internet access but "also" using it for his work.
Few things differ for commercial/more often professionnal internet use. Strick bandwith and data cap. But also higher grade 24/7 support and guarantee of availability.

[Wage Slave]

By the way, I was surprised to learn that an undersea cable between London and Bombay (and on to Saudi Arabia) was laid and commissioned as long ago as 1863.

[matsuki]

It's also not hard to imagine a larger family or residence with several people uploading/downloading more than me in a day..

Really?

Streaming anything really racks up the gigs. Google earth/maps in satellite view also. If you figure PC's plus all the wifi-connected tablets and phones, Skype, LINE....yeah, and we're just getting started.

[J.A.F.O]

Man, this thread turned out to very informative. Anyways they don't like my illicit downloading habbits... (I wanna watch movies in English you ISP mother fuckers) while quazi legal makes me just wanna go ahead and get a VPN again. Not that I really care how many letters they send me, but it's freaking out the wife.

[Coligny]

They complain about content or traffic volumes?

[wagyl]

As a perhaps totally irrelevant datapoint, my mid-twenties niece and her boyfriend (the sinful little minx) took over what used to be my mother's internet account, and I still have the password and checked on their usage. Where they are, ISP's sell by volume (up and down combined) not by speed. They netflix to buggery and are a lot heavier internet users than my mother ever was: I suspect that some of their viewing entertainment involves some upload traffic, if you know what I mean. All that said, they don't seem to exceed 350 GB a month.

[J.A.F.O]

They complain about content or traffic volumes?

Content, I guess I can understand the stuff that's still in theaters but some of what I grab has been out for years.

[Mike Oxlong]

They complain about content or traffic volumes?

Content, I guess I can understand the stuff that's still in theaters but some of what I grab has been out for years.

You are depriving Tsutaya and Geo of their kamisama given right to an outdated business model.

[Coligny]

Never had this kind of shit from asahi.net.

But would not stick with a provider who put his nose that deep in my traffic.

[Samurai_Jerk]

Never had this kind of shit from asahi.net.

But would not stick with a provider who put his nose that deep in my traffic.

Did the government ever get around to requiring ISP's to keep records of internet usage and look out for suspicious behavior? I remember there was a proposal of some sort a couple of years ago. Maybe the government is starting to put pressure on them.

[Coligny]

Or Netflix, hulu and youtube HD are starting to scare isp who were used to customers paying for fiber speed but using at best twitter...
The issues of limited unlimited data subscription is nothing new... And there will always be people to defend isp for basically comitting fraud. Can't sell unlimited, good, then don't write that word on the contract, as simple as that...

[Samurai_Jerk]

Or Netflix, hulu and youtube HD are starting to scare isp who were used to customers paying for fiber speed but using at best twitter...
The issues of limited unlimited data subscription is nothing new... And there will always be people to defend isp for basically comitting fraud. Can't sell unlimited, good, then don't write that word on the contract, as simple as that...

I was thinking more about them spying on JAFO's content than the volume issue matsuki mentioned but, yeah, that's probably what's going on with that. I'm sure there's some weasel clause buried in the fine print though that let's them escape any claims of fraud.

[Russell]

Or Netflix, hulu and youtube HD are starting to scare isp who were used to customers paying for fiber speed but using at best twitter...
The issues of limited unlimited data subscription is nothing new... And there will always be people to defend isp for basically comitting fraud. Can't sell unlimited, good, then don't write that word on the contract, as simple as that...

I was thinking more about them spying on JAFO's content than the volume issue matsuki mentioned but, yeah, that's probably what's going on with that. I'm sure there's some weasel clause buried in the fine print though that let's them escape any claims of fraud.

The problem may be that ISPs are held accountable for breaches of copyright by their customers.

[Coligny]

Safe harbour ?