Deporting someone to a country doesn't exist

[Samurai_Jerk]

This is a question that I don't think anyone here has an answer to and there's a chance no one has an answer because I don't know if there's been a precedent setting case or not.

Anyway, I always thought that Zainichi Korean special permanent residents were citizens of either North or South Korea but a Zainichi friend of mine who is now a naturalized Japanese set me straight last year. He said that he was still considered a citizen of *Joseon (Chosen) before naturalization and used a special travel document in lieu of a passport, which he still has and showed to me, when he went abroad. Apparently SPR's can be deported for certain crimes.

Question: Where would Japan deport a citizen of Joseon to if they decided it was necessary?

* I'm not talking about Kita Chosen FTR.

[matsuki]

Maybe the Kitachosen KB's at Narita can help?

[wagyl]

After WWII, but before the division of the Korean peninsula into north and south, when ethnic Koreans in Japan were stripped of Japanese nationality, they were recorded as citizens of Joseon. After partition, the South petitioned MacArthur to allow registration to be changed to South Korea, but that change of registration was voluntary. As you are aware, most of the people still on Chosen-seki are North Korean related, but since it was a voluntary re-registration, there are, evidently, some South Korean related people still registered as Chosen.

While South Korea has ruled that they can refuse entry to Chosen registered people, I don't think it is automatic. Wikipedia is all over the place on that one, but then, we are talking about Korean affairs and reporting is less than robust.

If the individual chooses, he can apply to have his registration changed to Kankoku, and he then has a place with cheap leather goods available for sale to be deported to.

Expelling the stateless is possible. but it is only performed by heartless nations, and is usually more bureaucratic effort than it is worth, with a low success rate. But by God it teaches them a lesson.

[Takechanpoo]

since post ww2 z-korean squatters have kept occupied the river terrace in kawasaki city.
https://www.google.co.jp/maps/place/%E3 ... c944?hl=ja

20140325043837163.jpg

according to the word of mouth of the neighbors, the local administration is paying them eviction fee(30-40 million yen) for leaving the place and those zainich squatters are moving to the near-by highrise condo for free.
http://deepannai.info/kawasaki-tote-4chome-barrack/

why the fuck on earth is such an unfairness allowed? huh?
and you damn gaijin fuckers dont believe this kind of things and regard it as ridiculous because no authorized medias, especially english ones, havent reported it? eh?
i cannot help but think recent anti-koreanizm seen among j-nationals is valid to some extent.

[wagyl]

according to the word of mouth of the neighbors, the local administration is paying them eviction fee(30-40 million yen) for leaving the place and those zainich squatters are moving to the near-by highrise condo for free.

why the fuck on earth is such an unfairness allowed? huh?

You ask why the unfair situation where neighbours can gossip about a situation without the need to have evidence to back them up is allowed.
Shocking, isn't it.

However, if your reports are true, then the occupants have been there for over 70 years without effective steps taken to evict them. This amply exceeds the twenty year period required to obtain property rights by acquisitive prescription. By law, the land is theirs. This is so, whatever their nationality. Japanese also squat. Go just downstream, on the other bank, around Route 15 (the old Tokaido) for a blue sheet city of homeless, so well established that they have pets.

[Takechanpoo]

those homeless guys cardboard boxes along the street will not be regarded as the state of residence forever.
you dude wanna take sides with those z-squatters so much? ok good.
it seems like only legal satisfaction is enough for you to support them. nice. i really think so.

[wagyl]

I am refreshed to know that you really think it is nice that everyone has the same recognition and rights under law.

If someone ate your bento every day at school without you saying anything about it, it is tantamount to you saying "my bento belongs to you." So it is for land after a period of twenty years without steps taken to evict.

[matsuki]

Hey Take, I am sooo going to squat on all the forest land near the stuff I already own. I know it goes against the SOP "nihon tochi ga nai ne" but in fact, I'm pretty sure I can take over most of the mountain this way...and there won't be any protest until I own the whole city. I hope I can capture that Russian village theme park too...

[Takechanpoo]

"its not only them but also others! yeah!"
but against you dudes personal wishes, its only them.
if ordinary japanese nationals did the same thing, the local authorities would have forcibly physically evicted them sooner or later.
but both the local authorities and the local ppl have deliberately ignored it until now because of their fear and a sense of guilt toward z-korean.
high degree of gangs, yakuzas and scary looking type of physical laborers in the areas(朝鮮部落 chousen buraku : korean hamlets) and until internet became widespread, most of japanese believed z-korean got kidnapped and forcibly took to this island but in reality most of them voluntarily came to japan of their own free will to get financial success.

z-mom "i was forced to move here in my 12 year old!"
z-son "there was no requisition by j-government at that time! there is clearly evidence left to show it"
z-mom "no no it was requisition!! my friend know it!"
z-son "bullshit!"
z-mom "my son does not have "ism"."

this is one of typical examples that authorization doesnt work properly because of social taboos.
ans its also one of so-called "在日特権(special right of z-korean)".

[wagyl]

Let's look at that argument.

You say that the authorities neglected to enforce their rights because they were afraid to do so, and because they felt guilt.

If that is so, then they deserve to lose those rights, and they have lost them.

The steps necessary to reset the twenty year clock on acquisitive prescription are trivial. A registered letter with confirmed contents and confirmed receipt delivered 19 years and 364 days after the squatters arrived on the land will give you another 20 years. The Post Office has procedures set up to confirm content and confirm receipt, and will do the delivery for you. If you aren't prepared to take that step, then you do not deserve to complain when the squatter gains possession.

What is in your bento box today, Take?

[Samurai_Jerk]

I'm with wagyl. I'm not a big fan of giving squatters property rights but if you can't even get it together to send a letter within the 20 year time limit , you really should STFU.

I do find it believable that individuals may have been afraid of the ZK's but not the Japanese government. And regardless of the details of how they got here there's no denying they were treated like shit by Japan, so people should feel some sense of national guilt.

[Wage Slave]

Yes. Just looking at the neighborhood it hardly looks well off - to say the least. Really, Japan should look at himself/herself in the mirror and ask a few questions about social exclusion and policies to combat that and promote inclusion. As far as they land goes, they have earned rights without question. And as for Pocohontas's plan - I assume you actually have to live, more or less unchallenged, on the land for 20 years.

As Tacky obviously lacks the first inkling of such advanced European concepts as a responsibility to eradicate social exclusion as a matter of principle here's a little primer:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_exclusion

[Takechanpoo]

Let's look at that argument.

You say that the authorities neglected to enforce their rights because they were afraid to do so, and because they felt guilt.

If that is so, then they deserve to lose those rights, and they have lost them.

you mixed up collective rationality and personal rationality.
from the viewpoint of collective rationality, you are right. but from the viewpoint of personal rationality or respective ordinary japanese nationals, its nothing but ridiculously an unfair. most of ordinary j-nationals set a long-term-like-Nile-River loan to buy shabby propety and pay back it from their cheap salary while steadily slashing spending.

and in fact the local authorities, especially the local governmental officials, have been fearful of z-koreans.
or they are a principle of letting sleeping dogs lie(事なかれ主義).

you really should STFU

watch your stinky mouth and breath

[matsuki]

And as for Pocohontas's plan - I assume you actually have to live, more or less unchallenged, on the land for 20 years.

From what I understand, just having a building on the land and it going unchallenged for 20 years is good enough.

[Wage Slave]

And as for Pocohontas's plan - I assume you actually have to live, more or less unchallenged, on the land for 20 years.

From what I understand, just having a building on the land and it going unchallenged for 20 years is good enough.

Wagyl heeeeeeelp! A question of law.

I would guess that the land the shantytown was on was owned by the local government or highways agency or someone public and they made a decision to let it slide as there were children and oldies and such involved. Private owners and companies tend to be a bit more vigilant and heartless in their response. Especially when someone is just trying it on.

Anyway, given the pace of your current building project and the likelihood that someone does notice and just reclaims their rightful property, I can't see it as much of a goer. 20 years is rather a long time to say the least.

[Coligny]

I don't think it's long especially in the sticks. There is an empty house behind the clinic that face a main road to the station (3 minutes by car with no red lights). No activity for the 10 years i was there and certainly none either the years before.
We sooo should have takeover...

[Wage Slave]

I don't think it's long especially in the sticks. There is an empty house behind the clinic that face a main road to the station (3 minutes by car with no red lights). No activity for the 10 years i was there and certainly none either the years before.
We sooo should have takeover...

Yeah, but that's benign neglect. Try and build something or live in it or grow something on it and watch someone appear out of the woodwork at some point in the next 20 years.

[matsuki]

I think the land is owned by the city. The last document I have on it says it was owned by a mining co that no longer is in the area, if it even still exists....but the local kanrinin/manager type dude I know said he was hired to keep the drains on in clear...and I've seen him rent an excavator and clear a path to the drains and debris from them...the rest of the land is basically neglected. (and I own the mountain behind it.....so unless the city had someone motivated enough to come out and check the property lines...which already seem to be a clusterfuck....I doubt anyone there will be any resistance)

That being said, I wouldn't waste any time/money building a home on it as much as just planting something like a mobile-ish storage/tool shed or whatnot on it to stake my claim. Maybe let the goats at it and then seed it for my own personal soccer pitch? Easy enough to flood and make it in to an ice rink come winter!

[Wage Slave]

Don't give up the day job.

[Samurai_Jerk]

watch your stinky mouth and breath

Must be all the washoku I eat.

[yanpa]

Don't give up the day job.

I'd pay to see ice-skating goats. Not much, but I'd pay.

[Coligny]

Don't give up the day job.

I'd pay to see ice-skating goats. Not much, but I'd pay.

You need to pm Greji for that...