Full time Japanese Study

[Hound]

Hey all,

thought id try this site for some feedback. Ive been in Japan about 2 years now and my Japanese isnt going as good as I hoped so im going to chuck my job in and study full time at a college. Most courses I have found have been basically the same in curriculum and timetable (mon-fri 5 hrs per day) But i wanted to know if anyone had any specific advice.

Has anyone here studied full time Japanese? If so:

1) Any recommendations for schools?

2) How effective was the course and were the teachers fairly proactive?

3) Were there any hurdles from changing from a Humanities Visa to a student visa? Is it even necessary?

4) Im also wondering if there are any advantages to either leaving tokyo and studying somewhere else, or if its better to stay in tokyo?

Any general thoughts or opinions greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Cheers
Hound

[gomichild]

I studied full time for about 4-5 months. I went to the Kichijoji Language school. The teachers there were fabulous - friendly and strict enough to keep you on your toes a little. THe curriculum was ok - the books are boring (all books anywhere are boring) but they tried to make it more interesting by doing something different everyday. Lots of talking too. I would reccomend them to anyone in a second.

I didn't have hassles changing from Humanities to student visa - you get more hassle trying to go back the other way. Make sure you have a game plan.

[Dransyth]

Studied full-time for 15 months. Posted this topic recently on the YD forums to someone who had a similar question.

Not sure where you're located currently, or if you're willing to relocate, but for a central Tokyo school (Shinjuku), KCP is a good choice. There are English-speaking westerners (usually 15 or so in the fall and only a handfull the rest of the year) that go there due to its relations with some American universities, but not so many that you can't avoid them if you want to avoid speaking in English. I did that, but not intentionally. I had -erm- other reasons.

You can arrange for transfer credit to the states if you apply through a university - I got 38.75 credits out of nine months - but that route is more expensive.

The teachers are excellent and professional - all are highly-trained - and they demand a lot out of you. They really care about your progress and attendance (they always call you if you skip class, but I think that's a MOFA requirement), yet most of them are cool enough to let it slide if you get tired and miss a day or two - which happens with everyone. Expect about 2-4 hours of study per day outside of class for class levels 3+. If you're like me, much of that will be spent on kanji: five per day with 3-5 readings per kanji, and you have to remember the other kanji that go with the readings - whether you have already learned them or not - so it's more like 10-12 per day at times. I always picked the grammar and vocab up quickly, so I never had to spend more than a few hours per week on that.

KCP also has a great visa sponsorship reputation with the government, and they're very helpful with that process. I believe very few KCP students are denied visas. There are standard 6 levels of courses, but they will create further curriculums for you if you are beyond 6th (roughly JLPT 1). Class is three hours per day, five days per week, morning or afternoon (your choice after level 2). The location is so-so. About a 20min walk from Shinjuku's east, south, or new south exit. Or, you can take the subway and it puts you out right behind the school. I'm a cheap bastard, so I walked Even on rainy days I just used the Metro Promenade, which takes you underground almost the entire way there.

20-30 students per class. You'll usually be the only native English-speaker, with the rest Korean and Chinese (with the occassional fellow from Sri Lanka or Brazil).

There probably are, however, cheaper schools out there. I paid about $2000 per semester, two at a time for visa requirements (I stayed 5 semesters total, three months per semester). They also have short-term semesters, but you can't get a visa with those.

I basically went there for the college credit. Otherwise, I would have chosen a school closer to where I stayed in Urawa. However, Shinjuku is a fun place, and Kabuki-cho needs no explanation. I just would have liked a shorter commute. Most students live only one or two stations away, but I lived with friends who charged me peanuts for rent.

I would do it again.

If you want more info, lemme know.

-Dransyth (Shadrin on YD)

[Andocrates]

It depends on what you need. I like http://www.yamasa.org/index.html because it has housing. The teaching material . . . I'm not sure if it's good or not . . . but the pace is so fast you will have trouble keeping up.

[Taro Toporific]

...
KCP also has a great visa sponsorship reputation with the government, and they're very helpful with that process. I believe very few KCP students are denied visas. ...
20-30 students per class. You'll usually be the only native English-speaker, with the rest Korean and Chinese (with the occassional fellow from Sri Lanka or Brazil).

Dransyth and Andocrates are spot on with the key points you need to know (and know about yourself).
That is:
1) Always find out the visa sponsorship reputation of the school because some (if not most) are in the doghouse for being visa scams.
2) Are you hardcore kickass language learner who has always been at the top of your class back home?
Err, umm, I ain't and I found it impossible to keep up in a class of all Chinese kids in Shinjuku. Those hungry kids unloaded a can kanji whoopass on me every day.

PS: Damn fine 1st post Dransyth!

[Andocrates]

...
KCP also has a great visa sponsorship reputation with the government, and they're very helpful with that process. I believe very few KCP students are denied visas. ...
20-30 students per class. You'll usually be the only native English-speaker, with the rest Korean and Chinese (with the occassional fellow from Sri Lanka or Brazil).

Dransyth and Andocrates are spot on with the key points you need to know (and know about yourself).
That is:
1) Always find out the visa sponsorship reputation of the school because some (if not most) are in the doghouse for being visa scams.
2) Are you hardcore kickass language learner who has always been at the top of your class back home?
Err, umm, I ain't and I found it impossible to keep up in a class of all Chinese kids in Shinjuku. Those hungry kids unloaded a can kanji whoopass on me every day.

PS: Damn fine 1st post Dransyth!

That's another good thing about Yamasa. Most of the students are AmericanEuropean so the Chinese' kanji advantage is limited. (it still pisses me off though)

[hakuman]

Hey Hound, I have been thinking that I would like to quit and go to school full time myself. Unfortunatly, I dont know how I could support myself while I am doing it. How are you planning to do it? Do you have lots of savings?

For anyone else who has done it, how did you do it?

[Hound]

Thanks all for the feed back. Gomigirl, Ive also heard that Kichjoji good reputation. Did you find that there was a good core of serious full time learners? What I mean by this is that I tend to do better when there is a bit of a competitive pace present. I know Kichijoji also promotes alot of casual courses simular to big eikaiwa. I have been thinking about courses that are university affiliates to try and get a real school/student feel. Thanks heaps.

Shadrin/ Dransyth, Thanks for the info also. KCP? Ive never heard of that place but ill look it up. Also ill check for your YD post also.

Hakuman, Im basically paying my course and rent up front so that my monthly expenses are kept down. This is from the savings ive built up. I also am a car exporter, so ill continue this on a part time basis while I study.

However I have been told that berlitz pays quite well for part time teachers. My friend started working at berlitz and was paid 170,000yen per month for working 2 evenings a week and all day saturday. That will be my bread and butter money....literally! That said, I have also been told that they are quite selective of teachers, and also they can terminate your contract if they are low on students, so its not 100% secure (there again, what job is?)

Andocrates, regarding visas, I have a 2 years of a 3 year Humanities visa left, so a visa per se is not an issue. However Do you mean that i should stay away from schools that dont offer visas, because there governmental reputation might be low, so their quality might be low?

Do I NEED to change to a student visa at most places? or can I study full time on a Humanities visa?

Cheers, again really helpful all!

Hound

[jingai]

[Dransyth]

If you maintain a full-time job that requires your current visa status, then no, I don't think you have to change your visa. But, if you switch to going to school full-time and not working or working only part-time, then you may need to change your visa. KCP will likely check, as they are pretty strict on visa issues.

At KCP, morning class is 9am until 12:15pm. If you work at a nearby eikaiwa, say Nova for instance, you can probably swing working full-time. Good luck on your tests, though

I worked part-time and found that it was more than enough to live on. At 2000 yen per 50-minute class, with all the classes I wanted (anywhere from 10 to 20 per week) at an eikaiwa in Saitama City, I had enough money to pay tuition, rent, eat out often, and go on dates every weekend with my gf. I also managed to do a bit of traveling. Also helps if you can get a college friend to sign up to a keitai college discount plan for you, and purchase your Suica at the student price. I know that option isn't available for most people.

Oh, and follow the guidelines on working part-time. No dimly-lighted areas, no bars, don't work in Kabuki-cho (not a rule, but my suggestion if you want to keep the cops off your back), and I also think karaoke boxes are off-limits for some strange reason. Though I may be wrong. The part-time work rules really suck... I knew a few bouncers, though.

We have the katakana advantage!! It's quite nice, actually. With 60% Chinese and 35% Korean classrooms, your katakana skills are rare and seem more impressive. Even the Japanese teachers often asked me where the words came from, and I would explain the origin. You'll also be surprised at how many mistakes the Chinese students make on kanji. It's usually something small, such as a line that appears in the Chinese version but not in the Japanese version, etc.

In my experience, the Koreans were the overall top performers in kanji, grammar, and vocab. The Westerners were the top performers on speaking and pronunciation (dunno why that is). The Chinese students were all over the spectrum, generally having the worst pronunciation, yet the best reading comprehension because though they may not be able to READ a certain kanji, they know what it means. And if you'll allow me to toot my own horn, I whooped the asses of all my classmates on speaking, grammar, and vocab. I may not have had the best grades ('A' average but not the top 'A'), but I was recognized among the students as being the best speaker and listener. My reading and writing, though, to this very day, is quite weak. I attribute this to chattin' it up with Japanese friends and not spending enough time with the books.

The moral of the story is that a native English-speaker can compete with the Chinese and Koreans (I aced every kanji test that I actually studied for, and almost all of the grammar, vocab, and listening tests), if you immerse yourself. I do trend towards a top 10% student in college, but I don't possess an astronomically high IQ (that I know of... never been tested). Just gotta hit the books before the books hit you... and damn those teachers can throw!

Thanks for the compliment, Taro. I'll try to post more like it.

Take care, all.
-Dransyth